"Top Pilot is accused of £500k cocaine drug smuggling"

[camlobe]

May be more appropriate in Private Flying or Instructors, but I placed it here as the individual named is ex-RAF and quite well known amongst the more experienced members here. Mods, please feel free to move as required.

Reported in the North Wales Daily Post of the 1st August 2009:

"A TOP pilot and two passangers have denied smuggling 16kgs of cocaine worth more than £500,000 into an Anglesey airfield.

David Lloyd, 63 of Llangristiolus in Anglesey - described by his solicitor as a former RAF pilot and winchman and one of Britain's most experienced flying instructors - denied knowingly importing the drug at the island's Mona airstrip. Defence solicitor Eilian Williams told Caernarfon magistrates 'He's a respected man. He wants to clear his name.'

They (the pilot and two passangers) were refused bail and remanded in custody until Monday..."

camlobe

[vecvechookattack]

a former RAF pilot and winchman


Not at the same time though

[ZH875]

He must have been a fly-by-wire pilot :E

[taxydual]

Innocent until proven, surely.

Camlobe, I'm surprised. Gossip, pure gossip.

[Motleycallsign]

Aren't winchmen referred to as ' Dope on a rope'?

[mustpost]

Innocent until proven, surely
And surprising indeed that this has not been picked up elsewhere, occupation notwithstanding. Half a million of class A is still a significant haul..:confused:

[B2N2]

Camlobe, I'm surprised. Gossip, pure gossip.
Really?
And why would that be gossip?
Gossip, same as these?

Pilot arrested in cannabis probe - News - The Independent (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/pilot-arrested-in-cannabis-probe-1305403.html)

Coventry Telegraph - News - Coventry News - Coventry heroin smuggling mastermind jailed (http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/2009/04/02/coventry-heroin-smuggler-jailed-for-15-years-92746-23291228/)

Or gossip because he is ex-RAF and therefore couldn't have done it?

[LH2]

Or gossip because he is ex-RAF and therefore couldn't have done it?

No, because he wouldn't have been caught :E

[juliet india mike]

The two examples reported above hardly qualify as 'masterminds' do they?

Most drug busts involve low level user-dealers or amateurs after a quick profit. The real masterminds are unknown.

Will be interesting to hear the outcome, but if 'not guilty' it won't make the front page.

[fido]

Not so much "gold bars" as "iron bars"

[Rivet]

Anymore news on the court case?

[CrazyMonkey]

Firstly, Dave Lloyd has never been an RAF pilot. He was a winchman and became a commercial pilot after leaving the RAF. He then had a whole range of flying jobs before settling down as the CFI (well, only instructor) at RAF Mona Flying Club.

Does anyone have an update of the drug smuggling case against Dave Lloyd?

[Hen Ddraig]

Local HMC & R man told us recently that Dave Lloyd is out on bail.


Time to spare, go by air
Hen Ddraig

[funfly]

Only 'Top pilots' wear four gold bars on their epaulettes.:=

[funfly]

Not related to this case but a few years ago I knew a pilot who flew 'friends' as and when they wanted. His comment was "I don't ask and I don't know". Came as a shock to him when the special squad pinned him down at the airfield with guns to his head. He, luckily, got away with it as there were other circumstances but the two with him didn't - they were carrying 7 millions pounds worth of cocain..

My own attitude is that we all have a responsibility to question if we have any suspicions about why our passengers want to be flown anywhere.

To me "I don't ask so I don't know" is not a valid argument when it comes to aiding drug smugglers. If someone said that to me it would seem that they had a bl**dy good idea.

[CrazyMonkey]

Just found out he is on bale with a tag and has been charged by the police. Apparently he was under surveilance for 8 months beforehand. If he's innocent, I hope he clears his name...but now looking like a strong case As RAF Mona is a military airfield, I wonder what supervsion there was of his activities?

[funfly]

Flew out of Mona a couple of years ago (with full permission of the RAF and during operational hours) and was subsequently contacted by the aformentioned CFI and informed that I required his permission as well.

[funfly]

Sep 12 2009 (http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/2009/09/12/) by Eryl Crump (http://www.dailypost.co.uk/authors/eryl-crump/), Daily Post
A PILOT and two passengers smuggled 16kgs of cocaine worth more than £1m into an Anglesey airfield, a court heard.
Flying instructor David John Lloyd, 63, of Llangristiolus near Llangefni, is charged with conspiracy to import illegal drugs.
Passengers Paul Roche, 53, and Matthew Lockwood, 28, both of Prestwich, Manchester, are also charged with conspiracy to import drugs.
Lloyd, described by his solicitor as a former RAF rescue winchman who had taken part in 300 life saving rescue missions, was the pilot of a single-engined Diamond aircraft on July 29.
It landed at RAF Mona near Bodffordd, a small airstrip used by RAF and civilian training aircraft, and was met by police and customs officers.
Lloyd and the two men were arrested after the drugs were found.
Magistrates at Caernarfon were told the three men were initially charged with knowingly importing the drugs.
But Janice Wild, prosecuting on behalf of HM Customs, asked for that charge to be substituted for the more serious charge of conspiracy.
She said: “They are charged, in that between July 26 and July 29 this year, they conspired with each other and other persons, known and unknown, to evade prohibition of the importation of controlled drugs of class A, namely cocaine.”
Ms Wild said the matter could only be heard by a crown court and asked the case be transferred to the higher court.
The three men spoke only to confirm their personal details yesterday and were not asked to enter pleas on the new charge.
The three men were allowed conditional bail until the next hearing.
Magistrates refused to allow applications by all three men’s lawyers to relax some of their stringent bail conditions.

[obnoxious]

Does any one have an ID for the aircraft, it was a single engined Diamond DA40. but which one?

[Hen Ddraig]

Think you may find it's G-CCLV Currently in secure hangarage at RAF Shawbury


Time to spare, go by air

Hen Ddraig

[obnoxious]

There is supposed to be a beech
baron stored for the same reason but nothing more is known

[PompeyPaul]

Time to spare, go by air
Scag to deliver, take the Cessna ?

[Rivet]

Delay in Anglesey Airfield drug-smuggling trial

Jan 30 2010 Daily Post

THE trial of a pilot accused of smuggling drugs into an Anglesey airfield has been delayed until August.

Flying instructor David John Lloyd, 63, of Llangristiolus near Llangefni, is charged with conspiracy to import illegal drugs.

A passenger aboard a light aircraft which landed at RAF Mona on July 29, Paul Roche, 53, of Prestwich, Manchester, is also charged with conspiracy to import drugs.

Their trail should have started at Liverpool Crown Court on Monday.

But last night a spokesman for HM Revenue and Customs said the matter had been adjourned.

“Another man has recently been arrested and charged in connection with this matter and the trial has been adjourned so all matters can be dealt with at the same time,” he said.

Lloyd and Roche deny smuggling 14kgs of cocaine worth more than £1m aboard the aircraft.

[funfly]

Is there an update on this thread?
What has happened to our top pilot?

[Katamarino]

And, can I buy the Diamond cheap?

[IO540]

Better give it a good scrub with Dettox first, in case somebody doing a ramp check decides to sniff it :) Might have some serious explaining to do otherwise. I get worried enough carrying two 0.5kg bags of silica gel :)

[Prophead]

It wouldn't be that hard to plant something on an aircraft somewhere like le touquet and then have someone else pick it up at night from the parked aircraft.

[IO540]

I wonder if you can get convicted on possession alone. How would one get out of something like that?

I am sure the French would lock you up on possession alone, however.

Got to keep the plane locked up. It is a lot more common to have stuff stolen, e.g. headsets.

[Jan Olieslagers]

And, can I buy the Diamond cheap?

There might be one available rather cheap - currently at EBOS or EBFN, perhaps? - though requiring some serious attention, scrubbing not the least. But it might take some time to get released from the officers of justice.
See the full story on below link - and do read between the lines, especially in the concluding paragraph.

http://www.mobilit.fgov.be/data/aero/accidents/AA-9-1.pdf

[Katamarino]

Now that report is VERY odd. Insurance job?

[dirkdj]

Very strange: your engine starts with great difficulty, yet you go find the nearest sea to fly over, where you happen to have an 'engine failure' but luckily you can execute a perfect ditching and as if your luck can't run out there happens to be an inflatable with a couple of your friends just happening to be diving in the exact area where you happened to have an engine failure.
Things happen...

[IO540]

I don't understand this.

If he scuttled the plane because he was carrying something which he didn't want to be discovered upon landing, surely they would have found that when they fished the plane out of the water.

A smarter way to do an insurance claim would be to not make any radio calls and later claim the engine just stopped. A fuel blockage can never be disproved. Still very risky and stupid, though.

