My lips are on fire

[flyboy1818]

A more light hearted, yet techincal post:

An ATPL AGK manual that I am currently reading states: Grease and oil should not be present in an oxygen system as this may cause combustion to occur........

Now heres my question: We have a smoke incident in the cockpit and the masks are donned, 100% oxygen is selected. One of the Pilots is wearing lip balm for his cracked lips, whats the chance if any that they will catch on fire?

[piggybank]

I would assume the balm would start a fire. Was there not an incident with an RAF pilot many years back, 20 at least. As I remember it, he ate a cheese sandwich then used an oxygen mask. Maybe someone else can remember this event?

[Dan Winterland]

Oil and grease can combust with oxygen. This goes for margarine as well. And yes, as far as I know there has been more than one incident with burning margarine. I used to fly a long range aircraft where we had to wear oxygen masks. Butter had to be used in the crew sandwiches.

[411A]

Butter had to be used in the crew sandwiches.


Better for you as well, make no mistake.

[Exup]

I can just see the headlines now " Pilot spontaneously combusts over the Atlantic , Packed Lunch to blame"

[angels]

Chemistry is definitely not my strong point, but are you telling me that margarine and pure oxygen = spontaneous combustion under some circumstances??

Can anyone please provide examples of incidents where this has happened? I'm fascinated.

Thanks.

[west lakes]

Safety Data Sheet for breathable oxygen

Safety Data Sheets - BOC UK (http://www.bocsds.com/uk/sds/)

Note the hazards

[stevef]

From Flight International, 10th Oct 1987
st bernard | bernard plastics | threat assess | 1987 | 2061 | Flight Archive (http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=4&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.flightglobal.com%2Fpdfarchive%2Fview%2F 1987%2F1987%2520-%25202061.html&ei=k7jsSYvyDZK2_AaxmuXxAw&usg=AFQjCNGAEQEiPeLxLVBd5ZQGdbzTaiREXA&sig2=VT9Svj-7tJX3kQ_wBc4jLQ)

I'm sure that happened to an RAF pilot in identical circumstances many years ago. Possibly mentioned in Airclues.

[angels]

Well, my gast is flabbered!

Thanks gents!

[EpsilonVaz]

This also took me by surprise, as during flights I use "Vaseline lip care". Captain turned to me and said "What's in that?", so I looked and it said "100% Petrolium Jelly". He then asked what happens when you put 100% Oxygen to a fuel.

I was very surpised, it had never crossed my mind.

[Exaviator]

What about all those female airline pilots and their lippy. :ooh:

[Gulfstreamaviator]

Perhaps these should be banned along with toe nail clippers and tubes of super glue.

glf

[Sleeve_of_Wizard]

MYTHBUSTERS tested this very same scenario................. If i remember correctly, their dummy had a little bit of flame after about the 3rd attempt to Combust him.

[john_tullamarine]

(a) I lump MythBusters in the "not-very-rigorously-done-but-definitely-for-popular-entertainment-consumption" class of investigative authorities

(b) we had a case in Oz, not all that long ago, where a surgical patient died as a result of oxygen igniting a (presumably synthetic) stent in the trachea .. same sort of consideration

(c) most of us have seen various training films (or demonstrations) wherein an oxygen stream ignites a flammable substance without any external ignition


I think the earlier comment I was very surpised, it had never crossed my mind is pertinent for most folks.

Russian Roulette probably is an apt term to apply to careless use of oxygen ....

[Old Smokey]

It was a part of our safety training in the sixties, that if a female passenger was to be administered oxygen, her lips must first be thoroughly cleaned of lipstick (Men didn't wear lipstick in those days, well, not many). The reason was that in those times, lipstick contained Petroleum Jelly, and there was a significant risk of severe lip burns.

Petroleum Jelly is no longer a base for modern lipstick (or so I'm told).

Regards,

Old Smokey

[Gttztt]

I remember hearing this story back in the eighties at Abingdon. This time he was a rigger carrying out oxy flow checks in an F4 over lunch. He chomped on the cheddar sarnie and his teeth blew out! Another urban myth perhaps? :}

[INNflight]

I used to work as a paramedic driving ambulances and you'd be surprised what can happen if the oxygen bottle is not closed properly after use.

Example that was used teaching us:

Two paramedics had a smoke outside their car during a break, oxygen bottle not closed properly >>> both suffered life-threatening burns. :uhoh:

Not sure if I'd want to risk it :=

[flyboy1818]

I amazed at the responses, I thought it would be technically possible but never actually occur, but this thread proves the point that it could be very dangerous indeed!

[Exaviator]

Anyone notice the Lip Balm "Promo" at the bottom of this page?

[ray cosmic]

Our cabin crew always had to make sure to wipe the an "incapacitated" pilot's mouth before fixing the oxygen mask during training. I thought it was industry standard.

[john_tullamarine]

Our cabin crew always had to make sure to wipe the an "incapacitated" pilot's mouth

.. it's not often that I have such difficulty restraining myself from making an inappropriate response ..

[john_tullamarine]

Nothing on your face will ignite ?

The report appears to be saying that the substances tested have certain characteristics.

By inference, given that there are records from the other side of the table, it suggests that one ought to test a substance prior to risk exposure ?

[oil additive]

Now gaseous oxygen is a right nasty thing, but liquid oxygen (LOX) can be very very nasty indeed.

I live in Perth, Western Australia and frequently ride my bike around our beautiful rivers. We have a bit of an algae problem in the rivers over the summer months and they've set up oxygenation stations along the river banks that use very large LOX tanks as the supply. What always amazes me is the close proximity to houses and infrastructure that these tanks are installed. One of them is right under a major freeway bridge. I wonder if the average punter knew that they were basically next to a 40 kiloton bomb if one of these tanks were to rupture and explode. :eek:

Very interseting reading this thread. It's made me have a look at what's in my sun protective lip balm that's for sure! :uhoh: