Flying overhead a UK airfield

[RemotecUK]

Hi,
I am planning to fly in the near future on a VFR navigation excercise. I plan to take off from airfield A , fly around 50nm and then overhead airfield B. Both airfields have "Radio" callsigns.

Having not flown into the overhead of an airfield before I would like to clarify what the procedure is. I intend to get a basic service from the local approach control enroute but am wondering...

a) do I need to even call up to airfield B to tell them that I am flying onto their overhead (I plan to transit them at around 3000' wx permitting)?

b) what sort of service can I get / do I need to get from airfield B?

Thoughts, suggestions are appreciated.

Cheers.

[thing]

I take it you're using airfield B as a turning point? In theory, as long as you're above their ATZ vertical limit then you don't have to do anything but it would certainly be good airmanship just to give them a call, tell them what you are doing and whether they have any traffic around.

You don't get any service from A/G, just info.

[RemotecUK]

Hi, I will be well above their ATZ yes (Elevation +1000ft).
So I could give them a call on the radio say 10nm from the turning point and just give them a TRPACER call including that I am flying "overhead 'B'" and "request any traffic information" ?
When I want to change frequency back from them, I dont need to "request freq. change" I can just tell them that I am "switching to..." ?
Thanks again.

[thing]

Yeah, sounds about right, I would wait until you're about 7nm away so that you're on your basic service for longer, also the only time you request a frequency change is when you're in controlled airspace. Just say to them something like 'G-xxxx enroute good day'. Or your salutation of choice.

Edit: Don't forget A/G radio is often not manned, if so make traffic calls, something like 'B Traffic, G-xxxx is a tripacer 5 miles north at 3,000' turning your location in 3 minutes.'

[Jan Olieslagers]

Isn't there a large difference between B's?
If B=LHR: once one gets overhead (but it might take some doing) one is perfectly safe
If B=winch launch gliding site: only a perfect fool would come overhead at less than (how many actually?) feet AGL

[RemotecUK]

@thing - thanks for your help.
@jan - In this case B is a small airfield with a radio operator and not a gliding site :)

[thing]

I'm assuming it's a licensed airfield with ATZ in all of that. As Jan says, if it's a glider field then reroute.

[RemotecUK]

Yes, confirming its a licenced airfield with an ATZ.
Cheers.

[Mr Cessna]

Was flying with an instructor cruising at around 3000ft and was about to pass overhead an airfield with A/G, was on another frequency but soon changed and decided to call the A/G to make them (and who ever else was buzzing around, aware of my presence) they soon alerted me to aerobatic traffic operating up to 3000ft.

although I always keep the best lookout - THEY THEN KNEW WHERE I WAS TOO:E

Mr Cessna

[jollyrog]

Even though you're just turning overhead, when you tell them this, they'll probably acknowledge and respond with the aerodrome information - runway in use, circuit direction, QNH and (maybe) QFE.

Be prepared for this, write it down and read it back. If you need to land there for any reason, you're already equipped with the information.

[RemotecUK]

I was planning to use my local international airports approach service to give me a basic sevice for this trip. However, if I go out of their range there is a chance they might ask me to call London for on going service.
I havent done this before so does it just work in the same way? That is I will just request the required service from London?
Thanks.

[felixthecat]

Flying is always about being ahead of the aircraft, so even though your outside their zone check in with them, even though technically you are not wrong by not doing so. Its called airmanship something that is beaten out of people these days :( Helps you, helps them.

[RemotecUK]

I'll be using them initially but as I proceed I presume I may fall outside of their area of coverage. In which case I presume I can switch to London Info. for an ongoing basic service?

[Jan Olieslagers]

Excuse me if I'm wrong, but I seem to understand that
-) you are fishing for a "generic" answer - an understandable and laudable purpose!
-) the UK situation has little room for generic answers

As I already tried to point out, little as I understand the UK airspace and its rules, I am under the firm impression there are very few generic environments/situations in UK airspace, at least at the lower (VFR) altitudes.

[felixthecat]

You can use the LARS service, they are good and give you a radar advisory service. Depending where you are of course.

[RemotecUK]

Cheers, just checked the the local LARS for this nav ex. is only available from 0900-1730 Mon-Fri and Im planning to fly at a weekend. With this in mind I presume that London Information is the next best bet?

[Whopity]

Having not flown into the overhead of an airfield before I would like to clarify what the procedure is.I assume that you must be a student; why has your instructor not briefed you adequately on the route he has given you?

