The mystery of the 757

[MUFC_fan]

We know that the 737 and 747 are the two machines that made Boeing what they are, or should be today, but the 757 is truely an amazing machine but was it before it's time?

The aircraft is the most efficient in it's class, can use runways much shorter than the Airbus alternative and, for aircraft lovers, it's engines don't sound bad either!:ok:

The 739ER is supposed to be the new replacement for the 757 on the short haul sectors but what is the replacement for it on the longer flights? The 787? But surely this carries more passengers than the 757?

Airlines such as DL and CO are increasing becoming aware of how lucrative these aircraft can be on TATL flights to small cities to feed their domestic and North/South American operations flying from airports such as BRS and BFS. Will the 787 replace these in the years to come?

I would probably guess at no, but please correct me if I am wrong. If not - what is going to replace them? Personally I think they should bring the aircraft back, make the winglets as standard and maybe look at new engines with a similar power but more efficient.

Would this work?

Thanks.

[NWSRG]

The 757 is a fabulous machine...did Belfast - Newark earlier this year, and it was my first 757 flight for quite a while. Brought back to me just how capable it is...and how big a wing it has!

As for the future, it's that big wing that needs to be replicated to have a true 757 replacement. Maybe the 737 replacement will have a specific model with a larger wing (spanwise would be easiest) and the engines to match.

I believe the 757 design was supposed to offer 727 field performance, with a larger payload, from the hot & high fields in the states such as Denver...

[WindSheer]

The 75 is an operational marvel!!

[Buster the Bear]

G-MONC is being carved up at Lasham, some of the airframes are 25 years old and high on cycles, reduced to baked bean cans is inevitable for them all.

[davidjohnson6]

Could you talk to beer cans instead of baked bean cans ? Would be nice to feel that the metal is being turned into something useful !

[Whitehatter]

It's just a great balance of bits, and a great balance of simplicity and toughness. Engineers used to marvel at how everything was screwed together compared to a 737-200 for instance. Much simpler design philosophy and superb build quality.

It's one of those sweet spot aircraft like the A330-200 with Trents. Fly it across the pond and it fits the route like a glove, fly it shorthaul or in UK charter config and it still turns in a great set of numbers if you allow for flexibility.

For a British inspired design it ain't bad! Just a crying shame that our version wasn't built and flown as it would have been essentially the same aircraft but 15 years earlier.

[PAXboy]

As I understand it, the 75 replacing the 72 also replicated it's high fuel burn? Perhaps this was more amongst the earlier models? Doubtless the machine was well built and so will weigh more than current medium haul twins. So it seems that weight and (possibly) fuel burn, will prevent further instances?

I agree wholeheartedly that it is an utterly beautiful machine and one that falls into the small category of a/c that look so right. I have been known to select particular rotations on a route, so as to get on a 75 in preference to anything else..

[qwertyuiop]

The 757 ticks all the right boxes. Its performance allows it remain the king of the UK charter market. Short, medium and long haul, short field it does the lot better than the rest.
From a pilots point of view it's perfect. Need to Go Around, the Rollers will fire you away from the ground in a second. Land long or short field the brakes will stop you immediately with no overheat problems. Short field T/O? So what, we have the power. The FMC/MCP is way more pilot friendly than the AB MCDU/FCU. Looks, spot on (except -300).
Reliable? You bet, a well looked after 757 is the ops staff's dream.

I believe (hope!!) the 787 will be the true succesor to this fantastic aircraft. Same performance but lower DOC.

[RAFAT]

Have never flown one but it's a truly beautiful aeroplane - long legs & big you-know-whats!

[aztruck]

757. Trents? Did I miss something? Now then.....757....bit more composite in the fuselage......uprated engines....winglets......just a mo...isnt that a 787?
Boeing were mad not to see it. Sat in the last one to roll off the line, 1,050 I believe.
Boeing keep one as a testbed. it will be a while before they all turn into bean cans.Lots of life as a freighter. Hot, high, 180 minute etops, payload unrestricted, if you can fill it you can take off, almost anywhere at max weight. Ditto landing, beats the 737 hands down

[Buster the Bear]

YouTube - 757 going vertical (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=mVUDMkBfds4)

[A300Man]

I love the 757. For many years in the late seventies and eighties, I was a very frequent pax on Boeing 737-200's (mainly operated by Britannia Airways in the UK). Then, in 1984, I flew along with the rest of my family to one of the infamous Spanish "Costas" on a BA757 - in the days when it bore the "British" titles with large "757" just ahead of the aft door. The aircraft was registered G-BIKK, and was only two or three days new out the box. I was entirely amazed at how it performed with a very short take off roll, steep climb and quiet to boot.

