Instructor hour for revalidation

[felixflyer]

Hi

I need to revalidate my SEP rating and have more than enough hours. However my hour with an instructor is causing me problems. I have FAA instruction time which I have been told doesnt count.

Am I able to use my MEP rating instruction time for the revalidation of my SEP rating?

[mad_jock]

Nope but you can use your MEP test though.

I use my Multi engine turbine type rating IR renewal as mine.

Although quite how wanging around the sky one one engine not seeing out the window does for your SEP skills I don't really know.

[felixflyer]

The problem is I am only half way through my MEP course and wont have my test before the date required. Looks like I will need to book an hour SE instruction.

Maybe time to do some aeros!

[mad_jock]

Seems like a very sensible plan

[172driver]

I have FAA instruction time which I have been told doesnt count.

Check into this.

[felixflyer]

I took it from Lasors which states:

The instructor must be authorised in accordance with
JAR-FCL to instruct for the JAR-FCL TMG or SEP(Land)
rating as appropriate.

I did my FAA flight review at a non JAR school in the USA.

[S-Works]

It says it in LASORS, but does it say it in JAR FCL....... The requirement is for a 1hr Instructional flight. JAR FCL does not say that it has to be a JAR Instructor that I can find.

[Whopity]

JAR-FCL 1.005(2) Whenever licences, ratings,
authorisations, approvals or certificates are
mentioned in JAR–FCL, these are meant to
be licences, ratings, authorisations, approvals
or certificates issued in accordance with
JAR–FCL. In all other cases these documents
are specified as e.g. ICAO or national
licences.

[BackPacker]

Looks like I will need to book an hour SE instruction.


If you want to revalidate by experience the minimum is indeed one hour with an instructor. But the other option is to revalidate by test with an examiner and there's no minimum duration for that. So if you are current you may well be able to pass the test in less than an hour and that may work out to be cheaper than the one-hour instruction flight.

[AdamFrisch]

Take it as an opportunity to learn something new or try stuff you've not done. It's over in a flash.

[S-Works]

With all due respect Whoppity that still does not say the 1hr Instructional flight has to be with a JAR Instructor.

As the content of the flight is merely to have received 1hr of Instruction of any kind, I don't see how we can argue that it has to be with a JAR Instructor?

It also does not have to be a JAR Instructor when training towards a JAR rating. Take the example of ICAO Instructors outside of the JAA area training for JAA licences and ratings. In the US as an example there are many FAA Instructors teaching towards JAA ratings not holding a JAA licence or Instructor rating.

Why should someone who for example has undertaken an FAA BFR which has a full safety orientated prescribed content and has flown for more than an hour as part of this not be credited for the training?

JAA Gold plating?

[BillieBob]

The requirement is to undergo a training flight with a FI(A), which is JAA terminology, the US equivalent being CFI or CFII. It is pretty clear to me at least that the intent is that this shall mean a JAA FI(A). Ultimately, of course, it is a matter of interpretation and, since JAR-FCL has no legal force in the UK beyond that granted under the ANO, it is only the CAA's interpretation that matters and there is no doubt, given the LASORS quote, what that interpretation is.

The matter of ICAO instructors training for JAA licences and ratings is a complete red herring as they have to be authorised in accordance with Appendix 1 to JAR-FCL 1.300, which restricts the privileges to instruction "to those parts of the ATP integrated course where the instructor can demonstrate the experience relevant to the intended training". Allowing the privileges to be extended to instruction on other courses was a decision taken unilaterally by the UK in the face of stiff opposition from some other JAA member states and is not compliant with JAR-FCL.

Part-FCL will allow a little more flexibility in this area. Rather than an authorisation, it allows for a FI certificate to be issued to the holder of an ICAO licence, thus conferring all of the privileges of an EU FI. The privileges may be exercised only in an ATO located outside the EU but, within that environment at least, the instructor would be able to conduct the 1hr flight for revalidation of an SEP rating. However, it will still not be acceptable for an instructor who does not hold an FI certificate issued in accordance with Part-FCL to provide that instruction.

[PH-UKU]

<The requirement is to undergo a training flight with a FI(A)....>

You can also include flight with a CRI (Class Rating Instructor). Means you could try an hours seaplane flying ..... and the landings are free :-D

[Genghis the Engineer]

Am I alone in just thinking this FAA.v.JAA issue is a daft question.

FAA and JAA requirements for that instructional flight are not the same, and there is no reason to expect an FAA instructor to be aware of JAA requirements (even though they are pretty minimal) or a JAA instructor of FAA requirements (which are rather less minimal).

Holding a JAA licence I'm clear than my biennial flight has to be with a JAR FI or CRI.

Holding a FAA licence I'm clear that my biennial flight has to be with an FAA CFI or CFII.

I can't honestly say that either of these things gives me a problem, nor with the fact that they are different flights (okay, if I could find somebody who is both an FI and a CFI then they could I'm sure be combined - and a few such do exist.)

It really is just how it is so far as I can see. Live with it!

G