View Full Version : Non Standard minima
Topper80
6th Nov 2010, 09:32
Scenery (real) airport in EU:
Airport with Glide Slope INOPERATIVE and all ALS INOPERATIVE (notams).
Procedure in use LOC (GS out) (MDH/DH is 330 ft): which RVR/CVR I need to land?
Johnny F@rt Pants
6th Nov 2010, 09:46
You need the rvr stated on the approach plate for the localizer approach that you're going to fly.
Not quite! You need the table in 4c of the EUOPS appendix too! Let's have a stab at Cat C 1400m minimum - any advance?
kasperl
6th Nov 2010, 10:23
...it is table 4d of the old Appendix 1 to EU OPS 1.430, it says 1800m for CAT C and 2000m for CAT D aircraft. For operators who have already adopted the new Appendix 1(all must in July 2011), it is only 1500m for all aircraft categories provided they use the CDFA procedure. Without CDFA, add 400m to the 1500m (CAT C+D aircraft)...
so long, kasperl.
Johnny F@rt Pants
6th Nov 2010, 10:45
Oops, soory, bum steer from me there - RTFQ. I missed the bit about the approach lights.:ouch: Humble apologies.
Topper80
6th Nov 2010, 11:23
Yuo are correct: for C airplane we need 1800 !!
So, how can many traffic land with this weather??????????????????????
060745Z 23006KT 0700 R04/P1500N FG SCT004 BKN015 12/11=
060715Z 23005KT 0700 R04/P1500D FG SCT004 BKN015 12/11 Q1022=
060645Z 23004KT 0700 R04/1500N FG SCT004 BKN015 12/12 Q1022=
060615Z 22004KT 0700 R04/1500D FG SCT004 BKN015 12/12 Q1022=
060545Z 23005KT 0800 R04/1500D FG SCT010 BKN015 12/12 Q1022=
060515Z 23004KT 1000 R04/1500N BR SCT010 SCT020 12/12 Q1022=
060445Z 23004KT 1500 BR BKN015 12/12 Q1023=
060415Z 23004KT 1500 BR BKN015 12/12 Q1023=
060345Z 23004KT 1500 BR BKN020 12/12 Q1023=
060315Z 24004KT 1500 BR BKN020 12/12 Q1023=
060245Z 23004KT 1500 BR BKN020 12/11 Q1023=
060215Z 22003KT 1500 BKN020 11/11 Q1025=
060145Z 24004KT 1500 BR BKN020 11/11 Q1025=
060115Z 24004KT 1500 BR BKN020 12/12 Q1025=
060045Z 28003KT 1500 BR BKN020 12/12 Q1025=
060015Z 25004KT 1500 BR BKN020 12/12 Q1026=
L 052345Z 27004KT 1500 BR BKN020 13/12 Q1026=
052315Z 28004KT 1500 BR BKN020 13/12 Q1026=
052245Z 28003KT 1500 BR BKN020 13/12 Q1027
:sad:
Topper80
6th Nov 2010, 12:50
fter 0445z we don't have any RVR report because, as reported, the general visibility is 1500 m
Day time: RVR/CVR = gen visibility x 1 = 1500 so no one could land !
Am I wrong ? Why?
PS: In night time will be: RVR/CVR = gen visibility x 1.5 and will be ok
No you are right - go to the pub.:)
EDIT: Nor would I exercise my 'right' to convert met vis to RVR at 1.5x at night.
Topper80,
the new Jepp plates distinct between the DA for NPA CDFA for both normal conditions and ALS out as well as MDA for both normal and ALS OUT conditions. Provided you flown the approach as CDFA using DA RVR of 1500 or VIS 1500 is sufficient to shoot the approach. No problems there. :ok:
The original question.
Non Standard minima
Scenery (real) airport in EU:
Airport with Glide Slope INOPERATIVE and all ALS INOPERATIVE (notams).
Procedure in use LOC (GS out) (MDH/DH is 330 ft): which RVR/CVR I need to land?
The not quite:rolleyes: answer...
Not quite! You need the table in 4c of the EUOPS appendix too!
which, as it turns out is not quite correct.
It depends on whether the operator is regulated by EASA, or...another entity, that does not follow EASA procedures.
So, if I wanted to land my trusty L1011 at the specified airport, according to our operations specifications (which specifies the Jeppesen published minima on the chart, including inop components), reference to EUOPS appendix would absolutely not be required.
Why?
Because we are not an EU regulated operator (fortunately).;)
If you took a break from riding at all those rodeos, sat on your mouth and gave it a rest, you would have noted Topper operates in EUOPS.:ugh:
Hint: Professional pilots like to check things carefully - but then...........................
... you would have noted Topper operates in EUOPS.
The original question did not so state, IE: he could be a non-EU operator operating in EUOPS area.
And yes, professional pilots do check carefully, and that is why my reply was as stated.
he could be a non-EU operator operating in EUOPS area. - of course, but even a child could find out he isn't!:ugh:
- of course, but even a child could find out he isn't!
Rubbish, complete nonsense;)