The overall experience was probably enhanced by the fact that the cabin layout was in traditional "scheduled" configuration, whilst the flight we operated was a charter flight. Therefore, in comparison to the 737, there appeared to be acres of space inside.

I have since flown on 75's of several carriers globally. The aircraft still remains a firm favourite. On my (rarer) visits back to Europe and the need to fly with BA, I am still thrilled when my hops around Europe are performed on a 757, as opposed to one of the Airbus types!

In fact, looking out of my office window right now near to the approach to Dubai Airport, Friday is something of a "757" day, with examples landing in the colours of Finnair, Ethiopian, Vim and - right now as I type this - Baltic Airlines (?), with winglets? Didn't know they had 757's!

Long may it live!

[smith]

Pity flyglobespan's 757 is not as reliable as the others mentioned here:D

[The Real Slim Shady]

What's the max range, with reserves, with a full passenger load?

[757flyer]

3900 NM without winglets 4100 NM with winglets

[BANDIT12]

A truly remarkable aircraft and yes it was ahead of its time in 1983. My memories of this aircraft was of it replacing the Trident 3s on the LHR BFS LHR shuttle run, (infact it was the first BA revenue passenger service)
The glass cockpit was a revelation compared to the other analogue aircraft cockpits of the day and the performance was something to be marveled at. Even though the BA aircraft had the downrated RR211 C compared with Monarch's E4 engines it was still able to depart BFS from the R/W 25 Bravo intersection.
Although i never flew the aircraft i had on occasions to visit the flight deck and talk with the crews and you could just tell they loved to fly it.
One of my alltime favourite aircraft and i still love to watch them.

[aztruck]

....and didja know it had a t tail to begin with? 727 fuselage stuck on a trident wing but swept forward to avoid all the droops/slats and contrivances to get the Trident airborne.
Airlines didnt like the look so conventional tail reverted to, then the fuel crisis that precipitated the demise of the 727 ended and airlines kept their old 72's.
Result? 767/757 hybrid for economies of scale in manufacture.
Trouble was, the flight deck of the 76(wide body) wouldnt fit on the narrow body 75 without a bit of jiggling around, which is why you step down to a 75 fight deck and step up to a 76, and also accounts for the unique and rather beautiful "swan's beak" look to the 75 front end. The 767 is a very conventiional Boeing look.
Now...bit more composite, winglets, uprate the engines, new avionics..wow....what a bird that would be. A narrow body 787 for a fraction of the cost.

[Tom the Tenor]

Just beats me why Boeing shut the 757 line. Is the fuel performance on 737-900/ERs with the CFM-56s just so much better than the 757 on, say, flights up to 5 hours plus?

Watching the full Arkia 757-300 get off Cork's r/w 35 just north of the intersection on the way to Tel Aviv was some sight to behold. What performance!

[BelArgUSA]

