A-320 question

[sharpshooter41]

Dear all,

The taxi light swt has three positions OFF-TAXI-T/O. Does it mean that the T/O position (both lights On) is to be used for takeoff only and not for landing.

What are the drawbacks if the T/O position is used for landing also. IMHO making approaches into bird infested airports, I would like to have all the lights on.

Regards

[chapola]

I think the Airbus SOP has the light in “T/O position (both lights On)” for landing.

One drawback in this position is the light will reflect back in our eyes on approach in precipitation or cloud. Having the light in the T/O position in heavy snow can be especially disorientating.

Under these conditions you may want to select the light to the taxi position. Next time you are on approach in cloud/percip., play around and you will see the difference.

[sharpshooter41]

Can you tell me where can I lay my hands on the Airbus SOP?

Yes, you are right, in clouds it is better to leave the lights and not the taxi light only, Off to avoid the reflection which you have so rightly pointed out.

However, my query is about fair weather day/night scenarios.

[chapola]

Sorry, I guess it's my own company's SOP that has us set the nose light to T/O on approach. I don't know where you can get an Airbus SOP.

From my Airbus SOP 3.03.18, ILS Approach: Exterior lights.......set:

set: The nose switch to TAXI

[downsouth]

Yep Nose - Taxi
Rwy Turn Off - ON
Land - ON

Thats what airbus sops say.

[Gillespie]

We have our Nose wheel Taxi light on TO for take off, and Taxi for landing.

[mcdhu]

FCOM used o say about this 'to avoid unwanted reflections.' Don't know if it still does.

Cheers,
mcdhu

[sharpshooter41]

Still waiting for some experienced hand to shed further light on the issue.(pun intended)

Someone has told me that there was not enough space to write T/O LDG together and therefore T/O won.

[FlightDetent]

I've been told:

Taxi light is tilted downwards.
T/O light points further away.

At flare T/O light points up, and light scatter will severly imapir your visual reference.

Good SOP must not require pilot to ponder about ad-hoc applicability of individual items.

Using T/O light for landings increases filament usage both in time and cycles by 100% incurring unnecessary running costs.

During approach unlike taxi, RWY turnoff, and landing lights, the T/O lt does not provide much extra illumination of the NW strut when viewed from a point on the aircraft trajectory.

Really, what reason is there to use T/O light for approach and landing. :}

FD (the un-real)

[Spaz Modic]

:rolleyes: It's very important to follow the FCOM blindly, and not to use any grey matter whatsoever in the operation of your aircraft. Geez - you might even THINK! :ok:

[PPRuNeUser0183]

Spaz, sorry for the thread creep, but regarding birds, some people say that the weather radar gives them the heebies :eek:... may I ask if anyone know if there's any truth in it (reference rather than crew room gossip please)

[BigHitDH]

Yep, I've heard many examples of this. Seems unlikely, for most modern WX radar, field strength drops below 10 milliwatts once you get much past 10ft away from the emitter, so you can imagine what you would get at a range of hundreds of feet.

BHDH.

[woodywood]

Agree with Spaz, SOP only pilots are scary but more and more common.

Forget the book, if you need T/O light use it, if not don't. Personally I use it at night for ldg but some don't like it. Everybody's got is own sense of vision comfort, so adapt accordingly. ;)

[sharpshooter41]

@FlightDetent

Wish you had given some reference for the info about the light being tilted etc

@Woodywood
Agree with you. I also use the T/O position for Ldg when I am PF. Just wanted to know the opinion of more experienced hands.

Thanks for all your comments

[Bingaling]

The use of T/O light for landing is not recommended as on landing (depending on the impact) the filament has a greater probability of shattering than in Taxi position. At least that is what the engineers think.

Weather radar has no affect on bird scaring...........

[FlightDetent]

Binga: Especially as it is a different filament. :ok:

ssh41: FCOM 1.33.20 p2, PFD pitch attitude for approach and flare, light cones observed on other taxiing aircraft.

Most importantly one of my two Airbus factory TRE who pointed out that my previous type and SOP practice to set TO light with the issue of LDG clearance
- was dubious from Human Factors / Error management stand point
- was not in-line with manufacturer's recommandations that were well researched and based on the design of the aircraft
- bird scare input was very disputable and all other effect were only negative
- one day will make me lose vis reference at marginal conditions

Somehow, I decided to THINK and only then tell this 20000 hrs teacher how I hate SOP-only pilots. NOT. :ugh:

Give it a try, at 5° pitch before touchdown it does very little to illuminate runway. The white patch of light scatter above ground is easily done without. And you more than double the longevity of the light.

[PPRuNeUser0183]

@Bingaling: Do you have a reference for that please?

[Bingaling]

Cheque list....don't have reference for taxi light query. The note re filament is from the engineering department.

With regard to the use of weather radar to deter birds, it is debatable whether there is any real positive effect on bird scaring, however it was mentioned in this CAA article........

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/1437/srg_acp_00018-01-030303.pdf

[Swedish Steve]

Wish you had given some reference for the info about the light being tilted etc

I had a tech log write up from an A320 captain recently. Both landing lights are angled downwards.
He was correct. Turning the landing lights on (the ones on the wings) they illuminate the ground beside the fwd pax doors.
So the answer ..Correct. They are meant to. They are landing lights.

[TyroPicard]

Swedish Steve..
Turning the landing lights on (the ones on the wings)
What kind of A320 is that? The landing lights are on the fuselage....
TP

[sharpshooter41]

@Swedish Steve

The comment was about the T/O light on the nose gear and certainly NOT about the landing lights.

[FlightDetent]

Still, there is a valid point relevant to our small discussion.

Landing lights certainly illuminate ground because thay are designed to do so. Explicitly, at 3 to 7 deg pitch (FCOM 3.03.22 p1) typical for landing and flare attitude. It is only natural to observe that during taxi, take-off, and landing roll they seem to pointlessly aim downwards.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/TAM/Airbus-A320-214/1345022/M/

However, that is EXACTLY what you need for landing. On the other hand, TO light is constructed differently, and hence the conclusion that it is pretty much useless in this phase.

FD (the un-real)

TP: LDG lights are definitely wing mounted on MSN 3060 delivered a year ago:
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1028707/ take-off,
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1017685/ landing.