Best & Worst Mil Aviation Film and Why

[Strangelove PhD]

Dambusters & Peal Harbour

Dambusters a well directed and acted flim which bore good reflection to a heroic tale.

Pearl Harbour a well filmed piece which fell down with the portrayal of the USA winning the Battle of Britain, much like U-571 distorting history for Hollywood purpo$e$

[0497]

Pearl Harbor was a hideous remake of Tora! Tora! Tora! which imo is excellent.

[Wiley]

'Pearl Harbour' holds a special place somewhere or other for me. It is the only war-ie aeroplane (or should that be 'airplane'?) movie I have ever sat down to and given up five minutes into the battle scenes, which were so badly CGI-ed, they were almost as bad as the Godawful script and appallingly shallow characterisations.

I thought I might put up with it for a while if I could get a few more long lingering looks at young Kate in her overtight nurse's uniform or that great floral number she wore in the movie trailer, but the rest of the movie was so bad, I even 'forewent' that pleasure. The DVD has sat, unwatched and never likely to be watched, somewhere on my shelf since then.

How did the movie end - can I assume the bloke with the ten thousand hour 'bash' in his hat and the Rayban sunglasses shot down so many Japanese aircraft with the endless supply of .50 cal his trusty P40 was carrying that we now know why the Japanese cancelled their second wave - there simply weren't enough aircraft got back to the carriers to mount the second raid?

There may be a worse aviation war-ie flick out there somewhere - (Did Erroyl Flynn ever do a flying war-ie? God, I hope not.) - but I think you'd be hard-pressed to find one.

Best? I haven't given it a lot of thought, but given how soon after the war it was made, and how the producers still needed to tread lightly on the sensitivities of many wartime USAAF people who were still around, I thought the Yanks did an admirable job with Gregory Peck's '12 O'Clock High'.

Both probably wouldn't translate well to film, but I'd love to see someone make an attempt to make a film of Len Deighton's (fictional) 'Bomber', and perhaps even moreso, John Beede's true to life 'They Hosed Them Out', a warts and all story of the life of an RAF tail gunner. (Do yourself an enormous favour and get your hands on the book - It's recently been re-released under the new title, 'Rear Gunner'. http://www.biblioz.com/main.php?action=3&i=76679&record=2 Written in the early 1950's, it ain't a pretty picture of the RAF that he paints.)

[CoodaShooda]

Did Erroyl Flynn ever do a flying war-ie? God, I hope not

Dawn Patrol (1938) with Basil Rathbone and David Niven. One of his best efforts and not a female appearing on screen.

[BEagle]

"Dr FOD and the Wayward Body" - had a couple of very nice points in it.....:E

Worst films? Anything with totally unrealistic CGI in it.

[Squirrel 41]

But only one I can think of was an Oscar winner...
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The incomparable....
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TOP GUN!!

(In fairness, it was Oscar for "Best Song" but anyway.....)

[Gainesy]

Forgot Ms York then BEags?:confused:

[maxburner]

I'd go with Top Gun as the best aviation movie ever, if only for (1) the authentic dialogue - 'I'm in a flat spin, heading out to sea' - and (2) for Kelly McGuiles (sorry if the spelling is wrong here) who has lovely legs. Did I mention the dialogue?:)

12O'clock High was a good movie for its day. They used it as a teaching aid when I did OT. Most things were in black and white then, so it didn't look dated.

[Wader2]

Worst, remember the ones with the cloud background on a moving backdrop? Wasn't there one with someone walking passed?

I know there was a Morcombe and Wise sketch of that scene.

Was it the worst or the funniest?

I agree about Pearl Harbor now I saw Tora Tora Tora with its embedded subtitles and additional subtitles in Greek!

[boxermeg]

For one of the best how about Kenneth Mores portrayal of Douglas Badar in 'Reach for the Sky' (it won a BAFTA for best British film 1956).

Pearl Harbour.....enough said already :suspect:

[Bob Viking]

'BAT 21' (Gene Hackman, Danny Glover) was a pretty good effort, I thought.
Also Mel Gibson's 'We were Soldiers Once' (Air Cavalry - definitely Air related!) ranks pretty highly for me despite what some might say (yes I have read the book and yes I know the film isn't totally true to the real events but it's still bl00dy good!).
Honorary mention must also go to 'Hot Shots'. An absolutely legendary piece of film-making and probably quoted more on a daily basis than the eponimous 'Top Gun'.
Officer and a Gentleman? The list could go on.
Worst film.....
.....hmm, I'll have to give that one some thought and get back to you!
BV:)

[Farmer 1]

"From Hell to Victory", starring the incomparable George Peppard. If there's a category for "So bad it's good", this would be the winner. You name it, it's got it, but very badly. A must-see for all aviation type persons.
I never saw Pearl Harbour, because it's in the category Americanbasedonatrueevent. In this case - There was a war. ......... The Americans won. Fill in the dots with anything you like.

[Ken Scott]

Len Deighton's 'Bomber' was done as a Radio play, a good effort but not a patch on the book. The play tried too hard to separate the 'toff officers' from the 'salt of the earth' NCO aircrew, & to introduce a post war guilt appraisal of the bombing effort through FS Lambert's questioning of targeting.

Not strictly a flying film, but flying related - David Niven in 'A Matter of Life & Death'. Same chap, with Errol Flynn, in the superb 'Dawn Patrol'. What about the 'Battle of Britain'? Great flying sequences, tremendous score (music, not how many we shot down in the film!), the greatest collection of WW2 aircraft for any post war film (at the time it amounted to the sixteenth largest air force in the world I believe!) & not a bit of CGI. Saw it at the cinema in 1970, wanted to fly from that moment on! 'The Sound Barrier' saw us going supersonic before the Yanks, or so many of the viewing public over there believed, & we did it by 'reversing the controls'! - classic. I enjoyed 'Memphis Belle' too, for once a story correctly populated by an all American cast. '633 Squadron' just for all those Mosquitos, likewise 'Mosquito Squadron', although both lost it on the ground. Enjoyed 'The Blue Max' too.

On the bad side, any of the 'Airport' series, especially 'Concorde' - seeing off the F4 by barrel rolling whilst firing a flare gun out of the open DV window to decoy the missiles! Hope no one in MOD sees that & develops a 'new' DAS suite for us! I never watched 'Pearl Harbour', put off by the trailers & the reviews so can't really judge that one. I enjoyed 'Top Gun' when it came out by it's way too corny & just too gay with hindsight.

[GPMG]

Best - Top Gun, it's cheesy but still very cool, with some great flying shots, oh and a Gpz 900.

Worst - Pearl harbour, oh and wasn't there a complete hash of a Biggles film in the 80's?

[FAN BLADE]

The Arrow made in 2000 staring Dan Aykroyd. That aircraft would of been a worldbeater. Great film and also a great aircraft. Still have my copy on video - never seen the film released on TV...!!!!

[Double Zero]

I think ' rear gunner ' must be one of Graham Norton's efforts, so won't be bothering with that one...

[HallamPilot]

633 Squadron gets a thumbs up from me, and Pearl Harbour IS truly pants!

[GeeRam]

Surprised no one else has mentioned Battle of Britain. An all star cast, a bit of everything, well grounded in hisorical fact and some stirring music.

I was just about to.

'Battle of Britain' is number one for me without a doubt.

As an obscure alternative, and better than Top Gun, I'd say 'The Hunters', with Robert Mitchum and Robert Wagner, great late 50's colour film about F-86 Sabre pilots in the Korean War.

Worst......not seen Pearl Harbour, didn't want to then still don't want to now, so has to be worst then.

[cazatou]

Wiley

I think you will find that Mr Flynn "starred" in "A Yank in the RAF" circa 1940 when he won the B of B before setting off to liberate Burma.

[rjtjrt]

Strategic Air Command with Jimmy Stewart.
Magestic sequence of B-36 at altitude with appropriate lilting music.

[Wiley]

Surprised no one else has mentioned Battle of Britain. Fantastic movie, but you mean there were actually aeroplanes in it? My main recollection is of Susannah York in her suspender belt and RAF-issue bloomers. Set the blood coursin' through the veins and showed us all what the chaps were fightin' for.

Re Erroyl Flynn: I had forgotten 'Dawn Patrol', where I understand more stunt pilots died than the USAF has suffered casualties in some recent wars. The final scenes in 'The Great Waldo Pepper' were set in very similar circumstances. (Not a war-ie, but having sat through TGWP again recently, it still stands as one of the better aviation movies I've seen.) I was thinking more of Erroyl Flynn's utterly awful efforts to boost the war effort in WW2, particularly that one set in Burma where he showed that Bill Slim and the whole 14th Army could have stayed at home in Blighty for the duration, 'cos Erroyl cleaned up the entire Japanese Army all on his own with that inexhaustible magazine he had on this Thompson Gun.

[spocla]

The best thing in 12 O'Clock High is the opening sequence. They actually land a B17 wheels up for, and close to, the cameras. Also other boys in the circuit rolling out on "final" at about 20'. But for me its The Way to the Stars.

[GOLF_BRAVO_ZULU]

Good: can't decide between Dam Busters (un abridged) and Appointment in London

Bad: Airplane. One or two bits were very unrealistic.

[Warmtoast]

Strategic Air Command with Jimmy Stewart.
Magestic sequence of B-36 at altitude with appropriate lilting music.


Agree thoroughly. I first saw it in 1955 and was blown away by the shots of the B-36's contrailing into the sunset with all ten engines running.

I recorded it to my TV/DVD recorder and will post some appropriate awe inspiring screen shots in due course.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/StrategicAirCommandSreenShot.jpg

A bit about the base at which the film was shot can be found here:
http://www.7bwb-36assn.org/b36genhistpg3.html

[Dominoe]

My fav - We were Soldiers
I think that Finding Private Ryan went a long way in trying to introduce the true realism of battle.
Worst - Behind enemy Lines - Just how long did that air to air missile fly for and make 90 degree spot turns? Oh and Gene Hackman (was he the Admiral?) shouting the guys name down the microphone and then saying "Oh I shouldn`t have said that should I". Groan.

[Smudger552]

..its got to be The Final Countdown. F14s V. Jap Zeros......quality!

Smudge

[dakkg651]

Wiley

Susan Hampshire was actually Susanna York and I don't think they were issue panties!

You are right about getting the blood coursing though.

With the BoB and Dambusters My other favourite film is The Bridges at Toki Ri. Panthers off an Essex carrier, great special effects (mostly) and Grace Kelly in a swimsuit.

Anyone remember the film 'High Flight' starring Anthony Newley which follow the progress of RAF ab initios through Piston Provosts and Vampires to flying the Hunter?
Terrible storyline but worth seeing for the flying sequences and hearing that wonderful bluenote.

I think Pearl Harbour might possibly be the worst. Can't be sure as I got p*****d off after the first half hour and consigned it to the bin.

[Gainesy]

Mr Wiley, you appear to be geographically challenged. York not Hants.:)
Unfortunately, entirely the wrong shots here.:( I understand that the rest of the film was about aeroplanes or something.
http://web.ukonline.co.uk/york.jsrpages/pics2/2sylbob.jpg

[Standby Scum]

Poor dog can only be called Trigger these days.:{

[illuminate]

without doubt the battle of britain, if that film fails to stir then somethingis wrong with you...

although black and white films, angels one five is a favourite of mine

[catbert]

I've always had a soft spot for Clint Eastwood in Firefox, the thinking man's aircraft! That and the recruiting film with the Vangelis soundtrack (12 Sqn Buccaneers?) got me to sign on the dotted line.
CB

[charliegolf]

I'm with GeeRam: The Hunters has some excellent F86 stuff in it.

