British Airways Shuttles

[G-BPEC]

Can anyone tell me if the BA shuttle crews are regionally based? For example, do BA have 757/767 crews at Manchester to do these flights? Or is it that the cabin staff are based whereas the flightdeck crew are not? I ask because last year there was an exceedingly helpful steward chap who (prior to 11/9) managed to get me a jumpseat for landing at MAN... the flight crew seemed to be based at LHR but much of the cabin crew (judging by accents alone) were from 'up north'.... .. .Cheers. .G-BPEC

[Thunderbug]

G-BPEC. .. .Short Answer: No. .Long Answer: You seem to have worked most of it out. The Flight crew base in Scotland has been closed by the usually excuses about costs etc.. So now all 757 / 767 work is based at LHR and we get MAN, EDI, GLA nightstops <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> This also applies to the Airbus and 737s.. .. .The MAN-JFK is flown by LHR crews as a back to back (ie 2 round trips) after positioning up to MAN.. .. .The cabin crew do still have regional bases. Scotland, which does shuttles and a few bits of LHR - Europe stuff. Manchester which does MAN - LHR, MAN - Europe and the fabled MAN - JFK.. .. .Belfast base has recently been closed . Not sure about BHX base.. .. .Hope this helps.

[G-BPEC]

Thanks Thunderbug. Nightstopping here at MAN... I can think of better places (I bet the NYC one beats it slightly!) Do you normally stay at one of the MAN airport hotels then, or do you get to visit the city? Mind you, there can't be that much you can do in the 8 hours you have before the morning shuttle <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> . . . .Also, another quick query.. surely crew briefings present problems if the cabin crew's outbound leg out of MAN is the flight crew's inbound leg back into LHR? Do they all have to get off then back on again if the a/c is going straight back, if you see what I mean? (not sure I completely do myself <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> ). .. .Thanks for satisfying my curiousity anyway... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="rolleyes.gif" /> . .. .G-BPEC. . . . <small>[ 26 March 2002, 12:23: Message edited by: G-BPEC ]</small>

[Thunderbug]

G-BPEC. .. .Domestic nightstopping is great. Sensible money, good beer, no jet lag and the locals speak the right language (almost!). We get a minimum of 12 hours at a nightstop. Usually if you bring the last flight in you will do an early afternoon flight southbound. For those doing the first southbound you will arrive at MAN about 1500hrs.. .The shuttle flights are linked with other European flights or other shuttles, so a 3 day tour may look like this:. .LHR-MAD MAD-LHR LHR-MAN. .MAN-LHR LHR-EDI. .EDI-LHR LHR-ZRH ZRH-LHR. .. .No airport hotels - We are fortunate enough to be put up in a nice hotel in the centre of town. . .. .Despite being squashed between two visits to the Big Apple, the day off in MAN is great for a curry or a chinese!. .. .Because we report at different places the crew briefings are usually seperate and then a get together on board for an exchange of info between flight and cabin crews. Get the dispatcher involved so everybody is singing from the same hymn sheet.. .. .The crews (flight & cabin) sometimes stay on board if they are keeping the same aircraft. But usually you go to the CAT (Centre Area Turnround)lounge at LHR where you brief and await your next flight.. .. .Clear as mud.....(the flying is the easy bit <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> )

[G-BPEC]

Thunderbug,. .. .I see.. I was under the impression that it was the last one in, 9 hours in an airport hotel then the first one back, but obviously not! It's certainly interesting the way that the crewing and routings work in BA, if a little confusing! Thanks for all the info. .. .G-BPEC

[Hand Solo]

Hey come to BHX where a typical tour used to look like this:. .. .BHX-GLA GLA-BHX BHX-CDG CDG-BHX BHX-GLA. .13 hours in hotel and then:. .GLA-BHX BHX-CDG CDG-BHX BHX-GLA GLA-BHX. .13 hours at home. .. .Repeat ad nauseum.. .. .Stay in a nice hotel in town and have no time to do anything other than have a quick pint (yes we've seen you LHR lightweights off for a curry when we're turning in for our early start)! Domestic nightstops are rubbish - no adventure, expensive beer, no duty free, dreadful weather and the 'pay-per-view' TV is rubbish! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />

[Thunderbug]

Ah yes....We know which pay per view channels those are...! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" /> . .. .5 sector days - Oh my heart (almost) bleeds! Will swap you for my 50 hr stop in Jeddah over Easter! Sun, sea, sand, er..... thats it. No pay per view channels there - only the the jihad channel! and you don't have to worry about the price of the beer - There is none! Good for the liver though.. .. .Have one for me....... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />

[Carnage Matey!]

