Stalls

[skelly2005]

I hope somebody can give me their point of view on stalling. On the base to final stall do you get your student to reduce power, then add 2 stages of flap allowing the aircraft to enter a gentle descent adding back pressure as necessary?

[Cows getting bigger]

I think I know what you are asking. I teach the student pilot to configure the aircraft in the manner they will for base-to-final when doing ccts (in the 152/172 two stages of flap, 65-70kts descending with about 1500-1700rpm). I then get them to commence the turn with 15-20deg of bank, simulating base-to-final. I then encourage them to ease back on the controls whilst maintaining a balanced turn. They are to recover on the first indication of an impending stall (normally stall warner). If they react too early, I take them a little further. Sometime during the exercise I will ensure that they experience the scenario taken to the logical conclusion. (I do enjoy it when they fail to ensure the turn is balanced :) ).

[skelly2005]

Thanks for your reply, yeah i guess there are so many different ways of teaching a student the same thing, you might teach one way another instructor might teach it slightly different. However it is good to understand different points of view and learn from that, thanks again!! :ok:

[Tinstaafl]

You might also consider a base-to-final stall with crossed controls. The scenario being a pilot experiencing a slight overshoot of final, but not wanting to bank too steeply so consciously or subconsciously uses more rudder to increase the turn rate while preventing overbank with opposite aileron. Add extra drag from the unbalanced flight leading to an undershoot followed by a pitch up to stop the undershoot. Eventually the aircraft stalls with crossed controls and usually departs on the high wing side.

[bingofuel]

My understanding is the base to final turn scenario in the stalling exercises, is not to experience a stall and the consequences, but to teach recognition of the approach to the stall and an immediate reduction of angle of attack and a controlled recovery.

Anyone who actually stalls in this configuration at 5-700 ft would be lucky to recover before hitting the ground. So in this case, lets emphasise the recognition of the approaching stall and a safe recovery. If someone wants to see why, then go high and find out.

[Cows getting bigger]

Absolutely - avoidance rather than recovery. But a lesson in the outcome tends to concentrate the mind.

[172_driver]

Total confusion when one adds the FAA PTS requirement for CPL students "recover as the stall occurs" which is very fine line, past stall warning before nose drop. Hard to get students to focus on anything other than finding this "sweet spot" when practicing stalls. They should have practiced and been tested on both a full stall and recovery + recovery on first indication of stall. The focus should be on stall recovery, not how to identify the very exact point of "stall" - which pilots and engineers would probably disagree on when that actually is.

[captainsuperstorm]

The focus should be on stall recovery

yes and no...


spin recovery at 500ft is nearly impossible, and spin come from an asymmetric stall.

so the best way to teach your student, is 1)to avoid a stall and 2) how to recover from a stall/spin.

Kids,you need really to take the command, and simulate a low approach on long final, and show to your student that this situation is very dangerous unless you take appropriated measure like point the nose under the horizon, apply power,etc...
Simulate slow approach, Point at you speed to your student by X reference power and nose/horizon .
Ask him, what should you do if speed is too slow, maybe do a go around, no?

try to find 3-4 different scenarios why a pilot enter in this dangerous situation . 1-planes in front of you is slow 2: extend final, I am too low and too slow 3:go around with no power added,...

just focusing on stall recovery is not enough, believe me.