[RemotecUK]

Just doing some self study :)

[Whopity]

One of the advantages of completing the RT Licence prior to undertaking solo Nav is that it can pay dividends in this area. Basically, talk to anyone who might need to know about you, and who can provide you with useful information. Simply tell them where you are and what you intend to do, its as easy as that.

[felixthecat]

London can give you a flight information service

[Whopity]

London can give you a flight information service And what use is that when flying over an airfield?

[felixthecat]

He was talking about during the rest of the route as well as just over the airfield.

[SlipSlider]

You can use the LARS service, they are good and give you a radar advisory service.

London can give you a flight information service

RemotecUK, if you are a current student, as you imply, you should still be aware that neither of the above statements are correct - since 12th March 2009 neither RAS nor FIS exist as Air Traffic Services Outside Controlled Airspace.

Basic, Traffic, Deconfliction, Procedural are the only ATSOCAS services available in the UK. The last two imply acceptance by the pilot of possible routing in to IMC / IFR, which I infer would not apply in your case, if you are indeed a student. The first two have limited function in what they can provide to the user. An AFIS may have some limited knowledge of local traffic, but London Information on a busy weekend is not really worthwhile in your proposed circumstances, and is best left for those who really need the service.

It is probably heresy to say this on here, but you do not actually need to be in radio contact with a ground station all the time ....

[Whopity]

but you do not actually need to be in radio contact with a ground station all the time .... indeed, it can often be more useful to listen rather than talk unnecessarily.

[mrmum]

RemotecUK
You'd probably get better quailty, specific answers/advice if you gave us some actual airfield names for "A" and "B".

[felixthecat]

SlipSlider thanks for the info, you learn something everyday :) Though I agree that you don't have to always be in contact, I think if a service is available you should take it, it gives you one more bit of information and also ATC more information about you to build their picture.

[Whopity]

I think if a service is available you should take it, it gives you one more bit of informationBut you must balance that with whether the information is useful, or whether you are just increasing the workload of the service provider without contributing anything. I recall standing in the tower of a well known UK airfield for 20 minutes during which time they received about 20 calls from aircraft that had nothing to do with that airfield, only one was relevant, the overflyer! The others gave nothing and received nothing useful.

[stevelup]

SlipSlider thanks for the info, you learn something everyday :)These changes were made over two years ago!

[englishal]

Depends...If I am well above the airfield and routing A to B talking to someone else, I wouldn't bother talking to an A/G airfield. If I am not, I might give them a call just to let them know I'll be passing overhead.

[felixthecat]

That it was SteveLup so I am glad to have found out now :) I don't tend to do much flying in uncontrolled airspace.

Whopity, I agree that if you are miles away or thousands of feet above an area there is little point but still think if you are close to an area could be affected by that areas traffic or could affect that areas traffic you should call them.

[memories of px]

tell us where aerodrome B is and we can be more helpful

[memories of px]

quote:- It is probably heresy to say this on here, but you do not actually need to be in radio contact with a ground station all the time ....

ooh you cynic! do you mean they cant help you getting your engine restarted should it fail in flight????

[Kolibear]

Call them up!

Airfields attract aircraft like honey attracts bees.

The guy on the ground won't be that interested, the student flying circuits at 1000' won't be interested & the pilot just taking off won't be interested either.

But the pilot coming in the opposite direction to you also at 3000' will be very interested in your call.

You may be addressing the controller, but you are passing information to everyone else on frequency.

[MrAverage]

Why not ask your favorite instructor for some groundschool relevant to and in advance of the flight in question? He/she should have good knowledge of the route and the best radio plan for the route. Trying to get advice on this site requires much careful filtering. The online Cambridge Dictionary definition of careful is particularly apt here.

[OpenCirrus619]

One last thing to think about if planning to overfly airfields....

You need to check:

NOTAMS: A couple of years ago I heard a number of people "receiving guidance" after overflying an airfield which had a NOTAM, well above 2000' agl, notifying of aerobatic activity
Parachuting: You won't be popular if you overfly an airfield where there is regular parachuting. For example at Lashenden they are active parachuting 7 days a week - often dropping from 10,000'+


With respect to the NOTAMs they are often promulgated as "Airfield" NOTAMS - so don't show up in the en-route nav warnings.

OC619

[rarelyathome]

If the airfield isn't busy you could find somebody doing aeros in the overhead whether NOTAMed or not. I would always call giving intentions as a matter of good airmanship.