Obtaining and FAA Airmen's Certificate on basis of foreign licence

[awqward]

I wonder if anyone has had the same problem I am just now confronted with (I'm sorry it's a bit long winded but there is no short way to explain):

Background -
I have had an FAA Airmen Certificate issued on the basis of my Australian PPL since 1997. However paper certificates are no longer valid since April 2010 and the FAA require that anyone goes through the full process to get a new plastic certificate. Also since 2003 they require verification from the foreign CAA that the licence is valid. In the case of Australia, UK, Malaysia and Pakistan this requires the applicant to request their CAA to release the information to the FAA (for a fee of course)

I filled out the required form for the FAA and faxed it to them and I filled out the CASA form and sent it to Canberra. The FAA requested the verification from CASA and a transcript of my licence history was sent to them. This is where it went off the rails. The FAA in Oklahoma City sent a message to the Oakland FSDO where I intended to pick up the certificate stating that I was INELIGIBLE for an FAA certificate on the basis of the documentation sent from CASA. They sent me a copy of the CASA transcript and cover letter which stated that there were no revocations or suspensions and I had a valid licence, medical and FRTOL....Very confusing and alarming. When I spoke to them to find out why, it turned out that somewhere at the bottom of my transcript (and also somewhere on my licence) it states that my licence was "issued on the basis of a foreign licence: not valid for hire or reward"...they told me they could not issue an FAA certificate on the basis of a foreign licence which was itself issued on the basis of a foreign licence. I pointed out that my previous certificate had been issued on the basis of the very same licence and I have used it extensively over the years...

I learned to fly in Singapore (because I was living there) and in 1993 obtained an Australian Special Pilot's Licence which allowed me to fly VH reg aircraft in Australia as long as my Singapore PPL and medical were valid. In 1995 I moved back to Australia converted my licence to a normal full Australian PPL. This required me to sit the Air Law and HPL exams, do a complete flight test including navigation, and obtain an Australian medical. Therefore my full licence was issued on the same basis as anyone else in Australia - required hours, exams and a medical. It seems the "issued on the basis of a foreign licence" is not technically correct and evidently implies that I did not meet all the Australian requirements.

Anyway I have asked CASA if they could clarify to the FAA that the words do not imply that my Austalian PPL is only valid whilst I have a valid foreign licence...I'm not sure that will be enough though....

Am I the only person who has had this experience??

[awqward]

Apparently I am the only one with this experience :}

Anyway just to close it out...CASA can't help and the FAA won't change their mind...mindless literal interpretation...but there you go...:ugh:

So I have reapplied using my UK/JAA PPL which has no such irrelevant note attached...

[awqward]

Thanks SoCal App,

Yes I have a full Australian licence. I also have a full UK/JAA, UAE and Malaysian licence (along with expired Singapore and Qatar licences). I got my first Licence in Singapore (because that was where I was living when I got the overwhelming urge to just do it! - it would have been far cheaper and faster to do it back home in Australia - and as it turns out without this unexpected hassle!) I initially flew in Australia on a validation of my Singapore licence (issued by CASA as a Special Pilot Licence) but went through the process of getting a FULL CASA licence after I moved back. I do not understand what PURPOSE it serves to note on the licence that I held a foreign licence prior to obtaining the Australian licence. I did the full flight test and took the relevant written papers. The hours gained while flying under my Singapore licence were obviously credited to me...meaning I did not need to fly 40hrs in Australia....The notation seems to be totally unnecesary and serves only to detract from the validity of the licence.

I undestand this is between me and CASA....It is right that the FAA are concerned that if they are going to issue an Airmen's Certificate on the basis of a foreign licence and they go to the trouble of verifying with that authority, then the licence should be a full, unrestricted licence issued by that authority and especially not valid only when carrying a third country licence. My point is that my licence is a full, unrestricted licence but the irrlevant wording on my licence puts this in doubt.

As far as my past leaglity goes. Maybe you are right. But I have been flying in the US with the same licence (which I notice has the same wording) and it has been checked by the origninal FSDO as well as numerous CFIIs since. I most recently flew in late 2009 - with the paper certificate - which was sighted by the organization where I did my BFR and rented. I have also been an AOPA member since 1997 and keep up with the US regulations. The paper certificate remained legal until 2010 - even though plastic certificates were issued for several years before this.

Anyway I am now asking the FAA to verify my UK licence - which has no reference to any foreign licence under which I gained the necessary flight experience.

[awqward]

I forgot to add that yes I have always kept my address updated on the Airmen's Database. I also called the FAA some time ago - when the plastic certificates came out to confirm that my paper certificate was still OK...for the time being. Also my Australian (and UK for that matter) licences had English Language proficiency added automatically

[awqward]

Thanks SoCal, I was told by the FAA that my previous 61.75 is now invalid so that should be OK.

Maybe I will get an proper FAA certificate! - May as well add yet another license and medical to my collection! But there are a lot of N reg aircraft in the UK and Europe (for now anyway...) and an FAA IR would be quite useful here and obviously very useful in the US

Thanks for your help and advice

[Tinstaafl]

Don't forget you'll have to go through the TSA insecurity process to get a stand alone US licence. Your 61.75 doesn't count as a previously issued licence for this purpose.

Like SoCal wrote, you're better off doing the licence to avoid future 61.75 re-issue pain.

[awqward]

Thanks Tinstafl,

I have just been checking out the website SoCal recommended for getting the certifcate here in the UK (albeit Norwich)...which led me to the TSA web site...definitely looks easily do-able! Do you know anyone who has done this? (FAA certificate in the UK)

[awqward]

Thanks for that SoCal....some of these things I have already having done numerous BFRs over the years....yes S-Turns on a line feature and constant radius turns around a point....have had to do them on occasion. As a foreign pilot flying in the US the FAR/AIM is essential as well as membership of AOPA...fantastic resources and I try and do all the ASF courses and refreshers. I also have DTC Duat....

Americans may not realize just how fantastic the flying environment is in the US....especially compared to Australia....The LA Basin is the world's most busy airspace and the service is fantastic...

[awqward]

Success!! Just received a fax from the Airmen Certification Branch confirming the validity of my UK/JAA PPL and gives authorization for me to ally for an FAA Certificate in accordance with CFR14 Part 61.39, 61.75, 61.77, 61.123, 61.153, 63.23 or 63.42....

The UK CAA also included a description of the limitations of my IMC Rating (ie not valid outside the UK)...

Now to book an appointment with the FSDO in Oakland...