Recording ATC on a Video Camera

[Rusty Cessna]

Hiya Folks, . .. .Firstly I don't know if this is the appropriate forum, but I think it is the one in which the question best fits, apologies to the moderators if it isn't.. .. .I have done a few flights now where the pax in the back have taken a camcorder up with them, as long as they keep it out of the way at important times, and they don't let it or the filming interfere with the flight, it is never a problem.. .. .I have to say the videos usually are really nice to watch, however they only feature the background drone of the engine, and I was thinking it would be great if we could somehow get the ATC transmissions and other radio chatter aswell as our chatter in the cockpit on tape too.. .. .Now if this is going to involve some sort of rewiring to the radios of headsets then obviously I don't want to do it, its a club aircraft I rent, also if it could pose a potential hazard then I don't want to do it either, but I would love to hear any suggestions from people who have done this in the past, hopefully I will be able to do it.. .. .Many thanks,. .Rusty.

[DVR6K]

My theory:. .. .Get yourself a lead with two pokey outey bits on the ends and plug one end into the camcorder microphone socket, and one end into one of the headphone sockets in the back. If there is a spare seat in the aircraft this shouldn´t be a problem. Never tried it myself but see no reason why it wouldn´t work fine. Might need to see if you could do something about the levels of the transmissions though because they might come out a bit loud. Also, don´t think you´ll get any of the engine noise.

[Rusty Cessna]

DVR6K, . .. .Thanks for your reply. I see where you are going with the "Y" cable idea, this was my idea too, the only thing I was worried about that it might fry the radio kit, probably wouldnt but I wanted to see if anyone has done it.. .. .Thanks again!. .Rusty.

[Pilot Pete]

Try asking an avionics engineer, he'd probably be able to rig you up a suitable cable and plugs.. .. .PP

[PAXboy]

I would say that you are more likely to fry the camcorder microphone input! Checking out the specification of the cam's input and the headset jack is the only real way.. .. .The other way is to find a small lapel microphone and place it inside the ear cup of a headset with a small insulating cover. the difficulty is bleed through of sound trhough the cover (say a scarf) but it saves having direct conenction. The person opeeting the camera can use an earphone to monitor the sound. That said, the leves in those earphones will make it very difficult to monitor acurately!

[Lucifer]

WARNING: you need a resistor, or you will have too much current flowing into the sound input on the camcorder.. .. .Ask some people on the military forum, who used to do this - heard of it happening on the Torando.

[Right Stuff]

Paxboy has the right idea - the mike under the headphone is the best way to record ATC. Professional tv crews use this technique all the time with very good results. Plugging kit into the a/c system is not at all simple and can end in tears.

[Rusty Cessna]

Thanks folks for all suggestions.. .. .Looks like PAXboy's idea is the way ahead, something im a bit happier with. Could you by any chance give a more detailed explanation, its still a bit murky on how to do this.. .. .Would this method record the voices of the people in the cockpit aswell?. .. .Many thanks.. .Rusty.. . . . <small>[ 10 March 2002, 22:51: Message edited by: Rusty Cessna ]</small>

[ATCbabe]

RC,. .. . As far as I'm aware it is illegal to record ATC transcripts without the appropriate authority.. . Just thought I'd point that out.

[Rusty Cessna]

Is it really babe!. .. .Thanks for pointing that out, so are you saying my plans for a personal video are illegal, if so, how do I go about making it legal?. .. .Rusty.

[ATCbabe]

RC,. .. . It's against the Wireless and Telegraphy Act. Getting caught results in a fine or possibly even a prison sentence.. . You'll need to get permission from the appropriate authority. By this I mean the air traffic unit that you happen to be recording at the time.. . I'm sure most units will gladly give permission as its for a home movie as such, so shouldn't be a problem. Good luck with the movie. . . . <small>[ 10 March 2002, 23:23: Message edited by: ATCbabe ]</small>

[Rusty Cessna]

Cheers babe,. .. .I wasn't aware of that, thanks VERY much for pointing it out. Ideally I would like the cokcpit chatter between me and pax, and a bit of ATC in the background, but since there will still be ATC on the recording, I will still need to get permission, do I just need to get a letter signed by someone on duty at the station I intend to be recording?. .. .Many thanks,. .Rusty.

[2Donkeys]

RC. .. .Without taking anything away from what ATCBabe is saying, this is really not something that I would lose a lot of sleep over. Listening to and recording ATC for your own personal use as an FRTO holder is not really what the Wireless and Telegraphy Act was all about. . .. .Just don't sell copies of the video to strangers <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="smile.gif" />

[Aircraft_Nut9]

You might be able to use the 'suction cup' add on which is commonly sold for use with ordinary telephone handsets. . .. .This depends on inductive coupling from the headset, so it would void direct electrical connection.. .. .Best of luck.

[DVR6K]

Legality wise, this sort of thing always brings up dos and donts. I work for a radio station and if I was to take ATC chatter and stick it on my show, I´d have the radio authority and the CAA on my back because I´m playing something in public I have no right to play.. .. .However, showing the video to your mates is hardly criminal activity and the appropriate authorities turn a blind eye to it because they have more important things to chase up!. .. .How many times have you copied a mate´s CD onto a tape to listen to in the car? That´s breaking every rule in the book but no one really cares.. .. .Enjoy!

[EricTheRed]

I use a lapel mic all the time with great results. Just plug one end into your camcorder and tuck the mic inside one earpiece of your headset. You will hear all the chat from everyone on your intercom, and from ATC, on your recording.. .. .Cheers,. .. .ETR

[Rusty Cessna]

Cheers Eric, . .. .Any ideal on what type of lapel mic I need? What type do you use?. .. .Many thanks,. .Rusty.

[SE7EN]

Your camcorder will work fine if you plug in the mike to the SNY sockets. If you are recording a glass flight deck, you will obtain much better results with a digital camera as there won't be any screen flicker. Not sure if this is the case with CRTs but LCDs are very clear and flicker free.. .Also useful is to action all checklists and crew communication through the intercom so that all this will be recorded too.. .I have achieved some great results including some spectacular day and night footage of Kai Tak approaches. Everything since is a bit dull!. .Good luck

[Gunner B12]

I also would reccomend using a mic but if you do go down the track of direct connection you would need an equalising transformer rather than a resistor and getting the impedance right would be difficult. I don't think the stick on inductive type like they use on phones would work too well as they usually rely on the astic (anti sidetone induction coil) in the phone to get a real connection.

[EricTheRed]

The lapel mic that I use was just a generic one I picked up from the local Maplin store. Make sure you get one with a detachable clip - or it might be a bit uncomfortable sticking in your ear! Should set you back about £20.. .. .Good luck,. .. .ETR

[Sensible]

Fly a PA 28 and leave the cabin speaker switched on with the volume turned up, ATC can be clearly heard on the soundtrack. Funny thing, there seems to be some noise reduction circuit thing (technical term)in my camcorder that seems to turn the engine noise down when ATC comes over the speaker.