CG

[xraf]

12 Sqn Buccs is good and still available (on ebay!) but no one has mentioned The Right Stuff - Well the first half anyway with actual footage of Glennis!- the space bit gets a bit tedious later.

Regards
Xraf:ok:

[Timeout]

....I can't believe no one has mentioned the Iron Eagle films yet :}

F-16's with about 400 bombs and 57 missiles on a rescue mission to save his dad all whilst listening to Queen with a cassette player strapped to his leg. Magic :D

[camelspyyder]

B/W War documentary from about 1942...

my favourite bit:

As the Eng is struggling to plug a massive fuel leak in the wing root of a Sunderland, one of the Wop/AG's in the vicinity has to to told to put his fag out!!!:):):)

[F34NZ]

I wondered when someone was going to mention Iron Eagle. The old joke still stands : 'Have you ever seen a worse film than 'Iron Eagle' ?' 'Yep, Iron Eagle 2, 3, 4, 17...'

The fighter world's answer to Police Academy.

[55HTB]

In trying to educate our US colleagues out here in sandy places, I showed the The Dambusters (1955 version) just yesterday over a pizza and nea-beer! Despite much gnashing of teeth when forementioned hound made his first appearance the concensus was 'brilliant', 'awesome' and 'best flight movie I've seen'.

Not sure if these foreign votes count against the survey or not, but the Dambusters gets my vote every time!!!

[dakkg651]

Another magic film sequence is Steve Mcqueen beating up the control tower with a B17 in The War Lover.

Also, if you have the Battle of Britain on DVD, try stop framing the moment that the attacking Hispano (Me109) passes over the airfield fence in the early part of the film. I estimate that the prop tips were less than two feet clear of the top strand! Awesome!

[Wiley]

A few people have mentioned the movie ‘Memphis Belle’, which, while an enjoyable piece of fiction, was a crock and bore no resemblance at all to the actual events it is supposed to portray.

Has anyone seen the original ‘Memphis Belle’ documentary made by Howard Hawkes in 1943, when he and his film crew accompanied the crew of the ‘Memphis Belle’ on their 25th mission over Europe? (They were the first USAAF crew to complete a 25 mission tour with the 8th Air Force.) It has some very good air to air shots of contrailing B17s in mass formation and Bf109s making quarter attacks on the aircraft carrying the cameras – and not staged either, but for real. However, what was really outstanding was the way the very young captain managed his crew during the fighter attacks. Professional in the extreme - it was like watching a really sharp crew handling a really tough sim. session and getting nothing wrong.

[Duncoffin]

Here is my opinion, I know you've all be waiting for it:

best: Battle of Britain

worst: Top Gun - that film we all love to hate.

I think Hotshots is an underdog, I've seen it two or three times and only just noticed that there little in the way of continuity in the way of aircraft, even in the same flight sequence

[Inspector Dreyfuss]

Best comedy:- Dr Strangelove with Sellers as the Brit Gp Capt exchange officer (and the US President and indeed the mad scientist) with Slim Pickens (I believe?) as the bonkers B52 commander. Highlights include the US President trying to reason with an intoxicated Russian president about the slight error in launching SAC and the B52 commander's finale after dislodging the nuke.

[Wader2]

Gathering of Eagles reminds me,

Anyone know the name of the B47 film? I seem to remember airborne alert off Newfoundland, a fire, AAR sequences etc. Quite a story line really following a B47 wing work up, ops and then deployment to Kadena (?).

[teeteringhead]

Dr Strangelove with Sellers as the Brit Gp Capt exchange officer (and the US President and indeed the mad scientist) with Slim Pickens (I believe?) as the bonkers B52 commander. ... and today's movie trivia is:

Apparently Sellers was to play the B52 captain's part too, but was not happy with his characterisation - not a very nice man, but certainly a perfectionist.

[goudie]

Best:- BoB
Worst:- Top Gun, can't stand the little sh*t TC.

Has anyone mentioned John Wayne? Didn't he win a dog fight or two in the Pacific? Can't remember name of film.

[stickmonkeytamer]

One to stir the heartstrings: the Chipmonk AEF film, staring Paul Young (before he got his record contract!) ;) as John Andrews.
Those immortal lines:
"Jump jump John"!
"Jump jump Sir"!!!!

Why did he not get an Oscar???

The best war film for me was "A matter of Life and Death" with David Niven. You've got to watch it for the bit when he is on the beach and assumes he is dead- fantastic acting!

I used to have all of the Top Gun flying bits merged into one video- I was young then...:=

SMT

[BEagle]

Well, if you're going to mention Susannah York......

I give you.....

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a341/nw969/SYork03.jpg

Aaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrghhhhhhhhh

[MG]

How about The Bridges at Toko-Ri for one of the best. Some great Korean War, carrier-borne jets (F9F Panther) and Grace Kelly to boot!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/2b/The_Bridges_of_Toko-Ri.jpg

[goudie]

There are now two Threads (the other's about hats)
that are now showing saucy pics of women. Is there a conspiracy out there to corrupt us old farts?

[MG]

Sorry Goudie, but I'm an old fart as well. You have to keep us oldies happy somehow!

[dakkg651]

Goudie

The Duke flew P40s in The Flying Tigers. This included the famous out take of the chap walking across the sky outside the cockpit.

He also flew Hellcats in The Flying Leathernecks.

He also taught some Russian bint to fly a P80 in Jet Pilot. The pilot who did most of the flying sequences for this was Chuck Yeager.

That has just reminded me of the film The Sound Barrier which featured the prototype Supermarine Swift which was called the Prometheus if I remember correctly.
Pushing forward on the stick to recover from a supersonic dive. Shows that aerolastic distortion does have it's uses then! Yeager really enjoyed this film by all accounts.

[scudpilot]

Peter Jackon is rumoured to be remaking the "Dambusters" should be excellent, just wonder how they will get around the black pet dog in these politically correct times!

[chiglet]

Surprised that no one has mentioned The Right Stuff....or Those Magnifcent Men in their Flying Machines. I haven't seen the film, but Hells Angels is supposed to be good and hows' about Up in the Air with George Formby
watp,iktch

[Winco]

Oh BEagle,

If only........................................................ ..........more like her today eh?

Winco

[NST]

I quite like this Dambusters remake .. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=_NMfBKrdErY .. :ok:

Recently watched Speed and Angels. Documentary of the last class of Tomcat Pilots to go through, some of the air to air camera work is pretty good.

But the worst for me has to be Iron Eagle .. :yuk:

[Fg Off Max Stout]

Did anyone sit through Behind Enemy Lines long enough to get to the world's longest, most far-fetched surface-to-air missile sequence. The whole sequence was long enough to see the launch, go away and brew some coffee, come back see the damn thing in flight, go back to the kitchen and bake a jacket potato, come back to the TV and they were still jostling around trying to evade the missile. An irritatingly crap bunch-of-arse.

As for the best, The Battle of Britain is a classic in every way and there's always a time and a place for Top Gun.

In a slightly different category: The Boys From Bahrain. Amazing. More or less started the Sqn vid genre and motivated a number of young bucks to sign on the dotted line. I still get a shiver down my spine watching that.

I'll be interested to see how the Dambusters remake turns out. I suspect it will either be very, very good or utterly rubbish. There is no middle ground. Let's hope for the former.

[ShyTorque]

Quote:
Surprised no one else has mentioned Battle of Britain.
Fantastic movie, but you mean there were actually aeroplanes in it?

There certainly were aeroplanes in it. Tim Mills, who sometimes posts here, flew one of the Spitfires in that film when he was still a serving RAF squadron pilot.

(I know because I helped teach his daughter to fly in the early 1990s). :)

Worst Aviation film? The TV series, "Tales of the Golden Monkey", takes my vote. For example, the pilot (of a WW2 flying boat, somewhere over the Pacific) received a radio call asking him to give his position. He immediately looked out of the window....... and gave his exact latitude and longitude... :rolleyes:

[stevef]

I'd recommend these three:

Thirty Seconds Over Tokyo (1944) based on the Doolittle Raid:
http://www.archive.org/details/thirty_seconds_over_tokyo

The Purple Plain 1954 A Mosquito crashlands in a Burmese wilderness.
http://www.amazon.com/Purple-Plain-Gregory-Peck/dp/B00079ZACW

Journey Together (1943). RAF Pilot training in America.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Journey-Together-Richard-Attenborough/dp/B00004CQ7S

[sitigeltfel]

When Dr Strangelove was first shown the USAF were amazed at the accuracy of the Nuclear Release procedures depicted in the movie and tried to find out who had been advising the director.

One of my favourites is "By Dawns Early Light". A very political film but it shows the dilemmas facing a crew sent on a Nuclear mission.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/By_Dawn's_Early_Light

[LOTA]

Can't really comment on the whole of Top Gun; walked out out after 20 minutes because it was so boring and went to the pub instead!

The Battle of Britain, though, bloody fantastic!

When I was a recruiter (!),the 12 Squadron Buccaneers film (we used to lug a 16mm projector around in the back of the MT Chevette)usedto send the Coventry comprehensive kids to sleep. No bad thing, in my view.

But Watchdogs, now that was a far more exciting affair. 'The squadron is manned. Is it real or exercise?' That's the stuff to give em!

[RETDPI]

"No Sleep Till Dawn " was pretty good for its genre in the '50's. This was the one all about bringing the B-52 into service.
"High Flight" c.1957 -Cranwell as it should have been. My old Flight commanders boots star in a marching sequence.
"Tiger in the Sky" Absolutely dire crude progaganda about the Korean War. F-84's playing the part of Mig's.
"The Man in the Sky". '50's Tosh with Jack Hawkins trying to land a Bristol Freighter.
Best of all for me for sheer atmosphere and story telling. . "The Great Waldo Pepper" in the 70's.
Worst - difficult to choose!
And then there was "Q" Planes............
Time for me Cocoa.

[Evalu8ter]

A cracking thread!

In no particular order..

Best:

The Hunters - Robert Wagner in pre "Hart to Hart" days!
Battle of Britain - We'll never see that many REAL aircraft in a movie again
SAC - The moment when Dutch is shown the B-47, you can see the Homer Simpson struggle going on in his head between wife & "mistress"!
12 O'Clock High - We've all worked for Frank Savages....
The Way to the Stars - Just perfect...

Worst:

Wings of the Apache - Oh dear....
Pearl Harbour - Alec Baldwin as Mitchell? Just no!
ANY Iron Eagle Movie

[Green Flash]

Although not strictly totally aviation, there is a lot of flying sequences in A Bridge Too Far. Stellar cast too. The bit right at the start with the Dutch lad pedaling down the lane who spots the Tigers hiding in the bushes. In the background, out of the haze, a PR Spit drops down and howls past. Click click, a quick 180 and he's out again, with the Dutch lads enthusiastic waving returned with a quick wing waggle.:ok: Gets me every time.:{
And the Hispanos shooting up the Hurricanes French FOB at the start of BoB - how ferkin low is that?!:eek:
Pearl Harbour :yuk:

[barnstormer1968]

Some of my favourites are:
BAT 21, even though it bears very little resemblance to the true events of that story.

STRATEGIC AIR COMMAND, poor story, not overly well acted, but truly stunning aircraft involved.