Jihad? Is that like kabaddi? Sounds like fun, can the girls play? Still, you'll get the scoop on OBLs whereabouts on Al-Jazeera! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="tongue.gif" />

[ETOPS]

Hand Solo . .. .Something tells me that by the time you have been directed out of BHX you will have seamlessly become a "WhenI". As in "when I used to do 5 sectors etc" You will get all misty eyed on BNN1A arrival into head office as you pass HON but there again you will eventually be a Sonic Cruiser Capt. so relax. Day returns to Rio will seem like a breeze.......

[Hand Solo]

Whose waiting to be directed out? With rostering like that and all those lovely LHR nightstops I'm being trampled in the rush to go! Still, at least I'll never be nostalgiac about flying T*******!

[ETOPS]

Let's get this straight:-

I HAVE NEVER FLOWN THE HAWKER SIDDELY 121 !!

I'm strictly Shorts/BAC (Hurn)/Boeing

Er whats that you lot say "SRS Flex Runway"

Why not "Power set"!

[G-BPEC]

So are the hotels you get put up in usually of a reasonable standard then, or is it a case of costs ruling over comfort? Are there any airlines who do have 9 or 10 hour nightstops only, ie. last one in, first one out?

Thanks
G-BPEC

[Mister Geezer]

ETOPS

Never mind SRS Flex and all that stuff. At least your Boeing does not distract you in the flare by calling you a 'retard'!

These europeans :confused:

MG!

[regor]

I was told that if the 'retard' callout only occurs once, then its for information.

If it does it twice, then it's personal!:D

[overstress]

Sadly ETOPS, we have to continously burble BA OSG banter during the entire t/o run (which only takes a few seconds in the overpowered 319).

We miraculously 'set' power by placing the TLs into a detent (how does power work in a jet? - I thought jet engines produced thrust) THEN we are allowed to start our Toulouse mantra) then we call 80 knots (why 80??) then we have to remember if we are calling V1 or not and finally we are allowed to call rotate by which time the P1 has got so bored of the whole thing he is over-rotating the whole shuddering leaping thing into a crazy 22deg nu attitude to prevent the SESMA rep from enquiring after our health (not), offering handling advice contrary to the Trg Capts mysterious, unpublished (we'll push this policy but its not written down anywhere) techniques and avoiding high speed in the initial climb. (and relax)

You guys have it easy!

P.S. Don't forget to turn off the seatbelt signs 2 min after t/o at 20deg body angle in the middle of a 30deg banked turn!

[ETOPS]

Overstress

As a regular Airbus jumpseater I have to agree with what you say. The operation has me in fits most of the time - I think of Airbus in the same way as Renault - very French and fiddly!

Couple of days ago on a '319 out of LHR (with full pax - fuel for MAN) the V2 was 144Kts. I had just left the East Coast of the states with a full load in the '77 and our V2 was the same. Why such a high speed in such a small aeroplane?

And another thing, the cabin interphone chime is about as loud as a foghorn. It made me jump and it blocked out ATC.

Thank God I fly Boeings......

[overstress]

ETOPS

In their infinite wisdom and majesty, the powers that be have decided that we pilots are not to be trusted. To set anything for takeoff other than flap one, that is.

For the uninitiated, small airbuses have flap zero, one, two, three and full. Takeoff can be made using settings one to three.

In BA, the aforementioned powers are petrified of somebody repeating the -400 takeoff faux pas (no flap set at application of takeoff power). They have decreed that all takeoffs on the Airbus fleet will be at flap one unless performance precludes that setting.

The logic given is, as I understand it, that we will then be 'used' to this setting - there is no chance of getting it wrong if we always use this one!

The argument falls down a little when you consider all the other variables we are 'allowed' to deal with in our daily operations.

Also, (apart from generating ridiculously high V speeds) - what of the argument that if we used the best flap setting for a given runway, be it one, two or three, and doublechecked, we are LESS likely to make an error simply because we are always on our guard as to what the flap setting is for that particular rwy.

But they probably did it that way on the T*****t.

[Hand Solo]

I think the high V2 speeds are a product of our performance department wanting to get the most (of what I don't know) out of long runways. If you try getting out of FRA , MAD, CDG, LHR then the V2 is astronomical, but you'll lift the same weight from an intersection at EDI on a wet day with the anti-ice on at 122 kts!