How many duty hours did you actually do at EK in 2013?

[Kamelchaser]

Just added up my hours for 2013....and the results surprised me.

Adding flying, sim duties, and all the non-credit hours such as RTGS, PPC, CRM, SEP, my total was almost 1,100 hours.

What a slippery slope we're on....we used to get paid for everything within 76 hours a month. Then the goalposts moved to 92 hours, but at least we got "roster credit" for those non-paid duties such as leave and CRM/SEP/PPC within the 92 hours. Now the non-paid duties get plonked on top of the 92 hours..recently I've done a couple of 110 hour months with 92 hours pay credit.

3 weeks leave in a month generally means 40+ hours in the week you are at work. I'm just waiting for the decree that office managers have to do one 80 hour week when they have 3 weeks leave.

And they're wondering why so many people are leaving or planning to leave?

[ManaAdaSystem]

How many block hours did you actually do?

[pitonga]

Total block HRS 2013:

656

FO Afro-Indian Fleet

[vfenext]

Kamelchaser, don't forget to add the hours you spent in Spinneys and of course driving on the SZR, oh and don't forget queueing for the cinema. It's an absolute outrage I tell ya! Down with ....eh...management, yeah management!

[fatbus]

How many block hours does LCC pilots do in Europe doing 5/5 and4/4 4 sector days compared to their actual flying hours and what is their pay based on . Also do they get paid credit for sim and other ground school events. Uk based LCC, what are you leaving home to ensure you arrive at the airport in time?

[vfenext]

The best you can do with a n EU LCC is 5/3.

[Kamelchaser]

A touch off topic and random vfenext?....SEP, CRM, PPC blah blah blah = work and all counting towards fatigue.

Spinnies and driving on SZR doesn't have much to do with it unless I missed something?

[what_goes_up]

A touch off topic and random vfenext?....SEP, CRM, PPC blah blah blah = work and all counting towards fatigue.

Spinnies and driving on SZR doesn't have much to do with it unless I missed something?
All you missed is, VFE was pulling your leg... :)
That is where the industry goes. Even so called flag carriers/majors do the same. If you find a better place, move on and let me know (PM ;) )

[LHR Rain]

The pilots are leaving and one can surmise that the company is a little worried.
Almost 150 pilots left in 2013 with about 75 pilot resignations in at the present time.
Our only hope is that more Ryan Air pilots don't come but they think EK is a good job. They probably think this way because they paid for their training.

[PPRuNeUser0215]

Almost 150 pilots left in 2013 with about 75 pilot resignations in at the present time
Well in two years + here I have not moved by more that 110 places.
That means according to you that 110 have left ahead of me and 40 behind me.
In the meantime however the company has grown from the time I joined, by 800+ or so pilots.

Can't see why EK would be worried. Not all were Ryanair I m sure.

[Xulu]

I've done approaching 1400 duty hours in the last year for a LCC in EU on a fixed roster pattern. So SEP and Sims etc take away from a flying duty rather than in addition.

This has been a very slow year! <750 block, 350 sectors.

All we hear is complaints of 90+ hrs a month! Would be nice to know what in reality you guys are doing a year.

[theidler]

Calendar year 2012 - 934 block hours.

Calendar year 2013 - 886 block hours.

My lesser hours in 2013 is a consequence of a policy quietly introduced sometime in 2013 of not paying any overtime (productivity). Rosters are manipulated to ensure that the productivity threshold of 92 hours/31 days is not exceeded. The consequence of this is rosters that have little resemblance to what is bid for i.e. going east when bidding for west and so on...

[Trader]

2013- 837 block hours (including a period of weeks off due to sickness)

- 1114 duty hours, which includes sim but NOT ground school, nor RESERVE, ground school or any other days.

So LCC hours but with ULR, time zones and almost a third of the time at night.


PS. gotta love Logten Pro :)

[BigGeordie]

841 Block hours in 2013.

[ruserious]

Calendar year 2012 - 804 block hours, 104 sectors

Calendar year 2013 - 755 block hours, 90 sectors

Super rosters ;)

[gardenshed]

You want to do overtime on top of a 92 hour fatiguing roster. :rolleyes:

[Lord Spandex Masher]

1150 duty hours, which includes everything except days off.

410 block hours. 180 sectors, 90 days actually flying. 1 standby call out. Zero roster changes.

Oh yeah, UK LCC, full time. ;)

[Yorkshire_Pudding]

410 block hours and 1,100 duty hours.
Europe charter/scheduled Boeing.

But then I did take 5 months paid winter leave which is offered every year. Almost half the pay of ME carriers and no where near the same sunshine mind.

[BigGeordie]

Garden shed, it is a given that we will be flying 90 hours every month but it would be nice if now and again we could do an extra one or two hours a month and get some overtime for it. We are getting all of the disadvantages of being rostered to the overtime limit but none of the benefits.