DR STRANGELOVE, just a cult classic film, and with one of the most realistic battle scenes of any film IMHO*. Also a very well travelled B52 crew, if you consider the navigator was the voice of Darth Vader in star wars.

* I consider the battle scene where the army attack the USAF base to be realistic, as it's very anonimous, quite confused, and with no heroics or glory. Plus with it being in B & W, it just seems to add grit to the whole thing.

*THREAD CREEP ON*
Did any of you read "Harrier squadron" in the Warlord comic, in the late seventies/early eighties
*THREAD CREEP OFF*

Barnstormer1968

[MDJETFAN]

For flying sequences, the recent I-Max movie "Fighter Pilot", filmed at Nellis AFB during a Red Flag exercise, has to be a leading contender. Even my wife, an ex-RAF "kid" was impressed.

[Lytham Lifeboat]

Best:
Dambusters – Ultimate class film
633 Squadron – Heroic stuff
Battle of Britain - Legendary
Reach For The Sky - Classic
Black Hawk Down – Not overly an aviation flick, but I enjoyed it.
Apollo XIII – Good reflection of a true story with great actors and good direction.
Firefox – Good old Clint. Helluva jet, I wanted one!
Worst:
Iron Eagle (I - IV) – Words fail me, utter crap
Pearl Harbour – ...It's a great, bloated mess of a picture with a weak script and bland performances... and then some!

[Faithless]

The best has got to be the old Air Cadet AEF pre-flight film before your Chipmunk flight......"Jump,jump John"...you know the one that was played on the old projector! :} Aaaarrr they were the days
Hat-Coat-I'm going now :O

[circle kay]

The Dambusters as a given, Appointment in London isn't too bad and as it was filmed in 51 lots of Lancasters around even with H2S domes to give an air of realism.

Second Dr Strangelove trivia fact.

When Slim Pickings gets to the end of reading out the contents list of the survival pack, he says: "Shoot a fella could have a pretty good weekend in Vegas with all that!" The word Vegas was overdubbed towards the end of editing. He actually says "Dallas", but between the scene being shot and the film being released The Kennedy Assassination had taken place.

[Double Zero]

When I was living in Burgundy on an hotel barge ( long story ) in 1993, I had a copy of B of B sent over.

The French chef, then 24, and a mild aircraft enthusiast, was amazed,
" Ze German aircraft, zey come in so low, ze ----ing b----ds !"

He was also amazed because he'd never heard of it - not the film, the actual event !!!

It's a pity Neville Shute's books haven't been filmed properly, though I think 'The Way To The Stars' is close in empathy.

Worst for me has to be 'Firefox', I went to see that with an instrumentation chum, and we both came out and said " we actually paid to watch that ! " At least Airport-the Concorde was funny.

[circle kay]

DZ,

No Highway is not that bad a film, but not a patch on the book. Now, can anyone guess what Aircraft type did they use to make the Rutland Raindeer out off ?

[GeeRam]

Another magic film sequence is Steve Mcqueen beating up the control tower with a B17 in The War Lover.

Actually flown by the late John Crewdson, and it was filmed at Bovingdon.

Also, if you have the Battle of Britain on DVD, try stop framing the moment that the attacking Hispano (Me109) passes over the airfield fence in the early part of the film. I estimate that the prop tips were less than two feet clear of the top strand! Awesome!

I believe that Buchon was being flown by Commandante Pedro Santa Cruz, who I believe was the Spanish AF CFI.

The bit right at the start with the Dutch lad pedaling down the lane who spots the Tigers hiding in the bushes. In the background, out of the haze, a PR Spit drops down and howls past. Click click, a quick 180 and he's out again, with the Dutch lads enthusiastic waving returned with a quick wing waggle. Gets me every time.

The pilot of the Spit was the late Neil Williams.

[Wigan Warrior]

Well I never...

http://www.ieatpaint.com/topgun/

:eek:

[Green Flash]

Gee
Thanks. Couldn't remember if it was Williams or a Hanna aboard. Brilliant.

Wigan
Thanks. I think .....

[Jetex Jim]

Strangelove is a terrific film, despite the B52 exteriors-flying over the arctic which clearly show an aircraft shadow which is of a B29, but a model B52 matted onto it. But the B52 interiors look superb to me although guys who actually know the plane can always point out 'you can't get there from there' bits in movies.

In Thunderball, if I remember correctly, there's access from the rear crew position to the bomb bay. Not a feature of the actual Vulcan I think.

For more modern films, Dark Blue World is a good story of Czechs who came to england to fly in the BoB, I think a lot of flying footage is reused from the BoB film we all know.

[Arm out the window]

Quoting BEagle: "Dr FOD and the Wayward Body" - had a couple of very nice points in it....."

That's the first one that popped into my head, too - can't think why! Fine film-making and very creative camera angles...

[wz662]

The shadow aircraft in Strangelove is a B17 not a B29.

a film that could lay claim to be both the best and at the same time the worst is 'Theirs is the glory' the first film about Operation Market Garden. Filmed in 1945 in rubble of Arnhem using survivors of the battle (hence the awful acting and the worst film claim).
"what do you mean you've got post traumatic stress syndrome laddie. When I shout action you run over there and shoot your mate who's playing the german." :\

[robin]

>>>>>>>>Both probably wouldn't translate well to film, but I'd love to see someone make an attempt to make a film of Len Deighton's (fictional) 'Bomber', ...............<<<<<<<

Try the BBC Radio adaptation of the story available on CD.

Originally done in 'real time' from 2.30 to midnight, it is a chilling semi-documentary

[mr fish]

i forget the title, but one the films i remember from my youth had jimmy cagney and others as bush pilots joining up after pearl. never forgot the duel between him in a hudsen and a nasty hun in a me 109 ,OVER THE ATLANTIC,he won by ramming it,utter old fashioned class!!

[PlasticCabDriver]

Target for Tonight:

http://www.nytimes.com//images/section/movies/amg/dvd/cov150/drt400/t464/t46417atxhd.jpg

"It's a peach of a target, Sir!"

[unclenelli]

Desert Thunder (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0164016/)
A group of mavericks, misfits and convicts are trained for a secret deniable operation in Iraq. Led by Daniel Baldwin he trains them in USA where their training base get attacked by Iraqis.
After killing the Iraqis and the token bird running from their heli gunships in a bi-plane causing the helis to crash into mountainsides, they embark on their mission.

They get airborne from USA and fly non-stop to Iraq in their F16s (famed for their bubble canopies, but not a lot of people know that just behind the pilots head is a 5' x 5' MDF firewall!!!)
After getting cleared into Iraqi airspace by a carrier in the Med they coast into Iraq over it's western coast(!) and attack the airfield, then fly all the way back home non-stop for tea & medals.


My Dad got it free by answering a question in his local paper.
This film probably went straight to DVD it's so bad, which explains why they had to resort to giving it away in local evening papers.

[Buster11]

I think you'll find it was William Wyler, not Howard Hawkes, who directed the original documentary Memphis Belle, the ground sequences of which were shot at Bassingbourn. His daughter, whose name I forget, made the 1980s re-make, with Harry Connick in the lead.

As another reasonable one to consider, how about Jan Sverak's Dark Blue World, about Czech pilots who escape to the UK and fly Spitfires of slightly anachronistic mark numbers in the Battle of Britain?

[chiglet]

Anyone remember "Operation Crossbow"?....I think it made Pearl Harbor meerly poor......very, very DIRE
watp,iktch

[EyesFront]

Strategic Air Command (that B-47 film...) made a big impression on me, and I had to wait many years for it to pop up on TV a year or two back. Battle of Britain, Dam Buster and Reach for the Sky will always top the list of classics, with First of the Few not far behind. Also The Right Stuff for showing that wonderful golden age of test flying at Edwards.

For the worst film, I find Top Gun to be almost unwatchable (Hollywood trash). Most disappointing was Hells Angels (the original Howard Hughes one). I'd been wanting to see it for years, then bought the DVD and sat down to watch it with my wife. After 15 minutes of dire dialogue, and nothing much happening, we just looked at each other and pressed the eject button... I must try again some time (without the missus)

[Fareastdriver]

The original Memphis Belle was virtually a USAAF documentry as it had all the military introductions to it. It had one shot of HM King George IV and Queen Elizabeth meeting the crew.
Another film of the series was one of Thunderbolts operating in Italy on ground attack. A scene you would not see nowadays was one of a a pilots remains being pulled out of his burning wreckage by means of a long rope.

[Chaffers]

So no-one else likes Flight of the Intruder then? :hmm:

[bakseetblatherer]

Worst is most definitely 'behind enemy lines'; the SAM scene is shiiiiii:mad:te beyond belief
Best Topgun, inspired me to my career- aah Kelly:E

[Jetex Jim]

So no-one else likes Flight of the Intruder then


Great film and top book

[henry crun]

Without a doubt the most appalling film ever involving aircraft was Topgun

The best ? probably Dam Busters, but I would like to see the original Hells Angels before committing myself.

[Gordon17]

I've watched this one many times. Some wonderful flying sequences set to stirring music, and very, very sad.

It's Journey's End rewritten to be about the RFC rather than set in the trenches.

But my favourite would have to be The Dambusters. When I was about 10 I saw the film, then got a copy of the book which I learnt almost by heart and used to annoy my family by reciting chunks of it. I can still remember most of it now.

[computer jockey]

So no-one else likes Flight of the Intruder then?

Gets my vote. Before that I always remember watching 633 Squadron as a kid which was singlehandedly responsible for my love of aviation.

For the worst? I've seen some real turkeys here on HBO and Star Movies - so bad, even the names are instantly forgettable...

[Rigger1]

Ok, not a flying film, but the P51 scenes in ‘Empire of the sun’ were incredible Ray and the late Mark Hanna I believe.

[dakkg651]

Rigger

Agree about Empire of the Sun.

Ice Cold in Alex is one of my favourite war movies and is the only feature film I have seen with a flying Beaufighter. The sonorous sound of those twin Hercules is something else!

[xraf]

This one will date you!

Contender for the worst I've seen

Who can remember Richard O'Sullivan (The 'man about the house' actor)as a Harrier pilot who gets 'a bit stressed' because, among other things, the batty is a bit short with him over breakfast, so stressed in fact that he winds up ejecting and throwing his nice shiny Harrier on the ground:ugh:

Needless to say this was a late 70s 'in house' version!

Regards
Xraf:ok:

[lurkposition]

If the thread is expanded to worst professionally prepared films then you must watch, Rescue 90 - J+++s acting - epic!
Also the disorientation film shown to us at Linton, late 60s, with the classic and memorable phrase from a F100 driver, "Git on the gages Frank!" - followed by CRUNCH/Splat.

12 O'Clock high. We were forced to watch it at OCTU but only in two to three minute scenes.

Airwolf -AAARGH.

But the flying scenes in B o B and Apocalypse Now - muy bueno!

[Lord_Flashheart]

barnstormer1968

(Thread drift alert)

Harrier Squadron (or was it Holocaust Squadron in the begining?) in the Warlord comic - there's a blast from the past!!! Hob Hogget and his band of multinational Harrier mates fighting off an invasion of the UK by EASTPAC(?) (didn't actually call them Russians). Chillingly realistic storyline for a young impressionable mind! Someone needs to reprint those as a full collection...

(back on thread)


Best: Top Gun/Dambusters

Alright so its naff as hell but Top Gun is exhilarating - and a great advert for joining up. Dambusters - British, daring, technical achievement (the raid, not the special effects...) - need I say more?