A lot - really -
xxx
When it rolled out of Seattle factory, appeared to be (and was) the replacement for 727, with in fact, about the fuselage dimensions and cross-section of the 707 and the 727-200... I saw that airplane continue to be produced well beyond year 2000. Well beyond the production of the 737 new versions.
xxx
One thing, it came initially with the designation "757-200" - letting me believe there would be a shorter/lighter "757-100" one day, as much as I expected the production of a "757-300" in view of its "higher landing gear" permitting the fuselage to be stretched. Boeing had been unable to stretch the 707 as Douglas did on the DC-8 because of its low landing gear.
xxx
But the 757-100 never came. And while the CFM versions of the 737-200 were to be expected (300-400-500), I was somewhat surprised at Boeing dumping the 757 production and see them drawing plans for the newer current versions of the 737, known as the 700-800-900... After all, Boeing was stretching an airplane from... the 1960s. Quite an older design.
xxx
A nice thing to me was the commonality of 757/767 pilot ratings. Convenient to have airlines with a fleet of both types, and crews who can operate either type of aircraft.
xxx
So that is where Boeing leaves the 757 aircraft. I never flew one, but it is the only "twin" I would have been attracted to be qualified as pilot. I always liked the 757 rides as a passenger, with its "single aisle" compared to the "crowded sensation" of the twin aisle wide body airplanes. And despite my dislike of twin airplanes ETOPS (as I was a 747 pilot with 4 motors), I did not mind crossing a 2,000 NM stretch of ocean, with a nice 757.
xxx
Yes, there will be 757 flying for long, many probably with 220+ Y class passengers when the airlines get tired of having their F class cabin for airline executives or employees on free pass travel. And there will be numerous 757 freighters converted from passenger airplanes, to continue operating them for long.
xxx
Hey Boss (I know you read my lines often) -
You do not need F class to enjoy your free travel with extra legroom. Learn to sip your Courvoisier(s) from an overwing exit seat with extra legroom, and a future Diego Maradona banging on the back of your seat. Thanks for the gold Rolex anyway. Probably was company funds, not from your wallet. As for smoking your stinking cigars, are the guys still letting you puff them, on the flight deck...?
¡Y con respecto, Patrón! - Me gusta ser jubilado...
xxx
:E
Happy contrails

[HAWK21M]

Overpowered flying machine :)
Working on the B752SF & B752PCF for years in Maintenance.Fantastic type.
regds
MEL

[lbalad]

As a passenger only,I love the noise of the engines as they spool up for take off run.

Just flown Jet2 LBA-SSH on the winglet fitted 757 and with a full load it was airborne from 32 before the tunnel,for those that know the airport.Impressive.

[MUFC_fan]

Flew on a wingletted 757 to KEF last year and it went like sh*t off a shovel from GLA's runway - stops in good time to!

[wingeel]

Good to read that the 757 has so many fans. My first ever flight was on G-MONB from MAN to Athens in July '85. Wonder where she is now ?

Only last May, I had the pleasure of taking a 757 on a US domestic between Philly and Charlotte. Of the five different sectors flown on my trip (also used A330's, CR7's and EMB 190's), this was the best flight - despite turbulent, thundery conditions.

[MUFC_fan]

I think NB only left the other week to Fedex. Please correct me if I am wrong.

[Skipness One Echo]

ust beats me why Boeing shut the 757 line

Those who wanted them had them new and the second hand market was pretty active. There was no sales left in the new build B757. Same with the new build B747-400 recently too. Everything has it's time.

[V800]

G-MONB is in the breakers yard at Kemble.

[Captain_djaffar]

757...that's the one I always dreamt to fly...

[Turnberry]

Incorrect, V800.

G-MONB is in Victorville, California (along with G-MONE) awaiting conversion to freighter for FEDEX.

[philbky]

G-MONB has gone to FEDEX. For years it was (and possibly still is) the high time 757.

In 1995 I did a Gatwick-Athens-Gatwick round trip in the cockpit of this machine with a friend as FO on a glorious October Sunday. There was a computer installed behind the right hand seat which was Boeing's property and was monitoring wing box stresses. The TCAS packed up over Macedonia, just when we needed it most, but refused to misbehave when looked at on arrival at Athens. Packed up again on the return trip over Luxembourg.

First flew on a 757 on a LHR-MAN shuttle back up in the early 1980s when BA had just a couple of aircraft. Leaving sometime after 22.00 on a Friday night with just 25 on board and no SID restriction at that time of night, the performance was spectacular to say the least - especially compared to the usual Trident departure on the same route - lightly loaded or not!

[MUFC_fan]

Is she still the most fuel efficient single isle airliner in the sky?

If so, those winglets must make her super lean!

[Cyrano]

Is she still the most fuel efficient single isle airliner in the sky?

I'd doubt that it :cool: is more efficient than the A321 - newer engines, smaller wing, lower weight per seat, etc.

