New here! Where to train for ppl

[Kevin31]

Hey all

My name is kev! New here but been reading forum alot so been lurking a while! Seems to be the most active forum for ppl around!

So looking to start ppl next year once cash is saved! Had a flying experience back in September at bournemouth flying club and loved it! Since then been back for learn to fly presentation which I'd read up on most so no the requirements and costs!

Have few questions to pose to you guys please?

First off where is best to do the ppl? Looking at bfc as liked the guys there also flying time aviation at shoreham as Imin portsmouth so will need to travel! Anyone here trained with them?

Secondly what best aircraft to learn in? Bfc seem to push you towards the robin and shoreham and most others say the pa28? My experience was in a da40 but seems they are dearer again!

Lastly (sox did only say a few) my main concern with the ppl is the theory! Never been great at studying and passing exams so wanted to no how much self study is needed per exam? Also is it true what they say if you have passed driving test you should be fine with the ppl?

Thanks for your help! Looking forward to spending more time on here! If I can pass the ppl will be mainly a hobby so not a career!

Cheers

Kev

[Ninja Controller]

Check out Phoenix Aviation based at Lee-on-Solent. Phoenix Aviation - Home (http://www.phoenixaviation.net/)

Friendly club atmosphere, some very good instructors and at very competitive rates.

Don't worry too much about the bookwork. With enough time and demonstrations you'll be able to get your head around it! The great thing about learning in a "club" environment is that there are usually plenty of knowledgeable people hanging around who would be more than happy to talk you through anything you struggle with.

Best of luck and enjoy your flying :)

[Jan Olieslagers]

Does your OS give bonus points for every hit of the "!" , or did you perhaps swap some keys on the keyboard?

[Ninja Controller]

Does your OS give bonus points for every hit of the "!" , or did you perhaps swap some keys on the keyboard?
Does belittling someone's posting style make you feel bigger and better about yourself? There's no need for that sort of comment.

[RTN11]

There is a search function at the top of the page, and I think there's a good thread somewhere comparing the PA28 and robin.

Whatever you learn in will have pros and cons. PA28 is very stable, easy to land and good for navigation, but has such a dosile stall it can teach bad habits, robin probably the opposite.

Never flown from any of the schools at Shoreham, but I would take a good look around each and see what fits. A posh club house isn't everything - try to take a look at the aircraft, see what their interior is like, how much nav kit they have. Ultimately, the actual learning bit is more down to how you get on with the instructor than anything, so any school could be perfect, but you want to see how it's all run.

The theory isn't that bad, there's 7 exams, all multiple guess, 75% to pass each one. You'll probably be presented with a stack of textbooks after your 1st lesson. The more time you spend reading them, the better you will understand the subject and the less money you will have to spend on flying lessons :}

[TractorBoy]

Does your OS give bonus points for every hit of the "!" , or did you perhaps swap some keys on the keyboard?

Oh the joy that is PPrune.

Kevin, you might want to saunter over to the Flyer forums. People tend to be a little less judgemental there.

[A and C]

There is no best aircraft to fly for the PPL but I would stay away from anything with lots of avionic kit, At the PPL stage you need to learn to fly and navigate using the minimum of external help so forget the GPS and fly with a map and stopwatch.

The happy thing about this is the aircraft so equiped are going to be the cheapest.

Once you have a firm grasp of the basics it wont take long to get to grips with the fancy avionic kit and if that kit should fail you will have no trouble reverting to basics.

I now await the wrath of the magenta line kindergarten.

[welliewanger]

A&C has a good point about fancy aeroplanes!
I've never flown the Robin, but used to instruct on the PA28 - it's an excellent training aircraft. To be honest I wouldn't get too worked up about which aircraft is best to learn in (just not something bonkers like a Pitts), they've all got pro's and con's.

As has already been pointed out, the instructors are key to your progression, I have seen people waste a lot of money on bad instructors. You need someone who you can gel with, you'll probably get an idea of the person during the ground breifing before you've even got into the aircraft. A good breifing will make it seem simple so when you get into the plane you're just going through the exercises and confirming and practicing what you have already learnt on the ground. The only thing you don't want in an instructor is a stress head. These people tend to explode when things go wrong and the situation just gets exacerbated. The best instructor I ever had would call people "dude" and really belonged on a surfboard!

Then there's the question of which airfield to go to. Some people love grass airfields, but as soon as it gets into winter (and sometimes in summer) the field gets waterlogged and nobody can fly. This is just another thing slowing your training and putting longer gaps between each lesson.
On the other hand, tarmac runways are generally more expensive. They also come with ATC and controlled airspace. This can be a mixed blessing since on one hand you're "flying with the big boys" so you've got to be sharp, but on the other hand it's a steeper learning curve. I've met people from grass strips who have licenses but daren't go to controlled airports because they are worried they'll get it wrong or it's too busy. This is a real shame.