Worst: That Fighter Pilot IMAX thing

OK - so it had officially backing and the photography is generally excellent but the Star Wars insides of the AWACS and 3D computer graphics on the displays??? Eh? Then there is the CGI cockpit HUD that is superimposed on some of the low-level stuff. And the A-10 tank attack where there are obviously pyros rigged to give lots of nice flame...:ugh:

Jeez - if a A-10 guns strafe needs 'pepping up' on a supposedly realistic Red Flag documentry something has gone wrong somewhere...

[philrigger]

RETDPI
"High Flight" c.1957 -Cranwell as it should have been. My old Flight commanders boots star in a marching sequence.
I was in a scene in High Flight along with lots of others from the MQ patch, including my brother and 2 of my sisters. As I recall we had to run across a patch of grass screaming as if being chassed by some flying machine.

Crap film though.




'We knew how to whinge but we kept it in the NAAFI bar.'

[GPMG]

Worst film? The Spielberg amazing stories film where the B-17 crew can't get the landing gear down when trying to land. So the Ball turret gunner who will get creamed as he can't get out, draws a picture of the landing gear and as if by magic a cartoon rendition of the B-17 landing gear appears and they land safely. bile inducing rubbish.

Oh and Wings of the Apache, was dross as well.


The ride of the Valkyries scene in Apocolypse Now must have done it for some of you air beater types surely?

[Ken Scott]

xraf - not trying to be pendantic, but Richard O'Sullivan didn't eject from his Harrier, he was so distracted by everything (late wake-up call, slow service in the mess so no breakfast, helmet going u/s) that he entered the runway without clearance forcing an F4 to overshoot.

What's really sad is that after all these years I can still remember it so clearly.....

More dross - can't remember the title, but an ITV series with a 40-something Nigel Havers playing a 20 year fighter pilot in the BoB who gets badly burnt - spiralling to earth in flames screaming 'What do I do, what do I do?' And no one's yet mentioned 'Strike Force' (I think that was the title), about a 'special' F3 sqn - ' Some people say we shouldn't exist. Bull****! That's us - NATO's police force!'

[JagRigger]

As a rigger and modeller, Flight of the Phoenix has a certain appeal.....

[Gainesy]

Flight of the Intruder had the misfortune to premier in Washington at the same time the F-117s started on downtown Baghdad in GW1. As the word went round, the cinema emptied as the mainly-military audience went to watch CNN.

[Rigger1]

Ahh yes, Strike Force. The young lady gets out of the F3 “she has just landed” and walks away chatting to the WSO, whilst you can clearly see daylight down the intakes because it has no engines in it!!!!

[Warmtoast]

As I mentioned in post #25. Strategic Air Command the film made way back in 1954/55 is hard to beat, it's my favourite, if only for its the sheer visual impact; the colour, clouds, and air-to-air photography is stunning.

As a bonus it’s something to see a flight deck that has no computer, digital display, or high tech flight control system.

Air-to-air sequences later in the film after “Dutch” Holland (James Stewart) converts to B-47’s are equally spectacular.

The dreamy music / love theme used to accompany the aerial sequences is “The World is Mine” by long established Hollywood composer Victor Young (one of his last compositions – he died in 1956, a year after the film’s release).

Some shots:

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/SAC.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/StrategicAirComand20.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/StrategicAirComand19.jpg

Six turning, four burning!

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/StrategicAirComand12.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/StrategicAirComand8.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/StrategicAirComand11.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/StrategicAirComand4.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/StrategicAirComand14.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/StrategicAirComand16.jpg

B-47 Sequences to follow.

[Tightflester]

Apollo 13 was very well made

The right stuff was a great study with groovy music

Disney's Flight of The Navigator made me smile, a good family film

Pearl Harbour was a hollywood farce

Ipreferred the Flight of The Intruder book, the film didn't fulfill the book's potential

[BEagle]

Regarding 'High Flight' - the low flying Vampire and Pissed-on Provost shots were unbelievable!

In one shot, some Vampire driver actually goes onto the grass trying to get a 'good' shot for the photog!

Oh dear, I'm thinking about the little lass in Dr FOD again....there's something very appealing (well, two actually) about the '70s 'nothing under a flimsy cheescloth blouse' look..:E

[TacLan]

Can't believe that no one has mentioned "A winter flight" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088407/ Sean Bean, Gary Olsen and a very young Reece Dinsdale as an Assistant Air Traffic Controller. To quote the IMDB site "There is alcohol abuse,violence,sex and birdwatching. People who have been in the RAF tell me it is very realistic picture of the RAF in the 1980s." The scene in the "Pigs" bar still makes me want to wretch.

[4mastacker]

Some good films already mentioned. May I add a film titled "Fail Safe"? It was about a B58 crew who, due to a computer error, received the authentication codes to go and turn Moscow into dust. As a gesture to the Russians , the US president (played very well by Henry Fonda), turned New York into an open space. It was a very sobering and thought provoking film.


The worst film?.....got to be Pearl Harbour.

[mr fish]

got to mention PLATOON, who can forget the immortal lines WE GOT ZIPS IN THE WIRE, EXPEND YOUR REMAINING ORDNANCE IN MY POD!!!.surely the only example of requested friendly fire!!!.crap shot of an F5 as well.

[Strangelove PhD]

A true classic public information film:

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/films/1951to1964/filmpage_streaked.htm

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/films/1951to1964/images/details/streaked-lightning.jpg

Ahhhhhhh, nostalgia :D

[Bob Viking]

I think it was actually:
"Expend all remaining ordnance ON MY POS'" (as in position).
But I could be wrong!
BV:8

[fire3]

Does anyone have a copy of the old Air Cadet AEF pre-flight film??

[Buster11]

A propos my posting yesterday regarding Memphis Belle, my copy of Aeroplane magazine arrived this morning, complete with a 48 minute DVD of much of the unused footage shot by William Wyler’s team during the aircraft’s final mission to Willhelmshaven. The colour quality and the fact that it was shot in combat conditions rather than in front of blue screen or via CGI puts this freebie near the top of my list. Well worth the price of a copy of the magazine.

[doubledolphins]

Speilburg's "Always". I believe it is a remake of a war film but this is about water bombers in the late 80's. The opening shot of guys fishing in a boat as the Catalina (PBY) "lands" and scoops up water comming straight at them is one of my favorite aviation shots of all time.
(Yes, seaplanes do "land" on water.)
"Empire of the Sun" Ok, not realy an aviation movie but the slomo shot of the Mustang pilot waving at the boy brings tears to my eyes every time. Absolute magic.
Battle of the River Plate. Outstanding, ok only aeroplane is a "Sea Tiger" on a midships catapult, pretending to be a Shagbat.
Of course there is always "Midway", loved it.
Lastly don't forget "A Matter of Life and Death". Possibly the best movie ever made (about an RAF pilot, any way.) Still stong and relavant today. :ok:
PS, almost forgot, "Hunt for the Red October". Pity it was not true to the book and have "Two-seat Sea Harriers" and one of our flat tops but it did have interior shots of one of my company's F27s pretending to be something more warlike!

[Double Zero]

Well, going back to T.G, surely the epic line from 'Iceman'

" I've got bogeys all over me ! "

didn't help the recruiting image...had the cinema audience rolling around when I saw it.

[steamchicken]

The film of Vulcan 607 will be....when they make it!

Paul Greengrass or Kevin MacDonald, I think, as director...

[Wigan Warrior]

It was a good film to watch on a huge screen with the latest surround sound ear blasting system, but Quentin Tarrantino saw the film in a different light to me:

From the Film Sleep With Me

Sid: You want subversion on a massive level. You know what one of the greatest :mad: scripts ever written in the history of Hollywood is? Top Gun.
Duane: Oh, come on.
Sid: Top Gun is :mad: great. What is Top Gun? You think it's a story about a bunch of fighter pilots.
Duane: It's about a bunch of guys waving their dicks around.
Sid: It is a story about a man's struggle with his own homosexuality. It is! That is what Top Gun is about, man. You've got Maverick, all right? He's on the edge, man. He's right on the :mad: line, all right? And you've got Iceman, and all his crew. They're gay, they represent the gay man, all right? And they're' saying, go, go the gay way, go the gay way. He could go both ways.
Duane: What about Kelly McGillis?
Sid: Kelly McGillis, she's heterosexuality. She's saying: no, no, no, no, no, no, go the normal way, play by the rules, go the normal way. They're saying no, go the gay way, be the gay way, go for the gay way, all right? That is what's going on throughout that whole movie... He goes to her house, all right? It looks like they're going to have :mad:, you know, they're just kind of sitting back, he's takin' a shower and everything. They don't have :mad:. He gets on the motorcycle, drives away. She's like, "What the :mad:, what the :mad: is going on here?" Next scene, next scene you see her, she's in the elevator, she is dressed like a guy. She's got the cap on, she's got the aviator glasses, she's wearing the same jacket that the Iceman wears. She is, okay, this is how I gotta get this guy, this guy's going towards the gay way, I gotta bring him back, I gotta bring him back from the gay way, so I'm do that through subterfuge, I'm gonna dress like a man. All right? That is how she approaches it.... the REAL ending of the movie is when they fight the MIGs at the end, all right? Because he has passed over into the gay way. They are this gay fighting :mad: force, all right? And they're beating the Russians, the gays are beating the Russians. And it's over, and they :mad: land, and Iceman's been trying to get Maverick the entire time, and finally, he's got him, all right? And what is the last :mad: line that they have together? They're all hugging and kissing and happy with each other, and Ice comes up to Maverick, and he says, "Man, you can ride my tail, anytime!" And what does Maverick say? "You can ride mine!"

:eek: Mr. Tarrantino :rolleyes:
I still think there's some great flying scenes.
I wonder how many US Navy chaps claim it was them flying?

[LOTA]

Went to the Paris Air Show late 90s as part of a VIP trip (!); British Aerospace had rigged up mini cinema to show a promo film about Eurofighter, Nimrod MR4A etc.
Appalling film, although the Earthquake-orama effect when the Eurofighter took off was pretty cool.
However, the blonde who starred as a flying officer in the film was absolutely sensational. And as a bonus she was on duty at the cinema,showing ust to our seats etc.
I still havea nosebleed more than 10 years later when I think about it......:rolleyes:

[Jetex Jim]

thawes

superb screen shots from SAC, more please.



"A winter flight" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088407/ Sean Bean, Gary Olsen and a very young Reece Dinsdale as an Assistant Air Traffic Controller. To quote the IMDB site "There is alcohol abuse,violence,sex and birdwatching.

alcohol abuse,violence,sex and birdwatching doesn't have quite the same ring to it as RUM, SODOMY and the LASH, no wonder RN think they are superior to the RAF

[Gainesy]

PEDANTRY COLOUR STATE RED

Yes, seaplanes do "land" on water

No they don't, they "alight" and a Catalina is a flying boat anyway.
Pah! Yoofs.:)

[Lytham Lifeboat]

Now that's what I call music!

Do you want to fly a lightning?

What a silly question :rolleyes:

[Double Zero]

Steamchicken,

I take it that's a wish, not some upcoming gen', about a film of 'Vulcan 607' ?

I'm halfway through it & enjoying it very much; would all writers please take note, even non-pilots want DETAIL about engineering, systems & what the thing's actually like to fly, right down to the smells !