The rigidity of the overtime limit makes swapping almost impossible as everybody is right up to max hours and the company will not allow even one minute of overtime. Last month I tried to do a swap which would have added 20 minutes to my rostered block hours. Refused as it would have given me 10 minutes of overtime. This month I have a huge 5 minutes spare!

[scandistralian]

It'd be nice if the option were there for pilots to waive overtime payment when they are performing a mutual swap, for the sake of losing 30 minutes overtime, I would rather the mutually beneficial roster.

I think these rumours of a mass of people leaving EK and the company being concerned are completely false, during recurrent groundschool recently HR stated that attrition is stable and as AMEX said, seniority movements also reflect this.

[BigGeordie]

I can't see a mass of people leaving either, but retention is only one side of the HR coin, the other is recruitment. If other airlines in the region start offering commuter friendly rosters it will be interesting to see if EK is forced to react or if the brand is strong enough to keep the CV pile topped up anyway.

[Dropp the Pilot]

Overtime? Reach for a sharp pencil - after a few deductions the company dumps 70,000 dirhams into my bank account every month. If I earned that by flying 92 hours I was paid 760 dirhams per hour. If I stray above 92 hours I will get paid 600 dirhams for each additional hour, offering my services at a special 20% discount over my normal rate.

I'll get back to you on that attractive offer…..

[TineeTim]

The one thing to remember is that those that are leaving now (and there definitely are some) started thinking about it and looking 12 months ago. They started seriously looking and making plans 6-9 months ago. I know it would take me that long just to get my logbook sorted. You anal retentive, smug, Logten Pro geeks worry me :O

We're a slow moving, conservative lot by nature. But, as someone else wrote, once we start looking....... Many/most of the guys I fly with are actively looking.

[CaptainChipotle]

dannnng, 70,000 dirhams every month!! "I'll have what he's having…"

Thats nowhere near what I get.

[fatbus]

Top level Capt plus TRE and flying pay I'm guessing would be close to 70k.

[Wizofoz]

Medium seniority TRE taking the Housing Allowence would get 70k

[donpizmeov]

Anyone who wants productivity pay has rocks in their head. It was Aed 460 for a Captain in the 90s when a 1st yr Capts salary was circa Aed 20000, and you got it after 84 hrs, with credit given for leave, SIMs, RSV etc etc.
Its Aed 600 now after 92hrs, with no credit for anything other than block time (well ok, SIM if your a trainer or Support) and the Capt basic is circa Aed 35000. I am with Drop on this one. I don't work extra for less money.


Do not say you will waive the payment for a trip you want, as suggested above. That will only help the slide down the slippery slope. Its only a job. If you need to dial two to roster adjust, do it for a nice trip, as it helps your roster, and is a bonus for the fella called out. A true win win.


The Don

[gardenshed]

donpizmeov

Amen to that.

Totally agree.

[Praise Jebus]

Is it possible for the clever log ten pro guys to work out what their duty hours average per day at work, non trainer? Agree with Don, it's not overtime it's undertime...

[fly82]

I´m sorry to be the reality check! but I work for an "legacy" carrier in europe and in 2013 I did 700ish block hours and around 1530 hours of duty time.note that I don´t get paid for any duty time, I discount almost a total of 52% to taxes and social security(although im pretty sure that when the times comes for me to retire there´s no money, or they reduced it so much I won´t be able to live..). I have a general schedule of 5 on 2 off and do normally a split service per week combined with other rotation that require me to get up at 3:30 in the morning and fly for 10 block hours, with only minimum rest of 12 hours before..so it sounds almost outlandish for me what you are describing, knowing that you get paid very well, get housing, get free cleaning of your uniform, get a limo service to and from the airport, get a big saving acount for when your older, and even get discounts at most of the places in dubai..

[CaptainChipotle]

Emirates is a good airline, however, it could be a GREAT airline.

700 hours a year and you are not changing that many time zones, not that many night flights.

try 800-900 hrs/yr and hitting every time zone. I was rostered for a far east flight, followed by 3 days off and a ULR flight across the pole to the west coast.

Its easy to say we are complaining. EK is currently interviewing, so apply and let us know if we are really complaining after being here a few years.

Ek isn't bad, but it could be a lot better. Talk to those who have been around for 5-10 years, its nothing compared to what it was. I've flown with ONE guy in the last 6 months who was actually content here.

[Macrohard]

Calendar year 2013 - B777 Capt
Total hours - 747
Total sectors - 115
ULR sectors - 18

[BYMONEK]

Chipotle

What is it they say, 'behaviour breeds behaviour'? Funny that, in the last 6 months or so I've probably flown with only ONE person who wasn't happy in EK.

Which seat you're sat in may make a difference. The whingers are normally in the left! (unless you're American, then it doesn't matter which seat you're in!) :E

[White Knight]

I've flown with ONE guy in the last 6 months who was actually content here.

I seem to have the opposite experience. Maybe it's the super rosters heh? Makes a difference:D

[checcker10]

B777 Capt
894 hrs flown in the seat.
Too damn many and too tired to work out my duty
I'm off to bed .......