And finally, on to the question of theory exams. The majority of the theory (except air law) is very practical. If you take a genuine interest in aviation and immerse yourself in it, asking as many questions as you can, then the exams won't be too difficult. Nothing worth doing is ever easy, but, assuming you've got a modicum of a scientific brain, you should be able to pass with a few hours of study. It is harder than the driving test, but be honest, that was a doddle!

[P-MONKE]

If you're going to try out at Lee-on-the-Solent, make sure that you pay a visit to Portsmouth Naval Gliding Club (PNGC (http://www.pngc.co.uk/)) and get at least one experience flight. You might just get hooked. Also, the theory requirements for flying a glider solo are much less than for a PPL. It's also a lot cheaper!

[Grob Queen]

Hi Kev,
Great to know that you want to "join the club".

Being a relative newbee to aviation myself, i'm afraid i can't help you much with your first two questions. Apart from i totally agree with ninja controller ref learning in a club environment, you can't beat talking to experienced pilots to help with the PPL. My friends at the Club give brilliant encouragement, share my exhillaration when tings go well and support when things...don't. Our club house is a 1925 Watch Office, full of character...the club atmosphere is a pleasure to be amongst and everyone was so welcoming straight away.

Personally I love learning on an RAF airfield; yes, its a steep learning curve with airfield procedures and strict, crisp RT but I believe this will make me a better pilot in the long run. I also fly the military oval circuits as a matter of course which seem easier than the rectangular ones.

Theory?? Yes, theres a lot of it! But as others have said, if you truly immerse yourself in aviation and have a real, overriding passion to get your PPL and will do anything to get it, then the theory is not so bad. i am not scientifically minded at all; however, even I am finding the physics and engineering stuff very interesting and even remembering things... Try Airquiz when you start, that gives practice papers and I am finding it a great help to test my progress.

Lastly, as I have said on this forum before...if you can find yourself a pilot mentor who is not your instructor or maybe not even someone from your club/school, who is an experienced pilot who can advise, share your success and console with your disasters, whom you trust and can ask any aviation question to, then that will be a great help. I have two extremely experienced good pilot friends and they are invaluable in my training.

Good to see more student pilots on the forum!! Go for it and enjoy it - nothing like the thrill of flying solo!

GQ

[Kevin31]

Hi All,

Well sorry for late reply but thabnk you to all that have psoted.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ( just for that one person who doesnt like them)

Been a hectic week so not had chance to post back. Any how been doing lots of reasearch into other places cause I think there is alot out there to look at. So Checking out Shoreham and Lee on solent (phoneix) at weekend as there quite close. Phoneix I must admit would be very hand less then 10 miles away and would alot less travelling time compared to BFC or Shoreham whcih would be an hour.

Anyone here looked at goodwood? Think going to take your guys advice on the plane front and not worry to much about that but more about the school and instructor!

As for the theory found a few more blogs from other people's learning and they have been quite useful although must concentrate more on there flying and not studying. One thing that is coinfusing is all these acrinims that I dont understand as yet but guess you pick them up as you learn!

Still bit worried on the theory but not enough to put me off as yet. Seems the PPL confuser is a good bet as an aid whilst studying. Many peoople here invested much time on ground school or is the main stream just self study?

Obvisouly budget depending but how many lessons a week do people recommend? I work full time and comute an hour a day each way so trying to gauge when to do what?

Kev

[riverrock83]

I'm also a PPL student (although in Prestwick...) :)
For most people theory is self study. Get the text books (a few options - I went for Pratt) and learn the material - don't just cram to pass the exams as almost all of it is practically useful in some shape or fashion. I haven't had any problems with the material - but I haven't taken any exams yet (it is up to the training organisation whether you need to take air law before you solo).

The more often you can have lessons the better, as you will forget things less and so need fewer revision lessons. Lessons are often not long, as certainly when doing circuits the workload is so high you will be brain dead after not much more than 30 mins! Weather is an issue in the UK, so the more flexibility you have the better (some people only seem to fly 1/2 of their booked lessons). In saying that though, I've had very few lessons as "wash outs" as my instructor has been able to find something to do not too far from the airfield that doesn't require no cloud. At this time of the year in Scotland, light is an issue as sunset is pretty early (so can't fly after work).

If you're learning in a club rather than a training organisation, you might get the opportunity to sit in the back of other's lessons. This can sometimes be as beneficial as paying for your own.

Aircraft wise, I'm learning in a Scottish Aviation Bulldog, but I started my training in a Bolkow Junior. I've also had a lesson in a PA28 Cherokee. Primarily you are learning to be a pilot, not an operator of a particular aircraft, so although they are three very different planes, I was able to move between them fairly easily (although it does mean I've had a few lessons which were just to get used to the new aircraft). As has been mentioned above, this shouldn't be your primary worry (although if an organisation has multiple of the same type it is an advantage as all planes need regular maintenance).


