Do any airlines NOT require an MCC?

[pete o'probe]

I had hoped that some larger airlines would be happy to accept pilots without MCC because their own training would include this certification. Looks like I was wrong. Does anybody know of any airlines which do include MCC as part of their own training programme and may therefore accept me without an MCC?

[Blended-winglets]

Brymon say that it's a req't but they have taken on people without it.

[johntrav69]

Go dont apparently, nor do British Midland so they say, but give em a choice and which will they take?? The sim check ride makes a difference as well. The problem is that one months salary pays for the course, and chances are you'll wait 3 months without one. I am in the same position in that so many people have them that I have to get one to stand a chance. Lucky I got a good bank manager some people haven't!!

[Old King Coal]

Go Fly don't require it and, imho, any decent airline will pay for this important part of your training from their coffers.

[CrashDive]

johntrav69 - w.r.t your posting above.

Being brutally honest, the Go Fly selection procedure is based on several elements - your background (as gleaned from your application), personality (the interview), and your flying skill (sim ride); once we have data on all this parts our recruitment 'review board' sit down an take the person as a whole, prior to making a decision - and they are very good at picking the right people too, i.e. 'aces of the base' needn't apply !

Now to my knowledge during the whole of that process nowhere do we put a 'price' on whether somebody is a more suitable candidate because they have done a MCC course - indeed we have folks in ground school right now who will also be doing MCC as part of their Boeing 737-300 type-rating course !

As OKC said above, a decent airline will factor this in as part of the cost of training / transition course - and imho, that some airlines insist that you have this prior to applying speaks volumes about them !

------------------
CrashDive

Administrator to The Professional Pilots RUmour NEtwork

May you live in interesting times !

[Redline]

Pretty sure you can add British World to the list of don'ts.

[pete o'probe]

Thanks for all the answers above. I've just received a booklet from CAA listing organisations conducting approved MCC and aircraft type rating courses. Many airlines are listed with 'combined with MCC' against certain of their aircraft types. British Midland, Brymon, Britannia and many others are examples. BA is a notable exception, where only their aircraft are listed. Confusingly, Air2000 states 'with combined MCC' but I understand they will not look at candidates without MCC or exemption. How does that work? I am rapidly resigning myself to doing MCC out of my own pocket. Luckily it would appear that the competition amongst MCC providers is rising and the prices are falling.

[Old King Coal]

Uhm, by what you said Redline, did you mean that BWA do or don't require it ?

Somehow, and particularly so with Hamrah (JM) now at the reigns, I'd guess that it'd be 'not required' - because he's a top chap like that, and always prepared to give a bloke a chance/start !

[Flypuppy]

The thing that gets me about MCC, and I may be a little naieve in this, is that Multi Crew operatons are surely type and company specific. So assuming that one has completed the MCC course at establishment "X" and one applies for Airline "Y" and is accepted, would one have to relearn the concept of multi Crew systems follwing the SOP's of airline "Y" effectively wasting your time and money.

Sorry to have waffled on.

[Old King Coal]

Flypuppy, yes & no.

MCC (imho) is primarily there to teach generic aspects of how individuals work & interact as a crew - but it's your company SOP's that then go on to add some extra substance to this, as in just precisely what is it that a particular airline likes to do w.r.t calls and actions to be carried out.

[rolling circle]

Flypuppy - You are thinking of CRM training, which is not the same thing as MCC. MCC training is intended to introduce the concept of working as part of a crew to someone who has always worked in a single-pilot environment. It contains a few, but not many, elements of CRM and HP&L and is intended to be essentially a practise based course. The CRM course, on the other hand, is operator specific and completed by evryone whether previously multi-crew qualified or not.

BA do not include MCC in their type rating courses because virtually all of their recruits are either Cadet Entry, who do the MCC as part of the integrated ATPL course, or Direct Entry, who are exempt or have already completed the MCC course out of their own pocket. What the deal is with Intermediate Entry, I'm not too sure - there were only 6 last year.

As more operators are including MCC in their type rating training, the demand for stand-alone courses is decreasing - it's definitely becoming a buyers' market.

[Redline]

BWA - Not required...