FAA PPL flying "G" reg aircraft

[cambioso]

PLEASE can someone point me to the part of the ANO that allows FAA PPL holders to fly "G" reg aircraft within the UK?
Please don't post "I'm sure that"s, or "I believe"s or "I was told"s or "I'm certain that"s bacause I can get plenty of those around any flying club bar!!
I want the definative reference please.
Sorry to sound so Bolshy guys, but it's late and I've just been trawling through the bloody ANO, and I'm buggered if I can find it.........
Nighty night,

Jez Cooke

[mm_flynn]

26 (4) (ANO 2007)


(4) For the purposes of this Part of this Order:
(a) subject to sub-paragraph (b), a licence granted either under the law of a
Contracting State other than the United Kingdom but which is not a JAA licence
or a licence granted under the law of a relevant overseas territory, purporting in
either case to authorise the holder to act as a member of the flight crew of an
aircraft, not being a licence purporting to authorise him to act as a student pilot
only, shall, unless the CAA gives a direction to the contrary, be deemed to be a
licence rendered valid under this Order but does not entitle the holder:
(i) to act as a member of the flight crew of any aircraft flying for the purpose
of public transport or aerial work or on any flight in respect of which he
receives remuneration for his services as a member of the flight crew; or
(ii) in the case of a pilot's licence, to act as pilot of any aircraft flying in
controlled airspace in circumstances requiring compliance with the
Instrument Flight Rules or to give any instruction in flying;
(b) a JAA licence shall, unless the CAA gives a direction to the contrary, be deemed
to be a licence rendered valid under this Order.

[Henry Hallam]

There's no limit to "within the UK".

[Whopity]

26 (4) (ANO 2007)Actually we are still on: The Air Navigation Order 2005 (SI 2005 No. 1970)*from the 2008 amendment.

[cambioso]

That's absolutely perfect thanks Guys!! Just what I was looking for.
Best wishes,
Jez (less grumpy now!)

[Mike Cross]

Now all that's needed is for the FAA to reciprocate:ugh:

[IO540]

Now all that's needed is for the FAA to reciprocate

They do. It's called the 61.75 license, and is readily issued to any ICAO license holder.

The FAA doesn't allow ICAO license holders to fly N-reg planes in US airspace but they don't need to, because they offer this very easy validation. A point lost on EASA ;)

[englishal]

And not only that, the feds will recognise your IR as well with just a written test.

Oh if only it were so easy here.....well it is, in France, if you are a NON EU RESIDENT. I wonder how being NON EU makes you competent enough to be issued a JAA IR on the back of an FAA IR but being an EU resident means you are not competent enough?

odd that ;)

[IO540]

the feds will recognise your IR as well with just a written test.

Indeed.

However, the FAA does this only for piggyback (61.75) FAA PPLs. If you have a standalone FAA PPL or CPL then the foreign pilot IR route is not available (I am told).

That French validation for non EU residents only is such a crude trade protection scam... only the French could do something so "in your face" and get away with it. In the UK, they at least follow the Yes Minister guidelines to put at least a proper veneer of respectability on things ;)

[Mike Cross]

They do. It's called the 61.75 license, and is readily issued to any ICAO license holder.

Your concept of "readily" and my own are clearly at variance.

If an FAA license holder wishes to fly G Reg in UK airspace he can, with no formality.

If a UK license holder wishes to fly N Reg in US airspace he fills in this form (http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/media/verify61-75.pdf) and sends it with a copy of his license and medical. Because he's from the UK then he first needs to fill in form SRG1160 from our own wonderful CAA and pay them a fee (I believe it's 40 quid) so that they can send verificatiion of his license to the FAA. A similar arrangement is required if he has an Australian license (why are the Brits and Australians singled out for this treatment?)

Having done all that he has to present himself in person to a FSDO in the USA or to a DPE (and pay him a fee) from one of the Field Offices at some pre-arranged future date.

