Grass Strips

[1800ed]

I have done all of my flight training on hard runways so far, and if all goes well I'll be getting my licence pretty soon...

Is it advisable to have instruction on a grass strip landings/take offs on your first few go's? I'm already making plans for places to visit!

[L'aviateur]

To be honest, I never recieved any instructions the first time I landed on a grass strip, P1. The only thing I was told when I called for PPR at the airfield was not to perform excessive braking. Since then, even in the summer I try to make the landings as gentle as possible and really minimise the braking, even if it means using the full length of the strip, just as a courtesy to the airfield. I find landings on grass much easier and smoother, but takeoffs always seem to bumpier and feel as though they take an eternity longer (as you'd expect, and as per the performance figures)

I have recently been flying at a busy grass strip in Germany where you're encouraged to vacate as early as possible, even if still going quite fast. I tried this when it was wet, and did realise that application of brakes and trying to turn slightly results in sliding sideways towards the runway markers. I won't be doing that again in a hurry.

[tacpot]

Yes, it is worth having some instruction if you've only trained on hard runways.

Things that are different about grass runways:

braking distances can be very variable, depending on how wet or dry the grass is
takeoff acceleration can be impacted by the length of the grass
it can be hard to see the runways if the length of the grass has been allowed to allowd to get too close to that of the surrounding area
the perspective of the runway on approach can seem different (but it isn't really)
grass runways often have many less markings compared to their paved counterparts, centre lines, numbers.
Airfields with grass runways often also have grass taxiways that can be more difficult to see.
Airfields with grass runways can be hard to see period!You should definitely plan to come to Derby and also go to Netherthorpe. Both are great airfields to visit.

Good luck

[Fly-by-Wife]

If you go to Netherthorpe, make sure you are in an aircraft that can get in and out! Pretty short runways there.

Always make sure that you remember to make the recommended allowances and add safety factors when doing performance calcs for grass strips.

It is commonplace to be requested to land to the left or right of the centreline to spread the wear - in fact the centreline is usually the bumpiest line! So be prepared for that. Keep the weight off the nosewheel as much as possible when landing and taking off.

tacpot is absolutely right - taxiways and runways can be very hard to see when you are on the ground, so be prepared to stop and ask if in doubt.

You should taxi a good deal more slowly on grass to prevent prop strikes and stone damage, and if there's a mixture of tarmac & grass, be extra careful when moving from one to the other - try to cross the join at 45 degrees if possible.

FBW

[1800ed]

Thanks for the help! I'm sure I'll be able to bribe an instructor with a cup of tea in return for flying to a grass strip with me...

[Molesworth 1]

I'm surprised your instructor hasn't taken you to a grass strip as yet. There's nothing to it. Landing is softer.

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Plus you're likely to be thrown up into the air by a bump during the take-off run ... this does not mean that you're flying, and if you aren't, then pulling back on the stick would be exactly the wrong thing to do.

[ExSp33db1rd]

......... and look out for the gorse ! I'm really slick at changing a tyre now, but it isn't funny at an outfield - no spares, wrong tools ! Happens a lot at my home field, despite frequent complaints to the management; sprayed gorse dies but sets like concrete, far worse than the growing stuff.

I'm told that Scots immigrants 'imported' gorse into NZ eons ago, because they felt homesick !! Maybe it's just a tale, but it's sure taken off. Maori say it isn't " native " and blame the Pakeha.

Oh yes, and beware of undulating surfaces if you have a long prop. !

[Donalk]

Like you I got used to my paved home runway during training (2500m) but found the transition to grass was a relative non event. The main observation I would make is the apparent difficulty in maintaining a good circuit shape due to the 'softer' visual reference you have from circuit altitude.

A paved runway is hard to miss whereas the grass tends to get absobed into the surrounding countryside making it harder to fly a nice rectangular pattern. The problem disappears once you have done it a few times though.

[Cessna WG]

1800ed, I learned in the US 18 months ago, at a fully towered airport with 7,000'+ runways and on return to the Uk bought into a 150 and fly it from its grass strip, 800m with trees at one end and a single oak tree on the centreline at the other, with both thresholds slightly higher than the rest of the runway, a road and railway line alongside and under the combined MATZ of two busy RAF training airfields ... my 'training'for this was the check ride on the 150 with the guy who's share I bought. Challenging, but easy after a few landings.

I don't even think twice about this now, and have no problem in realising it's so much safer to go around if you're not happy with first attempt, I did it in training and have done it over here, last time was at Breighton, during their fly-in, in front of so many people... no worries

PS - if you're up in Lincolnshire and want to try it out ...

cheers
WG

[batninth]

......... and look out for the gorse

Not just the gorse, molehills, hares & deer too.

Landed once when I was training there were three deer stood on the runway at the other end. Taxied up in order to turn around & take-off again and they just stood looking as if to say "We were here first mate".

Revved the engine & they eventually moved off just into the longer grass whilst I did what I needed to. After take off I turned back towards the field & they'd gone back onto the runway, I guess one was saying to the others "Typical b*****y human, there's three runways here & he had to choose the one we were having lunch at..."

[Tail-take-off]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned take-off flap settings. Most of the aircraft I have flown are quite happy taking off from a hard runway without any flap but I would recommend using flaps for take off on grass. See individual aircraft flight manuals for recommendations.

I would treat every grass runway as performance limited (for take off & landing) due to the number of variables. Ie length of grass, moisture level, firmness of surface etc.

By the way I wouldn't recommend either Netherthorpe or Derby for a first visit to grass. They are bith just a bit short for comfort. Try somewhere like Hucknall, or Sywell.