[MUFC_fan]

For those airlines in need of large capacity, the A321 and 737-900ER have lower trip cost, albeit with slightly fewer seats and less range.


Its a quote from Wikipedia (I know!:ok:) but it probably is true. I would however, ask every airline that has operated both the 757 and 321 and I would be surprised if there were more than 10 who said they preferred the latter.

Also, the two mentioned above wouldn't have the legs for TATL to central Europe and probably even Britain so it they are out of the question for AA, DL and CO who currently serve many secondary cities from their respective hubs on the east coast.

I assume most of you will agree, bar it's efficiency (which is still fantastic seeing as when it was first introduced), the 757 was ahead of it's time and I feel the 787 pays tribute to the success of the 757.

[boris]

757
Great aeroplane sure but an absolute barsteward to follow. Made me sit up a bit quickly a few times.

[Vapor]

While many may like the 757, it's probably not correct to say it made Boeing what it is Today.

The sucussful 727 was what really kept Boeing going until the 737 and 747 started to make money.

Of all the Boeing Commercial Jets, the 757 will probably have the most disappointing sales record when you factor in the size of industry at the time it was for sale in.

[MUFC_fan]

We have not mentioned once that it MADE Boeing or that it was one of the most successful sales wise but it sure is one of the aircraft Boeing can be most proud of.

[boeing_eng]

The 757 is certainly an impressive machine liked by many (including myself!) for the reasons already given.

However, it’s easy to forget that the design is now 30+ years old and there are several technical limitations that have been improved on in newer aircraft. For instance, the Pneumatic systems have no built in test equipment which makes diagnosing problems a nightmare! I'm sure there are plenty of Engineers who have struggled to change some of the thoughtfully located pneumatic components in the pylons of 757's only to find the defect still exists!!

Obviously, the efficiency of newer designs has also contributed to the demise of the 757. For instance, a UK operator flies 737-800's with 189 pax (vs 235 on a 757) When you factor in the reduced operating costs and lower number of Cabin crew required, the bean counters like 737-800’s!!:(

[Jet2krazey]

So why do Jet2 prefere and operate the 757, rather than the 737-800. :confused:

[Skipness One Echo]

Becasue an old B757 fleet is more in keeping with an ancient fleet of B737-300s than a new fleet of B737s?

[MUFC_fan]

The 757 is more flexible than the 737-800 and much cheaper to buy.

They have lower overheads by owning the a/c and can sit it on the ground for a much smaller cost than Ryanair and easyJet who lease theirs. By doing this it offers them much more flexibility and they can fly charters (MOD) more easily also.

Add to that the better range of the 757 (JFK) then it looks more like a better buy for the time being.

[grundyhead]

Pilot friend said that 757 power was like putting a Ferrari engine in an Austin Mini. Now there's a thought.....hmmmm.

Love the 757!!!

[boredcounter]

It's been tried (sort of) by racing drivers of the Cooper F1 team, hence the Mini Cooper in the 60's ;-) Fortunately the 75 has damn good brakes too!

We operate ours at c15 tonnes below MTOW and by all accounts a no de-rated take-off is a kick up the ar$e to be believed, that is 'till ATC and Mr Boeing spoil it with SIDs and exceedance speeds............

The 75 is like a jet 'Twotter' or Mini Cooper, ask her nicely, and she'll do the impossible. AND.......... come back for more.


I refer to all 22 as 'My girls', purely out of respect.

Well done Mr Boeing and RR.

[sevenfive]

..but its best with PWs. Simpler and more powerfull. The Ferrari of the passengerjets!

[boeing_eng]

Hmmm....strange how two of the biggest US Airlines went for RB211's then!! (AA & CO););)

[MUFC_fan]

Oh you can't beat British engineering!:ok:

Well...that's what my grandfather used to say!

Having travelled on a number of RR equipped a/c, when walking passed the engines I can often hear people's comments:

"WOW - Rolls Royce!"