We all like to take the 'P' out of Top Gun, photographers like me point out how the filtration changes from scene to scene - but the fact is it was an epic piece of co-operation by the US Navy, who I imagine got their investment handsomely repaid in recruitment etc.

Compare that to the bloody pitiful efforts we Brit's have managed, like 'Warship' and the ghastly 'Squadron' - I remember a GR3 putting warning Matra rockets either side of a target car in a single salvo - " Good Shooting Sir !"

I don't really buy into this gay thing, seems to me a little industry has grown up discussing this, in the same way students seem to get grants studying whether beer, chocolate & ice cream are nice to consume.

That's not a veiled inference of any kind either, I strictly bat for the conventional team though try to say ' Good Luck' to others as long as they don't harm anyone - God one can't say anything nowadays...

If Ridley Scot can make Aliens etc, and we can manage expensive bolleaux like 007, ( BTW my monicker refers to Dick Dastardly's car, I cringed when I thought people reckoned me a 007 fantasist ) surely there's an epic film waiting to be made about the Falklands - and we're mature enough now to see both sides' views, the Argentines made some fantastic efforts too - trailer launched Exocet for a start...

[Warmtoast]

superb screen shots from SAC, more please.

Attached

Oddly SAC doesn't seem to have been released on DVD. At the time I believe, VistaVision was trumpeted as a sort of HiFi optical system. Given the stunning visuals and if any original studio negative prints of the film are in good condition, SAC is the sort of film crying out for conversion and release on DVD.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/SAC-B-476.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/SAC-B-477.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/SAC-B-472.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/SAC-B-473.jpg

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/SAC-B-475.jpg

[Rossian]

I remember being entranced by the sequence in the B36D prior to the crash on the icecap
"Captain! Fire on the left hand side engine"
"OK, Feather no3 pull the fire extinguisher, 1%2 to 100%, 4&5 to max power, 6,7 and 8 to max power, 9&10 to 100%" Cue blur of hands from the right hand seat and the F/E. Magic stuff!
Mind you I'm not sure I'd have enjoyed being in SAC in those days.
The Ancient Mariner

[EyesFront]

I remember as a boy reading that all the gun turrets on the B36 were retractable, and having visions of the captain ordering "Run out the Guns" as the Migs rose to meet the mighty fleet of atomic bombers....

[Samuel]

As an aside to the thread,Scots actor James McAvoy is in talks to star in the new $US100 million ($NZ131 milion) Dam Busters film.

The Scottish actor, who is tipped for an Oscar for his role as Robbie Turner in Atonement, has met director Christian Rivers and producers David Frost and Peter Jackson.

The 28-year-old will play Wing Commander Guy Gibson who led the 617 Squadron dropping three bouncing bombs in Germany during the World War 2.He actually looks a bit like a young Gibson

The film, which may also star Ian McKellen as scientist Barnes Wallis, will be shot in Wellington, using replica Lancaster bombers built in China.The moulds for the Lancaster were made in Weta Workshops in Wellington, and shipped to China where apparently 10 replicas are being made.Some filming will be done at Scampton.

Stephen Fry, who wrote the screenplay, wouldn't confirm James was in the cast, but said: "He would certainly be the kind of person one would naturally think of. Gibson was young and glamorous and fresh-faced. It would be stupid not to look at an actor like James McAvoy."

It's not easy finding out anything going on in Wellington, because security is tight, and Peter Jackson isn't talking!

[Chaffers]

Not military aviation and you can call me a right soppy ponce but Always is probably my favourite aviation film.

Topgun would have been pretty pants without the soundtrack, gay drama or not as soon as Danger Zone starts blaring out in the first scene the hairs on the back of my neck still go into overdrive.

If they screw up the forthcoming Dambusters film then someone should be shot.

No really, I mean it!

I cannot for the life of me understand why no-one has attempted to make a film about Leonard Cheshire's life. 617, VC, Mossies, atomic bomb, Pacific Islands, Cheshire homes, Lordship etc. Has there been a better bloke in christendom over the last century or more?

[PLovett]

Someone way back on about page 2 referred to "The Bridges at Toko Ri" (spelling may be off) and one of the reasons was Grace Kelly in a swimsuit.

Now, my memory is very ancient but I think the film caused quite a commotion on its release because of the scene where the said Ms Kelly and her screen husband, Mr Holden were supposedly swimming in the nude.:)

Anyway, it is a great film, probably not the best aviation/war film but certainly in the top quarter. :ok:

[yttar]

Hello all,

I'm surprised that 'The Guardian' hasn't been mentioned as the worst aviation film ever (USCG admittedly). Top American tripe!

[Utrinque Apparatus]

You've just watched it, haven't you, eh, haven't you ??? :}

[yttar]

I got called away half way through so I don't know how it ended. I wonder....

Young guy saves old guy,or vice versa, everyone is ok and has a jolly good time forever and ever?

[brickhistory]

Not in order - I'd watch any of them in the first two categories if on:

Best:
12 o' Clock High
The Battle of Britain
The Great Escape (it's a stretch but since they were Allied airmen, I'm counting it. Marvelous book as well.)

Honorable Mentions:
The Bridges at Toko-ri
The Dambusters
Airplane! (The comedy. I believe folks are writing "Airplane" when they mean "Airport")

Worst:
Any Iron Eagle (only saw the first, but imagine the sequels just get worse)

Never saw/never will:
Pearl Harbor

[621andy]

Best- Those magnificent men, BoB, 633,Top Gun(for the flying) 12 squadron(I'll have 'to the Unknown Man' played at my funeral;))

Worst- Top Gun(for the gayness), Pearl H, oh and that unutterably sh1te Howard Hughes Bio a few years ago- can't remember the name, (or have wiped it from my memory). The only film where I've got up walked out 3/4 way through...I tried to give it a chance, really I did:bored:

[Gainesy]

That'll be "The Aviator" Andy, had several clangers, best one was some mate in the background apparently welding the fuselage of the Spruce Goose.:)

[Double Zero]

Gainsey

I have a feeling we crossed paths in previous lives / careers -

anyway ' The Simpsons ' dealt with H.H. very well with the 'Spruce Moose' -hope you saw that one !

Andy

[Max Shutterspeed]

How about Catch The Pigeon?

http://www.hotink.com/wacky/dastrdly/

Some of the CGI is a bit dated now.....

My mate reckons Cloud Dancer, about aeros, but I've never seen it.

One Six Right is also very good:

http://www.onesixright.com/

MS

[charliegolf]

PLovett

Re: The Bridges at Toko Ri

Now, my memory is very ancient but I think the film caused quite a commotion on its release because of the scene where the said Ms Kelly and her screen husband, Mr Holden were supposedly swimming in the nude

My ancient memory is that the controversy with the censor was because Holden and Kelly performed the first screen kiss. In bed!

Always a good watch though.

CG

[NST]

Watched "The Blue Max" this afternoon for the first time in years, still as good as ever. George Peppard was actually doing the flying in some scenes which has to be fairly unique for an actor in a aviation film.

Then onto "Pushing Tin" which as an ex Air Trafficker is always good for a laugh. If only for the quote from the TRACON controller .. "You can land a million planes safely but have one little mid-air and you'll never hear the end of it" .. and of course Angelina Jolie's raspberry ripples .. :ok:

Although the opening scene of the airliners tracking in past the twin towers put a chill down the back.

[MightyGem]

>>>>>>>>Both probably wouldn't translate well to film, but I'd love to see someone make an attempt to make a film of Len Deighton's (fictional) 'Bomber', ...............<<<<<<<

Try the BBC Radio adaptation of the story available on CD.

Originally done in 'real time' from 2.30 to midnight, it is a chilling semi-documentary
Yes, I listened to it some years ago. Scary stuff, especially the shoot down section. :eek:

[doubledolphins]

Gainsey, how many seaplane hours have you got? Do you know how to do a glassy water landing? Stick to the facts. I need alight for my fag, Any one seen my zippo?
oK OK I bit, but you are wrong. I supose you think aircraft recover to ships as well and the term "Deck Landing" makes you go all faint. :ok:
PS. I love, "Angles One Five". "Target for tonight" is an outstanding movie. It was used for leadership discussions during my time at BRNC. On the subject of "Battle of Britain". Get the recent DVD and listen to it with the original William Walton score. Truely magnificent.
PPS. Any one remember a kid's drama called the "Aeronauts" On tv circa 1970? French and dubed into english. Lots of Mirages, etc. I am sure it must have been awful, but I loved it.
PPPS! Listened to the original "Bomber" broadcast on a Sunday night drive to Pompey. You are so right about the sound. with the 4 speaker system in the car it did sound (and almost felt) like I was being shot at.

[lsh]

Hey Shytorque!
"Tales of the Golden Monkey"
"One bark for yes, two for no" Remember??!
Anyway I thought you loved that series!
lsh

[Tiger_mate]

AERONAUTS

The Mirage fighter aircraft series is featured in the popular French comics Tanguy and Laverdure, primarily authored by Jean-Michel Charlier and illustrated by a few different but named illustrators. The two protagonist, Michel Tanguy and Ernest Laverdure, are two fighter pilots in the French Air Force and member of the elite White Stork Squadron (escadrille des cigognes).

In the beginning of their story, they start as two student pilots flying T-33s, it is not until their fourth adventure when they finally sit in the cockpit of a Mirage IIIC. Later on their fighters are upgraded to Mirage IIIE's and the last adventure saw them flying Mirage 2000s. Tanguy and Laverdure's adventure preceded Top Gun by at least one generation. Their adventures are full of political intrigues, espionage, and the romance of aviation. Until today, there is no English translation of their adventures, the aspiring English reader has to learn French to read the originial French comics. However, the comic has been translated into other languages, such as Indonesian.

The stories were made into the 1967-1969 French TV series Les Chevaliers du Ciel, starring Jacques Santi as "Lt Tanguy" and Christian Marin as "Lt Laverdure". The series was made by ORTF and a version of the show dubbed into English and titled The Aeronauts was shown in the UK by the BBC and in Canada on the CBC in the early 1970s.

[Warmtoast]

"OK, Feather no3 pull the fire extinguisher, 1%2 to 100%, 4&5 to max power, 6,7 and 8 to max power, 9&10 to 100%" Cue blur of hands from the right hand seat and the F/E. Magic stuff!

B-36 Flight Engineers earned their pay in those days. Have a look at the F/E's engine panel - 12-across x 5-down, that's 60 dials at least to watch.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/B-36FlightEngineer2.jpg

And think of the check-list and engine start sequence - six of these massive prop jobs plus four jets to get turning and burning before they're up-up and away.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/B-36EngineStart.jpg

[Timeout]

No film could be any worse than "Blue Tornado"

See trailer...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Qg-amWp5x8

[Strangelove PhD]

Agreed. I just watched the clip. It looks cheesey... blue cheesey!

[Gainesy]

Anyone seen my keep net?:)

[steamchicken]

Sadly, I'm not aware of anyone filming 607, which is why I'm trailing the idea...

Pity they'd have to do it all in the studio; unless XH558 is ready. Still no Victors though.

[larssnowpharter]

One is always slightly worried about giving the French credit for anything..............however:

The best modern day flying sequences I have ever seen in a released film were in Les Chevaliers du Ciel (English title Skyfighters, literal translation The Knights of the sky).

Crappy plot in which a Mirage is stolen from the Farnborough Air Show. However, the flying sequences are spectacular, truly. Apparantly, the standard safety rules applied, but eventually the minimum allowed altitude was reduced to 3 m (10 ft) and the minimum distance between aircraft was reduced to 1 m (3 ft). The filming of these flight sequences seen in the movie were mainly done from the air, as opposed to Top Gun where most of the filming was done from the ground.

