Going from 61.75 to stand alone -AGAIN!!

[autty]

With regards to taking an FAA private check ride whilst holding a 61.75 private license and the need for training which comes under TAS requirements.

I know much has been written on this BUT couldn’t find anything on the exemption in FAR 61.39 C

(c) A person is not required to comply with the provisions of paragraph (a)(6) of this section if that person:

(1) Holds a foreign-pilot license issued by a contracting State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation that authorizes at least the pilot privileges of the airman certificate sought

This would appear to say that the 3 hours training 2 months before a check ride and signoff is not needed for anyone holding a FAA private cert under 61.75.as it’s based on a foreign ICAO licence.

Since the FAA check ride is done with the candidate as P1 there is no training required or given and, therefore, TAS approval or visas should not be relevant. Indeed, training as far as the legal recording thereof, is surely dependent on how the log book entry is filled P1 – command –PuT training. A valid 61.75 with biennial means that all flight with or without an instructor can be seen as a P1 activity.

TSA guidelines and AOPA information do not appear to be enshrined in law. The whole point of TSA approval is to prevent anyone increasing their piloting skill without TSA consent. A FAA 61.75 allows all the privileges as regards operation of an aircraft as does a “stand alone ticket” So, therefore, there are absolutely NO increase in skills or capability above those that already exist.

In addition, if like myself you, started and finished your flight training before 911 what heading would any future flying be listed under? I did a FAA night course in 2000 but just never got around to to the written or flight test.

If the above is correct then neither TSA approval nor any form of visa is required. I would be interested to see what response one got from the powers that be on an application for a M1 visa in order to take a check ride let alone from the school.

Much of the information out there is contradictory and the more you read the more confusing it becomes!gl

[Mark 1]

I believe you are correct in your interpretation. Just as you can legally do a BFR without any TSA or visa nonsense, you can also do any additional flight reviews with an instructor so long as it doesn't constitute training for an additional certificate or rating.
Do your written, take your checkride and you're good to go. Unless, that is .........

[Mark 1]

I stand corrected.

[Mark 1]

Candidates must obtain AFSP approval for the following three training events:

But there still seems some ambiguity.
If the application doesn't involve training, then is it still a "training event"? i.e. does the TSA approval only cover the training aspect?

Admittedly if you fail the checkride, you're back to square one.

And you may still need the foreign licence verification to be presented at the checkride (that was the case when I did my IR, but may not be in this case)

[Ellemeet]

you definitely need tsa
you have to proove that you have met the training requirements .. including night qualification (this may have been jar)?

you need to have met the x hrs with a faa fi including your solo.

[autty]

Some interesting points here, clearly the TSA views the issuance of a non 61.75 license to a otherwise qualified pilot as a security issue. Although it’s just another tedious bunch of restrictions to be complied with it’s hardly a barrier to anything; more of a pay up and look big situation.

It is strange, however, that they don’t go the whole hog and require TSA approval for any license issue rather than exempting 61.75 but, hey it makes it a lot easier to just go out and fly!

As mentioned above 61.39 C is a little perplexing. Presumably, the intent is to allow those who have been trained to ICAO standards to be accepted as trained pilots, but as SoCal states there is no mention of whether you need current validity. In fact, my letter of validity stated that the CAA could not verify that the currency (24 month check with an instructor) had been complied with. It is, however, logged and signed off – just not certified by the issuing state. So in this case a letter from the CAA will be of no help other than to show that a valid license has been obtained.

The real barrier is the visa requirement. A M1 visa, as far as I can make out, requires a course of approved training. Clearly, if that is the case, a few ad hoc trips with and instructor on board can’t be seen as that either by the chosen school or the visa issuing folks.

Applying for a visa and getting turned down is not good news and complicates an already difficult procedure. On the other hand, training, which seems to be the TSA definition of this, on a B2 visa could lead to more drastic conclusions. I also don’t think the training schools will want to be bothered with a few hours ad hoc on an M1 especially when they state right up front that they want 10hrs minimum flying and 22 hrs weekly total study time.

Aviation training in the US since 911 has become a very thorny subject. What used to be very relaxed and lead to amicable chats with immigration officials upon arrival has turned into something rather sinister. The real problem is that you can’t just phone up the consulate service and say this is what I would like to do, how do I proceed? It’s apply and then find out – by which time it’s too late.

[CJ Driver]

I have undertaken all kinds of bits of training in the USA and for several of them I required TSA approval prior to the course, but in no case did I do anything special about visas. The M1 visa allows full-time residence at a college, an extended stay, and certain working privileges - it is aimed at real full-time university students.

On the other hand, the normal B1/B2 visa waiver allows only 90 days in the country, and has no work privileges, but allows you to do any number of recreational activities you like - including taking checkrides, if that is what turns you on.

[IO540]

Some notes on the FAA PPL, TSA and Visa stuff etc are here (http://www.peter2000.co.uk/aviation/faa-pplir/index.html).

You can do a standalone FAA PPL in Europe again. I gather the highly respected Janeen Kochan, PhD, (FAA DPE) is visiting Europe and is available for checkrides.

Don't do a 61.75 because when EASA comes along there will be several thousand European 61.75 holders running around like headless chickens trying to get theirs re-done, based on their new EASA papers, and it will be hell which will be a lot worse than the ICAO English Language Proficiency pandemonium of a few years ago.

[autty]

“Curiouser and curioser”- but no nearer to a solution. The TSA check is needed BUT as to visa requirements, it’s still not making sense. As far as I can ascertain from both the INS or whatever it is now called, and training schools pilot training (a course thereof) requires an M1 visa F1 seems to be for academic training – degrees etc. M1 would appear to need full time training – minimum hours a week plus the need to leave the US on completion.
If, say, you wish to stay at a house you own on B2 for 4 months to avoid the winter and visit your mates and within this time do a few hours flying and take the written and practical tests what’s t the procedure to avoid rapid removal to Krome Av detention center (South Florida’s first port of call for miscreant foreigners)