Enjoy!
(and in case you haven't read other threads - don't pay up front :ok:)

[foxmoth]

For Goodwood there are two clubs, Goodwood FC and Hampshire Aeroplane Club, Goodwood club is larger and more expensive, HAC is one aircraft, cheaper and more friendly. Great field to fly from - far better than Shoreham IMHO and not as busy.

[thing]

Personally I love learning on an RAF airfield; yes, its a steep learning curve with airfield procedures and strict, crisp RT but I believe this will make me a better pilot in the long run. I also fly the military oval circuits as a matter of course which seem easier than the rectangular ones.
Had one of your Bling Airs following me around the circuit the other day, he called "Is the civilian aircraft doing oval or square circuits?" which I thought was a bit cheeky. I wondered whether he had ever seen a hexagonal one. Don't know why they can't thrash the circuit at your place, they can be a pain in the butt up here. Perhaps they need the experience of a proper operational unit but then there's Cgy just down the road from you. I got off between a landing Astor and a C17 doing PAR's the other day which makes for interesting flying in your 100kt spammy.

Kev, whatever you do be it powered or gliding you will love it. No one would pay silly sums of money to punch holes in the sky if it wasn't worth doing.

[Grob Queen]

Kev,

Theory? As you will see from another student post which I have commented on, how you study I think (although I sit to be corrected) is based on personal preference. Some in that thread say Ground school every time and others (like me) are finding it fine with studying privately and asking any pilot who will care to listen about any problematical areas. Personally I have been told that the Confuser by Jeremy Pratt is no good. I have all his books and am using those, but swear by Airquiz as I said to test your knowledge. yep, theory is daunting but put it into bite sized chunks, concentrate on one area at a time and it will come. i also look at the CAA Safety Sense Leaflets and AICs, read around the subject (as my old Uni tutors used to say) ...but it works!!

As to aircraft. Our club has Grob 115s and a Slingsby Firefly. I am learning in both and have also had my first air experience flight (and did my two first landings) in a Chipmunk. So for me, as long as it has a low wing, i'm happy!

As to number of lessons a week, you really need at least one, but depending on your budget more than one if possible. Continuity is what you need more than anything else.....

Thing,
Bling Airs......flying with those boys is my introduction to flying with larger aircraft in our circuit (and the old Doms!) Perhaps they fly at your place, to play amongst the big boys with frisbees on their back. They do ccts at Cgy too (as I've flown in the jump seat of one doing such a practice). But maybe the QFIs get jumpy with students flying with the Typhoons... Wonder if I know your cheeky pilot....what a put down, hope you replied in kind! Were you flying Oval circuits?!

[thing]

I was doing squares, I think he was annoyed at the amount of time it was taking, mob boys like their ovals as it saves time (it does actually, I nearly always fly ovals at home, I just fancied doing squares that day) so I threw a glide circuit in as well just to really annoy him. :E

We've had your Firefly at ours this week, didn't get chance for a fling which is a shame as it's a wobbly prop as well. I fancy a go at the basic aeros actually.

[Grob Queen]

Well, Thing, you should join our club then, the Firefly needs to be flown!! ;) Shes a fantastic aircraft to fly though. I'm good mates with her owner and have done aeros in her a couple of times......:ok:

I always fly ovals, in fact i'll probably practice land aways at civvy airfields and still fly ovals...if my QFI lets me! And i'm taught to fly tight circuits as thats the military way too.

Kev, sorry to take it a bit off thread!! As you'll be at a civilian airfield we're probably totally confusing you with talk of oval circuits........

[GeeWhizz]

Kev, sorry to take it a bit off thread!! As you'll be at a civilian airfield we're probably totally confusing you with talk of oval circuits........


Thats a bit condescending; although clearly no offence intended.

I prefer oval circuits as the norm: quicker so can fit more into the measley hour or so. That said many (most?) civil flying schools will teach glides from an oval circuit but from normal circuit height. The military types tend to take an extra 500' for a glide practice.

As for exam prep and study, read the books (Trevor Thom) and do the practice questions in the back pages. A lot can be gleaned from these forums but see what agrees with the books and what makes sense to you. Sometimes the wealth of experience from some here is staggering, and advice will more than likely be a little more complicated and indepth than what the PPL exams require. If you are left in doubt ask your instructor.

[chris 68]

kevin sent you a pm
try old sarum, aero at3 lot cheaper than your pa28,s etc, good school good instructors good atmosphere

[thing]

Kevin, you might want to saunter over to the Flyer forums. People tend to be a little less judgemental there.