Not sure if it was released in the UK but the French trailer is here:

http://www.leschevaliers-lefilm.com/jeux/bahd.swf

The official website:

http://www.leschevaliers-lefilm.com/site/intro.html

[Fareastdriver]

Th two pairs of jets were an add-on for the B36. This was so that it would achieve a certain speed and alltitude over the target. Six recips were more than enough to get it airborne and in the cruise it was common to shut down a couple of engines. The jet pods came straight off the B47 and had iris shutters to block off the intakes when not being used.

That's what a USAF major told me in the early 60s walking round the one they had at Offut.

It was fully serviceable and had a war target. One of the conditions General Le May had set for it's preservation.

"There are no free lunches in SAC."

[Double Zero]

Well a certain Jeremey C. would speak up & do his bit I think - he's proven to fight for the right ( I don't mean politics ) before, i.e. the 'Help For Heroes' campaign and endorsed the 607 book, so may be able to at least point people in the right direction.

Bags a cameo role as ' idiot in bar' - I knew some of the true 'boffins' involved but have been unable to contact them - where are you Mel Q ?!

[Groundgripper]

I remember being taken to the cinema to see a film called "The Net", way back in the mid-1950s. It was, I think (but it's a long time ago), an espionage movie about the development of a new secret bomber and information being passed to a foreign state. Its main star, as far as I was concerned, was the prototype (or an early production) Victor and there was a fair amount of flying involved, especially at high altitude for which the crew apparently wore goldfish bowls as helmets. All in black and white, but with a silver Victor and big white clouds there were some good flying sequences.

The denouement involved the deputy test pilot being unmasked as the spy whilst airborne on a test flight. He produced a gun and tried to force the Chief Test Pilot to fly the aircraft to said foreign state. In the ensuing fight he dropped the gun and the CTP pitched the aircraft so that the gun slid back along the cockpit floor. Whilst trying to retrieve it the villain pulled the air supply tube off his helmet and conveniently suffocated.

Anyone else remember it?.........no, I'm not surprised!

Isn't it amazing how trivia sticks in your mind to the detriment of everything else. If I could have remembered what my university lecturers said half as well as I remembered that film, I'd have got a better degree.


GG

[Strangelove PhD]

Nice clip.
Sexy women, and some good aerial footage.
Looks like a cross between Iron Eagle & Top Gun.
Cheese potential is high, very high, after all it's a French production.

[Lytham Lifeboat]

As an aside to the thread,Scots actor James McAvoy is in talks to star in the new $US100 million ($NZ131 milion) Dam Busters film.

The Scottish actor, who is tipped for an Oscar for his role as Robbie Turner in Atonement, has met director Christian Rivers and producers David Frost and Peter Jackson.

The 28-year-old will play Wing Commander Guy Gibson who led the 617 Squadron dropping three bouncing bombs in Germany during the World War 2.He actually looks a bit like a young Gibson

The film, which may also star Ian McKellen as scientist Barnes Wallis, will be shot in Wellington, using replica Lancaster bombers built in China.The moulds for the Lancaster were made in Weta Workshops in Wellington, and shipped to China where apparently 10 replicas are being made.Some filming will be done at Scampton.

Stephen Fry, who wrote the screenplay, wouldn't confirm James was in the cast, but said: "He would certainly be the kind of person one would naturally think of. Gibson was young and glamorous and fresh-faced. It would be stupid not to look at an actor like James McAvoy."

It's not easy finding out anything going on in Wellington, because security is tight, and Peter Jackson isn't talking!


Please NO.
Don't let Hollywood loose on the Dam Busters.
By the time they've finished with WW2, the UK wouldn't have been involved at all, save for housing the brave heroes that came from over the pond to save the world from the nazis :ugh:

In another 20 years or so, they'll end up winning the war in SE Asia too :eek:

Bring back Ealing and Elstree :ok:

[Wader2]

B-36 Flight Engineers earned their pay in those days. Have a look at the F/E's engine panel - 12-across x 5-down, that's 60 dials at least to watch.

I think those dials could be rotated so that the needles would all sit at the same angle. Once everything was stable with say one temp slightly high another slightly low etc, once lined up you could see any variation at a glance.

[Wader2]

[Thread drift warning]

The other multi-engined bomber was the B52 with 8 installed an 2 Hound Dog as well. They use the Hound Dogs for take-off. I would have loved to be a fly on the wall when the Captain discovered that the Co had left the Hound Dogs on full power for almost 6 hours.

Some cockpit checks. You would have thought they might have wondered why they could reduce power on the 8 main engines.:}

[Thread drift warning OFF]

[threeputt]

Was on a weekend in Gioia, in 1990 (when I was on 31 Sqn at Bruggen) with the ever redoubtable W****r "Bongs" W****n. We had a typical GR1 snag and had to hang around for a few hours whilst we waited for some useful "assistance" from the local gingers.

Opposite us on the pan, no more that 100 yards away, was "Faceman" and three real F104 drivers filming a sequence for the very same Blue Tornado. Seemed to Bongs and I that he kept on F:mad:g up the climb up to the cockpit because he tried it about 20+ times! We are actually featured, in said film, taxying out, having finally got the CSAS to wind up to speed.

3P:ok:

[lamer]

great but seems to have been forgotten:
murphy's war http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0067458/

[JT Eagle]

"Don't let Hollywood loose on the Dam Busters."

LL - read that piece on "The Dambusters" new version again and tell me where the words "Hollywood", "USA" "American" turn up even once (and do try to keep up, this was announced well over a year ago). The man behind it is Sir David Frost, the script is being written by Stephen Fry and the producer and director are from New Zealand. Filming will be done in NZ and the UK. At least one American and a Canadian or two should be in the cast, of course.
You're going to mention the dog next, aren't you?

My vote for one of the worst films - 'Tactical Assault' with Rutger Hauer flying a MiG-29/F-16/Kfir/L-39, often on the same sortie, having crazy hair and trying to kill everyone.

'The Net' - I saw part of it on TV one afternoon a couple of years back. Given it seemed to have no real aircraft in it, they did a good job with the special effects.

JT

[foxtrot-oscar]

Suprised nobody has yet mentioned Catch 22, a good flying movie and exceptional totty as well. Who can forget "Dreedle's Wac"

[AlJH]

Have to admit I'm quite a fan of 'Aces High' and 'Mosquito Squadron'. Both great films. When at Dartmouth in flight phase, we used to occupy ourselves by watching 'Top Gun'. Turn it up to full volume to cries of 'F:mad:ing WAFUs!!'.

[ACW599]

Surely Firefox gets the wooden spoon? Dreadful in all respects!

As for best, Dam Busters and Battle of Britain must be somewhere near the top, with a nod in the direction of 633 Squadron. But does anyone else remember a made-for-TV film called Coded Hostile? Nominally about KAL007 and Cobra Ball, but some fine acting and direction -- not to mention highly atmospheric use of John Eliot Gardner's recording of Mozart's Requiem.

[mr fish]

regarding the new dambusters film, i wonder what new pc friendly name they will come up with for gibsons dog ?.the old one might kick up a bit of fuss!!!:eek:

[GPMG]

Hopefully there will be two versions, one for general public viewing and a second for those of us that can tell the difference between racism and daft PC attitudes.

What a shame that history has to be re-written to pander to the whiney liberals.

[jindabyne]

WRT earlier posts, and although not a 'film' per se, the 12 Sqn Buccaneer piece was altogether unique, dynamic and well -produced. Just a shame about that posing Sqn Ldr and his navigator's briefing. Otherwise a masterpiece ---.

[AlJH]

There was a thread on here a while back about the new 'Dambusters' and the name of the dog. It will apparently be called Trigger.

[goudie]

A remake of 'The Dambusters' will not appeal to those who saw it first time round I venture.
Why?
All the flying scenes computor generated.
In colour.
Modern accents.
Uniforms always smart and clean.
A love interest included
Script changes
Code name changed to trigger.

There again the 30 somethings will probably love it.

[jindabyne]

AI
Apparently so? But its name was Nigger! Was then, always will be. Why should we we-write history - far worse 'names' could be reconstructed in the quest for PC, eg Hitler. But they're not. What a load of 2007 bolloc*s.

[JT Eagle]

Why did I mention the dog? NOBODY KNOWS WHAT THE DOG WILL BE CALLED IN THE NEW VERSION!!!!!!!
Seriously - mention a new version of the Dambusters and the same tiny-minded people come out of the woodwork saying they know what they will be done with the dog and it's all political correctness gon maaad, and ya couldn't make it aaahp and you know who I had in my caaab laaast week - that David Irving, nah there's somebody who calls a spade a spade. WITHOUT A SHRED OF EVIDENCE. Oh Jesus Christ, give it a rest.

JT

[woptb]

"The Bridges at Toko-Ri",with William Holden & Mickey Rooney is an excellent film & an even better book.
"Pearl Harbor",by a country mile is the biggest waste of celluloid/heap of cack I've ever wasted a few moments of my life watching!

[AlJH]

Don't shoot the messenger matey, I never said I agreed with it!! I hate all this PC bull sh*t. I don't know why but whenever I see or hear those two letters, an image of Ruth Kelly or Margaret Becket (or both God forbid!) flashes into my mind, and I go into an automatic rage and start mumbling to myself.

Anyhow, this new version is apparently being made by the Kiwi who did Lord of the Rings, I think his name is Peter Jackson.

[Wigan Warrior]

I wouldn't worry about the dog's name.
The animal rights people will put paid to a dog being used.
They'll end up using a Teddy bear instead... wait till the name for that's picked :eek:

Remember the old maxim never work with kids or teddy bears!

[Wiley]

Going to see "The Bridges at Toko-Ri" was a seminal moment for me, (if that's the right word). As a totally aeroplane-mad kid, I loved all the aeroplane and war-ie stuff in it, including Mickie Rooney's top hat and scarf, (did the pilot have to 'stir the soup' quite to that degree in a 'Dragonfly' in the hover? - it doesn't matter, I loved it all, unreservedly).

But the bathhouse scene in Japan made me realise there was another aspect to life other than aeroplanes.... Grace Kelly in that white swimsuit.... (Or am I getting confused with the white swimsuit she wore in 'High Society'? Was it a white bathrobe in 'Bridges'? - doesn't matter.) Lump in the throat stuff - (or was the lump a foot or two below my adolescent throat?) - and knowing she got it all orf and was naked in that steamy water with lucky ole Bill and the Japanese couple.... in 1950's provincial Orstralya, that amounted to hard core Saturday arvo porn.

On to Steve McQueen and 'The War Lover'... great movie. I was reminded of that movie every time I flew formation and saw only my aircraft with the halo around it - and all the other aircraft in the formation 'unblessed', without the ring of light.

Even today, whenever I break out of cloud with the sun behind me and see the halo around my lone aircraft, McQueen's character's comment to his crew in 'The War Lover' comes to mind.

[rodthesod]

I think Slim Pickins as a B52 and Nuke pilot in 'Dr Strangelove' should get a mention in dispatches here.

rts

[snapper41]

Anyone seen 'Flyboys' yet? Pretty awful stuff, especially seeing CGI Fokker Triplanes that have a rate of climb comparable to a Lightning on steroids...