[Molesworth 1]

I love the conclusion


The cause of the accident is the setting of an engine power not sufficient
to maintain the altitude, having the sea landing as a consequence.

[IO540]

It must have been obvious he was up to no good, because a plane would not normally be salvaged unless there are corpses inside.

[Flyingmac]

Seems he was wearing a dry-suit. Maybe he had a premonition.

[Basil]

Quite a spot of luck really, what with all the airworthiness work due.
Who'd have known that the ECU had a data recording function?
I wonder if my car ECU has a memory?

[IO540]

Who'd have known that the ECU had a data recording function?

I thought that was widespread knowledge, used by Diamond in their "implementation" of warranty procedures.

[Jan Olieslagers]

It must have been obvious he was up to no good, because a plane would not normally be salvaged unless there are corpses inside.The official answer to that is the plane rested in very shallow waters, potentially dangerous to shipping. Sounds like there's no "notices to seafarers (m/f)" ... };-)

But we do have some fine observers round here, I'm glad to observe.

[dublinpilot]

Don't suppose anyone knows what stand the insurers took?

The AAIB seem to have made their feelings pretty clear!

[gyrotyro]

I would also like to find out what the insurers made of the fact that several components were timed out calendar wise and subject to AD's but that the AAIB said that this did not have any effect on the crash.

Who has the final word, the AAIB or the agency that produced the AD ? Was the a/c in a fit (ie legal) condition to fly with the calendar items timed out ?

[IO540]

One rarely finds out the insurance angles on a crash. Lots of rumours go around but nothing is written openly.

I know from speaking to insurers that they will pay out on just about any case of pilot negligence, and suprisingly that includes taking off overweight (a pilot error). But they won't pay out if the aircraft or crew are illegal to start with, and applicable ADs which have not been done on the last Annual would be a good enough reason IF they find out.

Saying that AD noncompliance was not a factor is reasonable. 99% of aircraft maintenance requirements can be skipped, for years. If you start with a new plane and change the oil and clean the plugs, you should not find issues for perhaps 10 years. Maybe not on a Diamond though... :) A friend ran a Renault for more than 15 years without any servicing; just topping off the oil. A plane is no different. A squirt of WD40 will keep it going for ages. The chickens will come home to roost in a big way, but only later....

Many lifed items don't need doing at all, and the same (or much bigger) fleet operated in the USA without lifed items shows there is no safety improvement whatsoever over EASA's lifed item requirements.

[cats_five]

The official answer to that is the plane rested in very shallow waters, potentially dangerous to shipping. Sounds like there's no "notices to seafarers (m/f)" ... };-)
<snip>


Think there are. And there are regular chart updates - some poor soul used to get the job of marking them all up using the correct purple ink and pen, and a long job it was on a ship that was carrying a full (worldwide) set of charts.

Notices to Mariners (http://www.ukho.gov.uk/ProductsandServices/MartimeSafety/Pages/NMPublic.aspx)

New obstructions in shallow water can be marked by dropping a warning buoy or buoys.

Will this plane get recovered?

Edit - they probably still do get the job. Even though there is all sorts of digital GPS stuff for navigating ships these days, I believe they still carry all the stuff to do it the old-fashioned way - charts, chronometer, sextant, compass, tide tables and the rest.

[Flying Lawyer]

IO540 I know from speaking to insurers that they will pay out on just about any case of pilot negligence
I don't doubt that is what you've been told but I know, from my experience as an aviation lawyer, it is not correct.
The decision to pay or deny liability depends upon several factors. They include the size of the claim and whether the insurer can argue that the negligence was negligent endangering.

Even if you were correct, it would still be an unsatisfactory state of affairs IMHO. ie There's a big difference between knowing you are covered even if negligent (eg motor insurance) and hoping you are covered if negligent (aviation insurance).

But they won't pay out if the aircraft or crew are illegal to start with
The size of the claim is a factor but, broadly, that is correct. Even where the illegality was a minor technicality which had no relevance whatsoever to the cause of the accident, there is a high risk that insurers will refuse to pay.

Why the difference in approach?
Because it is easier for insurers to deny liability under the policy where the illegality cannot be disputed. Negligence is a matter of opinion whereas licensing/documentation illegality is usually a matter of fact/record.

.