Does make the aircraft sound more 'exclusive' for the non-aviators!:ok::}

[markyboy]

Just a visit to my local airport being Glasgow, shows the 757 thankfully is still a very common sight. Unfortunately it dosent seem to have been a high volume model for Boeing hence it was dropped, but it seems that those who operate it are struggling to find a suitable replacement. It does seem to be almost unique with its flexability. You can still see BA examples on the short Glasgow to Heathrow route along with Continental and US Airlines using it to the states, with Thomas Cook using it to Toronto. Then you have the mix of Thomsonfly, Monarch and Thomas Cook flights to all the holiday destinations in Europe and Africa. 737's and A321's won't do Glasgow to Egypt without a costly stop for more fuel or a heavy weight penalty. Not sure what will happen over the next few years with the long thin routes typical of European charter companies if no replacement is found. Neither Boeing or Airbus seem to recognise the void left since the 757 went out of production. The 787 seems more of a suitable replacement for the 767 rather than the 757. Maybe a long range version of the A321 is the answer if it can be done. Its a shame that when in production the 757 was so unappreciated, but now in its twilight years it is so sought after by European charter companys who make full use of its flexiblity. Ive seen articles from both Monarch and Thomas Cook who can't replace the 757 with anything in current production on certain routes. Hindsight is a great thing, maybe Boeing is now regretting not looking at a NG757? What ever happens I'm sure we will remember the 757 as a great unsung hero of the 80's, 90's and 00's. :D

[Freehills]

Interestingly AA (American) are now saying the 757 seat mile costs are "a problem" (presumably versus their 737-800)


It's unique performance was very much a serendipitous outcome of the times, and available technology (ended up being "overwinged" and "overengined"). ISTR a study that showed a huge majority of the flights it operates though (95%+ or something) don't need 757 performance. Which is why it has been replaced by B737-900ER. The 787 is a 767 replacement, not 757. Operators are just not interested in paying extra for capability they don't need

[MUFC_fan]

However - that 5% of the market is still quite important to a number of carriers and without the 757 to regional TATL flights would not have been possible. BRS and BFS wouldn't be able to even dream of a NYC connection without the aircraft.

[roverman]

Date: ??th February 1983

Place : MAN

Event: First arrival of B757

British Airways showcased the new 757 to Manchester in advance of its introduction on the Shuttle run to London. The aircraft arrived without pax, performing a low-approach and go-around on Runway 06 before making a visual circuit and landing. The event drew the customary crowd to the (now gone) South Bay. The aircraft, G-BIKA I think, parked on the old Domestic Pier at Gate 44, allowing ground staff to familiarise with the type before it departed. Regular Shuttle services began a few weeks later, followed soon after by the introduction of Monarch's first 757s on charters.

[TSR2]

The B757 currently flies to no less than 52 different destinations from Manchester.

These are:
Agadir, Alicante, Antalya, Bodrum, Burgas, Corfu, Dalaman, Faro, Fuertaventura, Gerona, Heraklion, Hurghada, Ibiza, Ilha do Sal, Kavalla, Kefallinia, Keflavik, Khania, Kos, Lanzarote, Las Palmas, Larnaca, Lourdes, Luxor, Mahon, Malaga, Malta, Marsa Alam, Mitilini, Monastir, Murcia, Naples, New York-Newark, New York-JFK, Palma, Paphos, Preveza, Pula, Reus, Rhodes, Sharm-el-Sheik, Skiathos, Split, Taba, Tel Aviv, Tenerife, Thessalonika, Thira, Toronto, Venice, Verona, Zakynthos.

I can think of no other 200+ seater aircraft that comes anywhere near this total.

[MUFC_fan]

Great list TRS2.

It really has been the aircraft that had been the catalyst in the 90s charter boom period!

[islasdad]

Interesting list TSR2 still not complete either I have flown our 75 to Kosice and Bratislava in the last couple of months too.

ID

[markyboy]

I agree with FREEHILLS posting, Airlines have got to account for every penny these days and the 757 has become almost what it set out to replace. I realise that formally the 787 is a replacement for the 767 but looking at articles in the aviation press both Monarch and First Choice,(now TUI), seem to be looking at the 787 as a replacement for their 757's. As the deliveries of the 787 get steadily pushed back many lease agreements on the 757's will be renewed as there is just no perfect replacement. It seems that the small amount of operators who rely on the flexibilty of the 757 are still going to have issues filling the gap. Maybe folk like myself who enjoy frequent breaks to the sunshire of southern Europe and further afield to get away from a cold and always wet Scotland might just need to accept that ticket prices will rise to pay for the fuel top ups on an A320 or 737. Its maybe just not profitable for manufacturers to design and build for this squeezed niche between the 737 900 ER and the 787. The good news in all this is that 75's should be about for a few years yet. To those of us who love to travel in the 757, when they do finally go it will remind us abit at the last days of Concorde, although unfortuately I can't see the 757 ever being the centre of attention at any museums.