The UK recognition of the FAA license and the FAA 61.75 process (and I have one) are not quite equivalent n'est ce pas?

Oh, and by the way our cousin from across the pond flies on his own license with his own ratings and does not have to do our bienniel hour with an instructor but the 61.75 holder doesn't and has to do the US BFR.

I think I have that right but am happy to be corrected.

[BackPacker]

(why are the Brits and Australians singled out for this treatment?)

Because the Brits and the Australians have privacy laws which forbids their respective CAAs to release your details (needed for the verification) to the FAA, unless you explicitly give permission.

[mm_flynn]

Personally I think the FAA system is better. Minimal fuss (not their fault the UK CAA is so OTT) to acknowledge that you are competent to fly and 'validate' your licence, but a bit of diligence to make sure you are familiar with the rules of US Airspace.

It is a bit slack that I could have jumped into a G-Reg plane and flown around the UK with not 1 second of advice/training on - the fact flight following doesn't exist, IFR without a clearance is perfectly normal, you really can't over fly a TMA, the airways really are Class A at 3500 ft, PPR as a concept exists, you don't close your flightplan, and buying fuel doesn't get you free landings!

[B2N2]

Having read the excerpt of ANO 2007 (and going dyslectic)
I see no reason as to why a FAA PPL holder would not be able to fly a G-reg at night in UK airspace. I'm 99% sure they can.
Any comments?

[IO540]

As far as the ANO is concerned, I think you are right. The problem is that the FARs require an Instrument Rating for any IFR flight, and most night flight in the UK is "IFR".

This is one of aviation's sleeping dogs which TMK has never been resolved.

[cambioso]

IO540 and B2N2.................
I thought I said no "I think"s and no (implied) "99% sure"s didn't I? - I would "do" the waggly finger Smilie, but it's beyond me!!!
Now I started this thread, it's mine, and I thought it up all on my own so please don't let it degenerate into conjecture - there's quite enough of that on these posts eh?
Thanks,
Jez
P.S. I would do the "I'm kidding" Smilie, but it's beyond me!!

[B2N2]

Now I started this thread, it's mine, and I thought it up all on my own

I do apologize for asking a related question and not starting my own (useless) thread.
It's yours to keep have fun with it..enjoy..live a little...:ugh:

W:mad:nker


PS Thanks IO540

[cambioso]

These "colonials" just don't get our sense of humour eh....................?
Jez (the W*nker)

[Dreadful]

So let me get this right, if I apply with a 61.75 and an SRG1160 for a FAA PPL on the back of my UK PPL, I have to physically make an appearance at a FSDO in the USA to get the licence? Can't this be done remotely?

Also my MEP rating has expired. If I want to fly a G reg Seneca with my FAA PPL, how would I go about getting an FAA MEP rating and do I have to do an annual flight test to renew it?

[englishal]

Also my MEP rating has expired. If I want to fly a G reg Seneca with my FAA PPL, how would I go about getting an FAA MEP rating and do I have to do an annual flight test to renew it?
You do the FAA ME flight test (there are no minimum hours) though you will have to do stuff like a Vmc demo as part of the test. I originally did my private ME rating from scratch in 10 hours inc test...but I guess if you have flown and done the G reg ME rating then it would be less for you. No annual test to renew. Your standard FAA BFR revalidates all ratings. You would need TSA and Visa to do it though.

You can get your 61.75 certificate in the UK but it will cost you £3-400. It is free in the USA.

[Dreadful]

Thanks Englishal.

Any pointers as to whom and where I can pay the £300-£400 and get the 61.75 done in the UK would be appreciated. Have you any idea where I look to find the UK based FAA ME examiners?

[S-Works]

Dreadfull, a 61.75 is a validation. You still need the underlying licence to be fully valid to use it. What on earth would you want to get a 61.75 fir if not flying in the USA? If flying in the USA you pick it up out there free of charge.