[funfly]

Back to our 'top pilot', I understand from the club newsletter that that the CAA suspended David Lloyd in July 2009. Is there any news on the court case, this seems to have dragged on for a long time.

[Whopity]

According to his son, the case had been delayed to at least August; it may have been extended further.

[funfly]

There might be some pilots who make themselves unpopular and who do stupid things. Whatever you may think of them personally, it is unfortunate that anyone whose livelihood has been jeopardised and who lives with the suspicion of a serious crime has to wait for so long to get matters clarified.

[Daffydil]

Trial of "top pilot" David Lloyd, cfi at Mona Flying Club, and four others -
Paul Roche, David Watson, Richard McArthur and Mathew Lockwood - was on the list for Court 54 at QEII Law Courts, Derby Square, Liverpool today. Anybody heard anything?

[Daffydil]

from WalesOnline
Ex-servicemen smuggled £3.5m of cocaine into Anglesey airfield - Wales News - News - WalesOnline (http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/2011/02/17/ex-servicemen-smuggled-3-5m-of-cocaine-into-anglesey-airfield-91466-28190069/)
the trial appears to be underway

A former RAF pilot and an ex-British soldier were part of a “team” which smuggled cocaine worth £3.5 million into the UK in a light aircraft, a court heard today.
The 14kg of drugs, which had a wholesale value of around £630,000, were smuggled into Mona airfield in Anglesey from Le Touquet, France, in July 2009 in a private plane owned by David Watson, 54, from Prestwich, Manchester.
Liverpool Crown Court heard he was part of a group of men who conspired to smuggle the class A drugs into the country by using his single engine four-seater plane.
Michael Taylor, opening the case for the prosecution, said the plane was piloted by David Lloyd, 65, from Anglesey – a former RAF pilot and flying instructor.


The drugs were picked up in France by former soldier Mathew Lockwood, 29, from Prestwich.
Also involved in the plot were Richard McArthur, 45, from Carrickfergus, Northern Ireland, and Paul Roche, 55, from Prestwich.
Mr Taylor told the jury of eight men and four women that when the smuggling took place Watson was in the USA but that he “was in control of the operation”.
“Mona is near to where Lloyd lives and David Watson’s private plane was kept in a hanger there.
“There was a flying club there. Lloyd was a very experienced pilot. He was formerly a pilot with the RAF and was a trainer at the flying club,” said Mr Taylor.
Roche and Lockwood were also on the flight.
When it touched down in France, Lockwood went to pick up the drugs from McArthur.
However, the court heard that it is McArthur’s case that he did not know the package contained cocaine. He claims he was told it was cannabis and was acting as a courier.
The same three men then flew back to Mona airfield where the plane was searched by police and the cocaine was found.
Mr Taylor said blocks of cocaine were found neatly packed in the base of a pilot’s bag, which Lockwood was using.
Other blocks of cocaine were found stashed in a pillow case and one was found lying lose in the plane, the court heard.
Mr Taylor said: “The focus of the trial is likely to be whether the four defendants on trial were members of a cocaine smuggling team. The fact that it was a team effort is unlikely to be disputed. It’s obvious it was.
“The drugs were in France and handed over by McArthur to Lockwood.”

[Vizsla]

Terrible inflation on the price of Coke since the original arrest :eek:

[BEagle]

Michael Taylor, opening the case for the prosecution, said the plane was piloted by David Lloyd, 65, from Anglesey – a former RAF pilot and flying instructor.

Mr Lloyd has never been an RAF pilot, he was an RAF Air Loadmaster. He was also a civil Flight Instructor.

[BoeingExile]

Crazy Monkey said:

"Just found out he is on bale with a tag and has been charged by the police. Apparently he was under surveilance for 8 months beforehand. If he's innocent, I hope he clears his name...but now looking like a strong case As RAF Mona is a military airfield, I wonder what supervsion there was of his activities?"

That is quite an incriminating claim about surveilance that you have made there, can you back it up? I suspect not as I know it to be untrue. And, exactly what supervision do you think flying instructor and examiner be placed under ?

BEagle,
Don't worry, Mr. Lloyd has made no claim to have been a RAF pilot. That misunderstanding is merely a result of HMRC's thorough investigations. In fact, it was at Mr. Lloyd's request that the prosecution barrister corrected himself in court.

For those who seem to be mildly entertained by this situation just bear in mind that the case finally reached court on the 15th Feb 2010, almost 19 months after the original arrest. Since then Mr. Lloyd has had his bank accounts frozen and his license suspended. He has therefore had no access to funds or any way of continuing in employment, unlike the other defendants who could and can continue to work.

[Daffydil]

I know that D J Lloyd was not an RAF pilot but obviously Mr Michael Taylor does not, As a barrister he tells the jury what he has been told by the investigating officers so he has been misinformed by someone.

[Sir George Cayley]

Always a tad skeptical about posts defending defendants especially when it's the first from that moniker.

Sir George Cayley

[flybymike]

I would defend a defendant's rights to defend himself against speculative assumptions from people who probably know bugger all about the case.

[BoeingExile]

flybymike,

Good point. For the record, I am not the defendant, but I do know quite a lot about this case.

[Hen Ddraig]

BBC reporting Dave Lloyd found not guilty at Liverpool crown court this afternoon. Jury still considering verdicts on others involved.



Time to spare? Go by air.

Hen Ddraig

[camlobe]

Link to the beeb news here.

BBC News - Former RAF pilot David Lloyd cleared of drugs smuggling (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-13004057)


camlobe

[Katamarino]

I believe him; I'm sure I wouldn't notice 14kg of cocaine being loaded into my aircraft either! :suspect:

[Captain Stable]

BBC News - Cleared pilot David Lloyd returning to job at Mona club (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-13009945)

[S-Works]

I believe him; I'm sure I wouldn't notice 14kg of cocaine being loaded into my aircraft either!

Hidden in the bottom of a pilot bag..... Have you taken to searching your passengers?

Lucky for him he was tried by his peers who remained open minded to all of the evidence.......

[jez d]

From the BBC:

Other blocks of cocaine were found stashed in a pillow case and one was found lying loose in the plane.

Just for clarification - not questioning the jury's findings.

It is sickening that he had to wait 19 months, tagged and broke, before being tried.

[Hen Ddraig]

Almost the end of this story.
Aircraft owner David Watson yesterday sentenced to 20 (yes Twenty) years, Michael Cahillane got 16 years and Richard McArthur who admitted the offence got 6 years.
Michael Lockwood to be sentenced on Jun 13.



Time to spare? Go by air

Hen ddraig

[funfly]

As I said in September 2010;
There might be some pilots who make themselves unpopular and who do stupid things. Whatever you may think of them personally, it is unfortunate that anyone whose livelihood has been jeopardised and who lives with the suspicion of a serious crime has to wait for so long to get matters clarified.

[PompeyPaul]

I guess the important lesson is to remain ever vigilant as to what is happening with our planes and airfield. The more the bad guys get involved with GA the more regulated we'll become.

Personally I believe cocaine is Darwin in action. If you are stupid enough to take it, well that's genes we could do without. It is completely outflanked by my worry as to what it will do to flying if the bad guys move in. Keep an eye out, out there :eek:

[truthwillout]

In this case there were two pilots on board, Mr Paul Roche was the acting pilot Mr Lloyd was co-pilot, Mr Lockwood had booked Mr Lloyd through Mr David Watson (the plane owner) for lessons to learn to fly. He was a Friend of Watsons son Andrew Watson. Who was also charged with conspiracy.

But for the UNSAFE statements by the 3 Police officers on Anglesey . Mr Lloyd may never have been charged. The Judge in summing up told the jury to discard the 3 officers evidence as it was UNSAFE(the judges words) in my words LIES.

I was at the court for the summing up.In the case of Mr Lloyd and Mr Roche it was clear the judge did not think they were guilty and summed up that way.

Case ended Mr David Lloyd NOT GUILTY, Mr Paul Roche NOT GUILTY, Mr David Watson GUILTY 20 years, Andrew Watson GUILTY 16 years Mr Micheal Cahillane GUILTY 16 years, Mr Mathew Lockwood Guilty 6 years? I hope this clears it up a little for the guys on here that had them guilty by their comments. PS BEagle you sound bitter against LLoyd

[Whopity]

Your first sentence is incorrect. You cannot have a co-pilot on a single pilot aircraft. If there is an instructor on board acting as an instructor, then he is Pilot in Command and legally the Captain of the aircraft, not a co-pilot!

[BEagle]

PS BEagle you sound bitter against Lloyd

Not at all, I was merely correcting certain factual inaccuracies. I haven't seen Dave for some years now, but wish him well in whatever he's doing these days.

He always had a twinkle in his eye when I used to work with him!