[oceanhawk]

Markyboy.

As a TUI eployee, i can assure the 787 's on order are to replace the 767 and not the 757. The longterm plan is to have a fleet of 787 's for longhaul and 737 -800 for shorthaul. However, as much of our work is on the 757 is midhaul, i do n't see how the 737-800 will be able to do this from all the shorter runways in the UK. I hope the wonderful 757 stays around for quite along time.

[dh dragon]

Roverman
It was the 22nd of February 1983,the reg was G-BIKB and was painted in the BRITISH only livery.I travelled on a demo flight that day in this aircraft for 1 hour.We took off from MAN and flew via Pole Hill up Amber 1 to Prestwick then back via Black Head and the Isle of Man then Airway Red 3 via Wallasey back to MAN.I visited the flight deck en route.A great day out and thanks for reminding me

[markyboy]

Thank Oceanhawk for the good news that the 757 should be about for another while or so. I admit not working directly in aviation so my knowledge is based on what I read in aviation mags. I am quoting them right but the information must be wrong or has changed since published. Good to see so many supporters of this model! Just booked another flight to the sunshine with Thomas Cook this winter, paid for exit seats which confirmed a return trip on another 757, great!

[Skipness One Echo]

Yes the amazing B757 that replace the thirsty Trident with more fuel economical and super powerful engines. BA would go on to buy roughly fifty examples for mainline and Caledonian.

EXCEPT they'll all be gone by next summer. We're getting nostalgic about that shiny new aircraft that's not so new.......the inescapable conclusion? We're getting old! Soon there will be spotters who will never have seen a BA B757.
ERK!!!

[HZ123]

I think they will be gone by the end of this summer!

[CarltonBrowne the FO]

markyboy, a longer ranger 321 would be a really useful thing to have- I've sat in a number of Middle East airfields looking at the OFP and the forecast headwind and wishing we could put on another tonne of fuel.
Unfortunately there are two problems. The less serious one is the size of the fuselage- you can fit in some extra tankage (several of ours will hold 21T, a bit more if the fuel is cold enough) but eventually the extra tanks start to cost hold space.
With some revised loading procedures, you might fit some fuel into the tail, but that would still come up against the more serious problem- the wing just isn't big enough. At 79 tonnes we are really struggling to get above FL330- any more weight and the cruise starts to get into turboprop country. What some of our routes really need is a 322- a 321 body with about 10% more wing. I don't see that coming into production anytime soon.
Anyway, this is really thread creep- like most of the posters here I have always loved the 757, although it seems unlikely I will ever fly one. I hope to see them around for many years to come.

[SCANDIC]

Yeah i have to agree the 757 is a fantastic aircraft and very reliable too. I've not been in a 757 for quite a while. I always fly the 757 on the flightsim 2004. It breaks my heart to see them being broken up, it was like the end of an era for Monarch when they broke a couple of theirs up earlier this year.:ok::ok::ok::ok::ok::ok:

[wheelbarrow]

First time I'd ever flown was in 1985 as a pax on B757 and I thought it was awesome - the sheer power and acceleration.
After the holiday I stopped in the services on the drive home and bought a couple of magazines to find out how to become a pilot - it made that much of an impression on me.
The next time I flew in any jet aircraft was 10 years later as a F/O on the B757.
It was everything I thought it would be and still is today.
I never tire or get bored flying her as she will always catch out the unwary.
A go anywhere do anything aircraft - quite simply the best.

[SCANDIC]

A very well done to you, i never get bored of seeing them either, some of the paint jobs on them are ace. If you don't mind me asking who do you fly for. How long do you think they will be around for.:ok::ok: