B-737 Ng: Are Thrust Levers Fly By Wire?

[TangoAir]

Hi,

With no AC power, if we loos all electrical power after the 60 minutes off battery, do we still have the thrust levers working or will thrust stay at the last set?

Regards,

Tango Air

[IFixPlanes]

Still working. You forget the EEC alternator. :ok:

[grounded27]

Yes, all FADEC engines I know of are powered by a PMG, if the engines are running your thrust module should be responsive, may loose all indication but you should have control.

[Gas Bags]

Loos.......Loose......What is the queens english coming to?

[Denti]

A language nazi, the most famous kind of internet posters...

[Checkboard]

Ah! Godwin's Law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law) in action. ;)

[barit1]

I've said it before: Given that several thousand readers may scrutinize your posts, your respectability is somewhat determined by your proper use of the language.

That said, if English is not your first language, I'll cut you some slack so long as I don't have too much trouble understanding you. :ooh:

[punk666]

You only have 30 minutes of battery unless your talking about a dual battery.

[grounded27]

The Queen is impotent and her language is lost....

[NSEU]

Loos.......Loose......What is the queens english coming to?

People in glass houses... should check their grammar :E

As previously stated, there is no time limit on engine control thanks to dedicated alternators on the engines. If the N2 rotor/gearbox keeps spinning above 15%, I believe, there will be enough power for the EEC.

Just don't let the engines flame out in bad weather. With flat batteries, you won't have ignitor power to relight them (irrespective of EEC power).

[Denti]

You only have 30 minutes of battery unless your talking about a dual battery.

Isn't the NG by default allways equipped with dual battery? Dunno really as all of ours are and we have a pretty weird mix.

(Oh, sorry about my bad english by the way, it is after all only a tertiary language for me.)

[ampclamp]

I think tango is asking if it is totally electronic ,ie no mech cables attached to levers ( ie airbuses), not so much that the eec will still be powered by the n2 genny or that the engine is fadec.

edited cos I was confusing/combining classic and new gen.

Power is set and controlled electronically tango so yes it is FBW

[ampclamp]

Hi Denti,
No, not all 737ng aircraft have 2 batteries.That, I am 100% sure of.

[Denti]

Ah, thanks for that piece of information, seems my alteon difference CBT is once again incorrect. Honestly wouldn't be surprised if you order a basic 737 without any options all you get is an empty metal hull, even the flight controls can be optioned...

[DC-ATE]

Why is this question being asked here and not in the sim or at the company where flown?!:confused:

[grounded27]

Why is this question being asked here and not in the sim or at the company where flown?!


Great question, I think I will ask all my stupid questions at work and rant like a lunatic when not asking questions at work from here on out.

Hell, why google anything? there is plenty of resource material at the library..

[TangoAir]

“-Why is this question being asked here and not in the sim or at the company where flown?”

1) It was asked at the sim center owned by the factory of the NG. No answer!

2) If a forum, specially the Tech Log at Pprune.org, is not a right place to make this kind of question, I'm missing something!

Anyway, thanks for all the replays!

Tango Air

[lederhosen]

DC-ACHE wins the prize for stupidest and least helpful answer of the week and as ever there has been some robust competition. How often do you go in the sim? Do you save up questions for six months. As ever there is rarely such a thing as a stupid question, just stupid answers. All our Ngs are dual battery, I cannot imagine any sane person specifying single battery.

[IFixPlanes]

...All our Ngs are dual battery, I cannot imagine any sane person specifying single battery.
A lot of NGs flying around with only 1 battery:
- Most of the Aeroméxico NGs
- All of the All Nippon Airways NGs
- At least 1 of Southwest Airlines NGs
- At least 3 of Virgin Blue Airlines NGs
- At least 2 of COPA Airlines NGs
- At least 49 of Gol Linhas Aereas NGs
- At least 4 of Xiamen Airlines NGs
- At least 1 of Air Vanuatu NGs
- At least 2 of Hong Kong Express NGs
- At least 2 of Hong Kong Air NGs
- At least 2 of Hainan Airlines NGs
- At least 2 of Korean Air NGs
- At least 17 of Shandong Airlines NGs
- At least 2 of Hainan Airlines NGs
(List is not complete and configuration could be changed ;))

[BOAC]

Like he said?I cannot imagine any sane person specifying single battery:D

[lederhosen]

Wow that is a real eye opener. Anyone know if there is any benefit other than cost saving. Particularly worrying would be Gol flying long distances over Brazil out of thirty minutes range of an airfield or All Nippon that had a couple of aircraft doing long range all business class services. That is the sort of information that would help me decide who not to fly with. Unlikely as the loss of all generators might be, the recent russian incident shows it is possible.

[Denti]

An eyeopener indeed. To explain why is was a bit surprised that there is actually a single battery option (although knowing nearly everything on a 737 is optional it shouldn't really be surprising), our generic transition training CBT provided by boeing when transitioning from classics to NGs told us "all Boeing 737 NGs are equipped with dual batteries" which seems to be some misinformation. Not really surprising as the boeing CBTs are not all that good anyway, but still...

[BOAC]

Since all NG's are delivered 'ETOPS Capable' I guess the 'standard' would be 2 and you would probably have to argue to get 1?

[IFixPlanes]

EL AL too: (there is no "AUX BAT" position at the DC Selector)
Photos: Boeing 737-758 Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net (http://www.airliners.net/photo/El-Al-Israel/Boeing-737-758/1032809/L/)

[Capt Chambo]

Since all NG's are delivered 'ETOPS Capable' I guess the 'standard' would be 2 and you would probably have to argue to get 1?

Not sure what the battery(ies) would have to do with ETOPS, as the ETOPS portion of the flight is predicated on having the APU running to supply electrical power, if required.

[BOAC]

Agreed, but I know which I would prefer mid-oggin!

[EW73]

With regard to 30 minutes battery duration with the single battery NG...

In the case of a complete AC power failure in an NG (unlikely), I have always considered the 30 minutes of battery duration to be employed only during the approach part of the recovery....you know, when you really need all those instrument thingies and talky things to get you to the right end of the runway going in the right direction.

Why would you drain the battery(s) in level cruise flight, when there are quite enough indications of heading, altitude and speed, then have not enough left when you really need it, to shoot a normal(ish) approach (VHF1, NAV1, ADF1) if the need arose.

As an aside...well almost...in a dual battery NG,
1/ the secondary battery is not normally used for anything at all, the ONLY time the two batteries are connected is when standby power is activated, and
2/ if you ever arrive at the airplane to start the APU, and find the primary battery isn't up to it, selecting standby power on to connect the two batteries won't help, since selecting the APU to start is the only time, with standby power selected, that the two batteries are disconnected from each other.

Cheers,
ew73

[lederhosen]

Everyone is entitled to their point of view. I think I am with BOAC on this one, as are obviously the majority of NG operators judging by the list. Having one battery can hardly improve safety as to whether it seriously reduces it is the question. Anyone have any examples where having two batteries has helped?

[Topper80]

In my company we have most of the NG with the dual battery config, but some (2 -800) has the single battery.

EK73 thanks for the /2 information: I didn't know about that :ok:

[ampclamp]

Obviously plenty of operators have single battery installations.
Having worked on 737's for nearly 30 years I have never seen personally a single aircraft that has lost all 3 gennys.
We run etops all the time aand fly in excess of 4 hours on a few legs.All single battery.Sure 2 or more of everything is great but given the record of the 737 classic and NG the lack of necessity speaks for itself imho.