Thou surely jesteth. Spent about three days there, never again. At least people here are entertainingly awful to each other, you can usually get a laugh out of the most acerbic exchanges, especially when the forum fathers start having a go at each other. I was watching Frozen Planet the other night and there was a scene of Musk Ox head butting during the mating season and I thought of this place....:)

[Grob Queen]

Thats a bit condescending; although clearly no offence intended.

Absolutely right, no offence intended at all!! :( Apologies if it was, I did not mean to be. The only reason I said it was that as a student myself if others at the club start talking about something which is, lets say off the PPL syllabus over what should/shouldn't be done, as interesting as it is, thats stuff for post-PPL and makes life harder for the student. Yep, I know I don't have to listen, or try to understand, but sometimes you just can't help it!

[Kevin31]

Evening

Thanks all really appreciate the feedback! Just looked up the goodwood sites so might well swing in there on way back from shoreham.

Well forgot to mention I bought the first book from Trevor thorm so going to read that see how that settles with me on theory side. Been readin forum posts most days which helps.

Sounds like confuser is good to have can it still be bought? Will also look at the others.

Anyone else here around same stage as me looking at potential schools?

Kev

[Meldrew]

Hi Kev,
Re your comment on "If you can pass your driving test, you should be OK to pass the PPL."
I was rubbish at exams at school, passed my driving test on my second attempt!
Passed my PPL exams and GFT first time! I reckon that anyone can be beaten into passing their driving tests eventually, but to pass your PPL it can be done only if you really WANT to do it, then, its no problem.
Go for it!:

[Kevin31]

Hey all

Well been down to see couple of potential schools!

First off was Phoenix in Lee on Solent. Was a bit worried when I got there as just a porta cabin in the middle of the airfield with planes out side but guess that's the normal with smaller schools! Thinking bout it Bournemouth is similar just bigger cabins and cafe lol! Was impressed with phoenix by the time I left and a guy came in just after me to sign up! They don't want any money up front and they invoice you after you fly which sounds good! Only thing to pay is a monthly membership of £40 but seems reasonable.

Second stop was flying time aviation down at shoreham. Seems alot more proffeesional and alot bigger more planes and instructors. All of which were wearing the captain style uniforms! They didn't seem to organised guy who I met didn't no he was seeing me but he was good guy answered my questions and showed me the fleet of aircraft! He also advised not to pay upfront and pay as you go also warned me of some of the schools in the area and to do my research!

So feel i have achieved something although not planning to start to next year I want to get this all out of the way now so when I want to start I can! Still not to confident with the theory but everyone seems to say its do able. Correction on my earlier post it's Jeremy pratts book I have lol.

Where I'd best place to get the books and all the stuff I need to start like knee board, log book and bits? Looked at pooleys and flight store also eBay Phoenix recommended by bits as you need them but noticed you can buy the starter kits which has all all you need. Thoughts on this?

Cheers

Kev

[AlexDeltaCharlie]

Hi Kevin,

Re your question about purchasing equipment. I'm 3/4 of my way through my PPL and have so far been served just fine by my eBay headset, eBay flight computer, eBay plotter, etc. Obviously charts and flight guides are best purchased new as they're updated regularly, and a second hand logbook isn't going to be much use, but I have saved a fair bit on the cost of equipment, and the previous owners kept it all in good working order.

That said, for the first 20ish hours you most likely won't be needing much nav equipment, but for circuits and general handling a kneeboard is useful for writing down altimeter settings, taxi clearances and other information in flight. My advice would be to speak with your instructor and buy things as you need them rather than all right at the start. I bought all the books before my first real lesson, and most sat on the shelves for months until I needed them.

Enjoy your PPL and best of luck!

ADC

[GeeWhizz]

A checklist for the aeroplane is all that I had until first solo. Then bought myself a headset as a present for the achievement. With nav came the kneeboard, chart, stopwatch etc. I would suggest being one step a head of the flying on the equipment side. I think it sets a good base for learning if you turn up with everything you need for the lesson. Prior planning prevents...... But in good time.

I think the study books are useful from the beginning because as you can read from others, exams tend to creep up and potentially hinder progress. Have a chat with whichever instructor you fly with at the time, the books don't need to be bought in one foul swoop. Perhaps your instructor could recommend an order? Usually starting with (Trevor Thom) Book 1: Flying Training (the PPL studes bible), and Book 2: Air Law and Met... oh are they in the same book? ;)

[Kevin31]

Hi

Thnaks Guys big help. Might leave it then and buy it as I need it perhaps look at different places for the books.

On the ground school subject again has anyone here in the UK used this complany before for ground school training? The Great Circle - Home Page - The Great Circle (http://www.thegreatcircle.co.uk/)

Kev

[chris 68]

Kevin
I have them on my I phone and I pad then When ever I have a minute I give them a go, you still have to study the books though dont just learn the answers to the questions