For a good one - what about 'A Matter of Life and Death' starring David Niven as the bomber pilot on trial in Heaven for his life?

[dakkg651]

rts

It has been mentioned a few times in earlier posts if you care to read them!

[GPMG]

http://www.filmstalker.co.uk/archives/2007/03/stephen_fry_to_write_dam_buste.html

Stephen Fry (http://www.uk.imdb.com/name/nm0000410/) looks set to be the writer behind the remake of the classic wartime film The Dam Busters (http://www.uk.imdb.com/title/tt0046889/) simply called Dambusters (http://www.uk.imdb.com/title/tt0855775/). Fry said himself that the remake is going ahead with Peter Jackson (http://www.uk.imdb.com/name/nm0001392/) and he spoke from New Zealand where he currently is working with Jackson himself:
"It's a new film on the subject of the dam buster raid in 1943, with Barnes Wallis developing his famous bouncing bomb, the training of the squadron, and the raid itself... ...I'm writing a script for Peter in New Zealand, and for David Frost who's an executive producer. I loved the original, so this is great for me."
Is the quote from Teletext (http://www.teletext.co.uk/entertainment/film/news/1/Fry+to+write+Jackson%27s+Dam+Busters.aspx). He does say that he is sure we will remember the classic 1954 original with Richard Todd (http://www.uk.imdb.com/name/nm0865262/) and Michael Redgrave (http://www.uk.imdb.com/name/nm0714878/). Indeed, it is a complete classic.
It is interesting that Fry has been chosen for the writing, I'd class him as one of the most intellectual and witty men I've ever seen on screen, and his writing includes some superb television, with Bright Young Things (http://www.uk.imdb.com/title/tt0325123/) being his main screenplay.
I think he'll be a great choice for the film, but can the film really retain the great feelings of the original through all the effects that will be poured upon it? I suppose one thing is true, we'll see a much less romanticised version of the story.

[jindabyne]

AI

Sorry, no flak intended in your direction - merely a general rant on the topic! Agree about the ladies.

JTE - calm down.

[AR1]

Top guns Gpz 900 was actually a rarity - Gpz 750.

I like that one where they're having trouble with the sound barrier in the new jets, I'm sure one of the jets is a Supermarine Swift. In my mind anyway...Cant remember the films name for the life of me.

Worst? Top Gun, despite the Gpz, vomit inducing american claptrap. I've seen it hundreds of times , just to make sure.

[Fitter2]

Oddly enough called 'The Sound Barrier'. The one where the TP pushes the stick forward to pitch up and avoids the aircraft breaking up. Caused much merriment in flying circles at the time.

[Exnomad]

An aside about the "Blue Max". I was working for FG Miles at the time where the SE5as for the film were built.
RAE were asked if they had any data on the SE5, they replied "we have all the manufacturing drawings". The replicas were built to the original drawings, the only significant mods were a longer nose for the straight six Gypsy Queen against the original V8 and a larger fin to make up for the longer nose

[Confucius]

Tora Tora Tora.

Why the best?

More like a documentary than a movie.


Worst?

Pearl Harbor

nuff said.

[ExRAFRadar]

Bit of thread creep, sorry.

Someone mentioned a comic a few pages back with a WW3 theme.

Remember it well, someone had done thier homework, Tornado's CAPing convoys over the Atlantic etc.

One bit that always sticks in my mind was a few pages of the main hero (Harrier pilot nach) landing at a bombed out school that had just been trounced by the 'EASTPAC' bombers. He landed to see if he could help !

Some old bloke was actually shaking his fist and saying "Bloody RAF, where were you" - Classic.

I think there was a spin off series about a shotgun totin' lorry driver helping the resistance once the EASTPAC forces had overrun the UK.

Back on track: Best film BoB
Worst : Behind Enemy Lines (What was that Super Sam)

[captain_gash]

Cant believe know one has mentioned flight of the intruder…………….awesome movie…………low flying, gritty, not too many chicks……….and lines like

“Fighter pilots make movies ………..bomber pilots make history!!”


:ok:

[Samuel]

I'm bound to say that Peter Jackson's only comment so far on the name of the dog is neither of the above! What he has said is that he will be damned if he does [use Nigger] and damned if he doesn't.:ugh:

[Jetex Jim]

From the Earth to the Moon


The series I'm referring to is , From the Earth to the Moon is essentially the story of the US space project, primarily the Apollo part of it.

For engineers the episode Spider which deals at some length with the development by Gruman of the Lunar lander, is excellent stuff and as far as I can tell devoid of Hollywood interferance to add spurious drama.

[scribbler614]

Contenders not mentioned so far (that I can see)

Best: The Right Stuff (1983) Chuck Yeager scenes are coooool, by Hollywood standards at any rate. Good book, too.

Worst: Firefox (1982)
Clint Eastwood dragged out of pilot retirement to steal a Soviet super-stealth-jet-thingy, with THE worst special effects you ever want to see.
Dismal.


...and agreed, Miss York in The Battle of Britain has the finest aviation-related bottom ever filmed. Three cheers!

[charliegolf]

If another wide-ranging docu drama series on slavery (such as 'Roots') were to be made, would it be anything other than a sham if the word were excluded for PC reasons? The reason FOR using it would be historical truth and accuracy wouldn't it?
So if the dog REALLY WERE called 'Nigger' (used for decades as an adjective as well as a noun), how is history served if it's dropped?
CG

Is it still in the OED, by the way? (not able to check)

[Tyres O'Flaherty]

Re comic with ww3 theme, 2000 AD o' course.

Don't remember the Tornado cap or whatever, but the serial was about the truck driver more than anything. ''Invasion'', the truck driver leading the resistance against the ''Volgans'' ;), with his trusty shotgun was ''Bill Savage''.

Top stuff. See we wouldn't have needed the boys in blue after all :8

[nacluv]

the TP pushes the stick forward to pitch up and avoids the aircraft breaking up. Caused much merriment in flying circles at the time.

I understand that the phenomenon of 'aileron inversion' was relatively common when the sound barrier was being approached. Your TP was actually correct - pulling the stick back does nothing. Stick forward brings the nose UP.

Google "aileron inversion" for more info.

[k3k3]

I'd be very surprized if moving the ailerons affected the pitch of the aircraft.

(Dicounting things like Bucc type aileron droop)

[RRAAMJET]

Best: BoB (just watching the 'advisors' to the production in the credits is a who's who...)

Medium: Hanover Street (Lesley-Ann Down...OMG :ooh:)

Medium bad: if you like your aviating whirring around and around... Blue Thunder

Worst: Iron Turkey (any of them),
Midway

[GeoffLeBreton]

Not the best or worst but I remember seeing a movie called 'Sabre Jet' back in the mid-1950s. I grew up near Liverpool Airport and after looking through the hangar doors, probably circa 1953-1954, and seeing a large number of F-86s under maintenance as well as watching them above - we lived not far from the USAF base at Burtonwood - I thought it was the most beautiful thing in the sky. It certainly looked more exciting than the usual Meteors and Vampires . I think Alan Ladd and June Allyson played the leads in the movie and I remember air combat scenes from the Korean War being depicted. I have not heard of the movie since and nobody has mentioned it in this thread. Does anyone have information on it?

[South Bound]

Best: By virtue of a few minutes with helicopters in the background - Apocalypse Now

Worst: PH by a mile, not even saved by the luscious Kate I am afraid. Could have forgiven the godawful portrail of the attack itself, but the last hour spent trying to show it was not all a complete coup for the Japanese was unforgiveable.

[Warmtoast]

Sabre Jet

Does anyone have information on it?

More here: http://imdb.com/title/tt0046262/

[TMJ]

Best: By virtue of a few minutes with helicopters in the background - Apocalypse Now


Ugh, I hate Apocalypse Now with a passion, though the helo scene was good.

[quoue]Worst: PH by a mile, not even saved by the luscious Kate I am afraid. Could have forgiven the godawful portrail of the attack itself, but the last hour spent trying to show it was not all a complete coup for the Japanese was unforgiveable.[/quote]

PH is a film I've avoided, but my JOCC syndicate did use a clip from it in a presentation on the Doolittle Raid...

[Jetex Jim]

Worst: PH by a mile, not even saved by the luscious Kate I am afraid. Could have forgiven the godawful portrail of the attack itself, but the last hour spent trying to show it was not all a complete coup for the Japanese was unforgiveable.


Speaking of attacking harbours, maybe when the Dambuster remake is complete the producers could turn their attention to the Battle of Taranto, it would not play too well in Italy I suppose but worth filming for sure...

[robin]

Just seen a new one that looks to be competing in the worst category - Flyboys. An attempt to show the US involvement in the Escadrille Lafayette in WW1.

Seemed to me that a bunch of PC gamers had directed the film................

[Hempy]

The funniest part of Firefox was how the missile defense system read the pilots brain patterns through the helmet, but he had to think in Russian. By the time he remembered the Russian word for "flares" he could have reached and punched them off 15 times :8

[rjtjrt]

Another long forgotten excellent movie was based on Joe Kittinger and John Paul Stapp's literally death defying experiments in the 1950's called
"On the Threshold of Space".

[AR1]

On the small screen, the hilarious 'Squadron' - I tuned in, only to see a Chief Tech fixing a storno in a car....

I seem to recall some QRF being deployed somewhere in africanistan and the fantastic line delivered from the force leader to a Phantom crew. "Kill that Jaguar" - I think he also used a storno. Impressive integrated comms....

Mind you that was bit more beleiveable as there was some 'previous' in that department. (F4 Vs Jag)

[SirPercyWare-Armitag]

Best: Battle of Britain. Worst: Top Gun

Does any remember a b/w film about a community complaining about the RAF flying near a bird-sanctuary? Seem to recall a bird strike on a Vampire

[RETDPI]

"Conflict of Wings" - or somesuch?

[Wiley]

Any flying film is a good film!You obviously haven't seen 'Pearl Harbour'.

[PLovett]

Another candidate for the worst film is "The Lion Has Wings".

It was made just prior to WW2 and was meant to reassure the public that the air defences would deter any aerial attack on the green and pleasant lands. The best scene was the German bomber pilot telling his crew that he was turning back as the barrage balloons made it too dangerous to continue.:D

A truely hideous film. So bad its fun to watch.:}

[delta96]

B52 SAC movie starring Rock Hudson. An awful story with good a/c shots. Its IMDB synopsis was telling:
"He is also recently married, and as a tough commanding officer doing whatever he has to do to shape his men up, his wife sees a side to him that she hadn't seen before."
So did his men, I assume.

[Wigan Warrior]

... but nevertheless an aviation related film (I think).

When I were a yoof, I recall a film. A thriller.
The main part I remember was a lady with nice bongos displaying said items :ooh:
I seem to recall the film was about an ex RAF Jaguar Pilot whom took to the bottle and was being 'framed' for killing ladies, including the aforementioned bongos woman. Probably 1970s vintage.
Did I dream this :confused:

[moggiee]

Best - Battle of Britain. No explanation needed - it's just perfect.

Worst: 12 O'clock high. Cheesy (and not just because I had to sit through it at IOT).

[bjw824]

Hello GLB
I think is the one:-:ok:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0048364/

[oldpax]

"Catch 22"

[MAINJAFAD]

"From Hell to Victory", starring the incomparable George Peppard. If there's a category for "So bad it's good", this would be the winner. You name it, it's got it, but very badly. A must-see for all aviation type persons.

With Spitfires in German markings and Spanish Me-109 clones in RAF 'desert cammo' during the Battle of Britain, its got to win this one for worst film hands down.

[BEagle]

Sir Percy, that movie (it was in colour) was indeed 'Conflict of Wings'.

Lots of contemporary Meteor and Vampire shots - and the odd Swift (prototype I think).

[Jetex Jim]

B52 SAC movie starring Rock Hudson. An awful story with good a/c shots. Its IMDB synopsis was telling:
"He is also recently married, and as a tough commanding officer doing whatever he has to do to shape his men up, his wife sees a side to him that she hadn't seen before."



This is a precussor to the old joke of the time when Rock H was eventually revealed to be gay... his wife didn't know which way to turn.

[Wiley]

Someone mentioned that the Beeb had done a very good radio dramatisation of Len Deighton's 'Bomber' a few years ago. I've just trolled through the BBC site, but it doesn't appear to be listed there.

Is there someone who may be a bit more adept at searching the BBC site who can say whether it is available as a podcast from the BNC?

[Jetex Jim]

The radio version Bomber was available on BBC audio tape at one time

[teeteringhead]

When I were a yoof, I recall a film. A thriller.
The main part I remember was a lady with nice bongos displaying said items
I seem to recall the film was about an ex RAF Jaguar Pilot whom took to the bottle and was being 'framed' for killing ladies, including the aforementioned bongos woman. Probably 1970s vintage.
....... sounds like Hitchcock's "Frenzy" (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0068611/) to me. ISTR Jon Finch's character being a drunk ex-pilot - his wife even gives him a hard time about his AFC at one time I think.

[Wigan Warrior]

Thanks Teetering,
Frenzy, that's the film :ok:
An RAF Pilot that likes a drink, gets a hard time from his wife and gets blamed for something he didn't do.
Where does Hitchcock get his inspiration from :confused:

[Croqueteer]

:)For a good laugh, you have to include "These Magnificent Men" and "Airplane", I also remember seeing good American Navy flying films in the 50s when I were a lad, Cougars of decks, ect, I wouldn't mind seeing them again if I could find a source.

[Strangelove PhD]

An RAF Pilot that likes a drink, gets a hard time from his wife and gets blamed for something he didn't do.
Where does Hitchcock get his inspiration from :confused:

I saw the film 'Stealth' last night.
I had to have a few drinks afterwards, its was tosh of the highest order.
My darling wife had a go at me for moaning about it then and I got blamed for ordering the wrong food from the chinese (not guilty).

[robin]

A download is available here

http://www.downloadaudiobooksonline.net/Title.aspx?titleId=340

or you could order it on CD from here

http://www.bbcshop.com/invt/9780563523550

There are other sources such as Amazon

[Fokkerwokker]

I think you'll find it was William Wyler, not Howard Hawkes, who directed the original documentary Memphis Belle, the ground sequences of which were shot at Bassingbourn. His daughter, whose name I forget, made the 1980s re-make, with Harry Connick in the lead.

Attn Buster 11

Not quite correct sir.

Air to airs were shot at Duxford after which we decamped to Binbrook for the ground sequences.

William Wyler's daughter was Catherine.

Matthew Modine had the lead part.

Great bunch of crew on the film set who gave it their all. Just a shame that the story line was a bit weak and watery in parts and that they used those horrendous models representing serried ranks of B17s in the sky. I honestly believe some of the best stuff ended up on the cutting room floor.

Being at the coal face it was an amazing experience to be surrounded by acres of B17s with 109s half rolling towards you. The way the cheek guns started hammering blanks was still, nevertheless, enough to make your hair stand on end. To people my age the war was fought in black and white. For a few seconds I started to understand.......

I could go on but would be rightly accused of being a sad old git!

AW

[PLovett]

Not at all Fokkerwokker.

My moment of understanding came when I saw the look in the eyes of doctor who, while doing my annual aviation medical, spoke of the loneliness he felt while hearing a fellow squadron pilot being shot down over North Africa. Chilling.

Sorry about the thread drift.

[Wigan Warrior]

A few interesting bloopers / gaffs gleamed from t'nternet relating to a couple of films frequently mentioned in this thread:

Pearl Harbour
In the movie, Rafe is assigned to an RAF Eagle Squadron prior to USA involvement in WW II by order of Jimmy Doolittle. In reality, active duty personnel could not be assigned to serve with a belligerent nation while the US was neutral. They would have to resign their USAF commission and re-enlist into the RAF (usually via Canada). This practice was greatly discouraged.

Rafe wears an Eagle Squadron badge, as do the Spitfires. The squadron code 'RF' is for No.303 Squadron, which was a Polish unit. The only Hurricane seen in the film has the correct codes for an Eagle Squadron, 'XR-T' for No.71 Squadron.

In the England scene, a spitfire with a four-blade propeller is seen. This was a late-war model. All Spitfires at the time of the Battle of Britain were models with three-blade constant pitch propellers.

Top Gun
When Top Gun first came out, everybody in our squadron made a big joke of the "Deadly Blue Tubes". This refers to the sidewinder missiles that were supposedly launched from the Tomcats. Those who are familiar with aircraft weapons would know that the blue tube is a sidewinder simulator. If you were to launch this from the aircraft, all it could do is drop like a rock.

During the briefing before the final scene, the Captain says, "The Migs carry the Exocet missile. They can fire that missile from a hundred miles away." Yes they could fire the Exocet from a hundred miles away, but the Exocet's maximum range is around 40 miles.

Take notice of everyone's hands during the action sequences. No one is wearing gloves. As standard issue for military pilots, the gloves are made of Nomex and provide protection from fire and allow for a better grip when things get a little hot and heavy.

(text copied directly from web pages (moviemistakes.com), so apologies for any spellling mistakes)

[Wiley]

Fokkerwokker, I think I could safely say I speak for quite a few others when I say "prattle on - as much as you like", about the making of the movie.

If I may be allowed a bit of thread drift myself, when I was still at school, my next door neighbour was a bloke who, at age 18, had been an ambulance driver at a major northern Australian military airfield during WW2. Sitting listening to the men yarning under the house over a few beers towards the end of a BBQ one night, (and keeping very quiet, hoping I wouldn't be noticed and told to go upstairs to join the women, who, back in those days, would always finish the evening in the kitchen cleaning up while the men stayed downstairs knocking over a few beers, half choking in the smoke from their roll yer own ciggies and the stinking mosquito coils they'd have burning under their chairs), I heard him casually say how they often used to run fire hoses in through the waist gunner's window and down to the tail gunner's cubicle on the USAAF B17s that got back from missions over New Guinea to clean the blood and gore out.

It was the first time I'd ever heard use the phrase "we hosed them out", and possibly the first time I realised that war might involve something more than a clean cut shoulder wound that allowed the hero in my Biggles comics to wear a semi-decorative sling over his uniform.

[Dan D'air]

Flight of the Intruder has some cracking A6 scenes in it, especially the one where they are just playing around with the (IIRC) padre, trying to make him sick...........

[Confucius]

I seem to recall that the '83 TVM "The Aerodrome" had a shot (or two) of a TSR-2 in it.

Makes it worth it's weight in gold, whatever the rest of the movie was like.

[scran]

Dan D'Air - I thought it was the Doc in FLight of the Intruder.

And Wigan - saw an interesting pic of a Tomcat Pilot in the Gulf. He had cut 3 fingers out of his Nomex Glove, claiming it gave him a better feel of controls during "busy" periods..................

[Strangelove PhD]

I saw Black Hawk Down last night.
I was sceptical beforehand, but after watching it I was very impressed.
The cast, direction, filmography and special effects were very good.

I was very surprised to find out how many of the cast were Brits.

I much prefer films based on true stories, I feel it gives them an extra dimension.

[Pontius Navigator]

How about True Lies with the awesome AV8B?

Or Blue Thunder with its whisper mode?

Both cracking aviation scenes.

[Ritero]

Best: Probably Top Gun. I wish there were more cheesy hollywood films about fast jets.

Worst: Stealth. It's meant to be futuristic, so the key cast members don't fly real jets, but there are some real jets in the movie. This isn't just the worst aviation film I've ever seen, it's the worst film period. It's not even so bad it's good. It's worse than that.

[Dan D'air]

Scran, You are right, obviously I didn't recall correctly, thanks!!!

Ritero, blimey mate!!! Don't beat about the bush, just say it how it is!!

[The Adjutant]

The best has to be "Its In The Air" staring George Formby made in the mid 1930's. Story is that our George joins the RAF by mistake and gets up to all sorts of daft antics. Lots of "crazy flying" from old prewar aircraft flown supposedly by George, but in fact by a bloke called Jimmy Wells who was a member of 600 Sqn AAF. Lots of real RAF people and a real RAF airfield used for the filming to save the production company money.
The film is a complete farce, and funny if you like that sort of thing.

[LOTA]

Or in similar vein, how about Frank Spencer doing OASC at Biggin Hill (them were the days!) in Some Mothers Do Ave Em?

[doubledolphins]

Confucius is correct. But of course it did not fly. Lots of 50s hardware and a Vulcan.


How about the one where NIMITZ (the ship) is transported back in time to just before the attack on Pearl Harbor (sic) and does nothing except listen to the radio. The Dogfight between the Zeros (Harvards) and F14s was fun.

Also, as some one (Sorry) started on about tv series as well, I loved "Piece of Cake". I know the old boys who flew in the battle did it did not like it. But for me it realy brought home tensions and realities of fighting every day and living amoungst people who did not have a clue by night. I came to regard them with even more respect. Beside the characters were believable, I was at school with people like that!

[RETDPI]

How about the one where NIMITZ (the ship) is transported back in time to just before the attack on Pearl Harbor (sic) and does nothing except listen to the radio. The Dogfight between the Zeros (Harvards) and F14s was fun.

The Final Countdown. Apparently Grumman Company Pilots flying the F-14's versus the Zarvards. Superb photography IIRC including an F-14 getting pretty close to the water whilst playing with the veteran opposition.

[Double Zero]

I thought that, in its' way, a good film with a neat twist in the story; I am sure I am not the only person who wished for a sequel / different ending on the lines of ' sod corrupting the time-line, let 'em have it ! '

Then again I enjoy sci-fi and time travel stories; there was a 2-part story in 'Enterprise' - the last & possibly best in every way Star Trek derivative, much better stories & effects, a certain gritiness - where a shuttle craft entering Earth airspace was bounced by .50 bullets pinging against the hull, to find it was being attacked by Mustangs wearing swastikas - never did see the second part to know how well or not the story developed !

[Fareastdriver]

In the 50s I remember watching a film callled 'Fighting Lady'. It was about an American aircraft carrier in the Pacific. The first half in B&W and the second half in colour. Apart from a few brief interludes it was non-stop mayhem.

[LittleMo]

Flight of the Intruder definately, with quotes like 'you got the time, we got the beer' why they didn't win an oscar is beyond me :}

Good A6 and A1 scenes though.

Worst has to be Iron Eagle 1 trough 14 :yuk:

[Sunk at Narvik]

"Flight of the Intruder"- is that the one set in the Libyan desert with the crew of a crashed B25?

Shall I give away the creepy ending? :E

[Dan D'air]

Narvik, its the one with Willem Dafoe as the BN who goes to bomb downtown Hanoi, gets court-martialled and then miraculously reprieved on some ludicrous pretext.

Never happen in real life, you'd get shafted by this lot for just trying to do your job properly!!!

Ps., If you ever see the film, look out for the fuel gauges, they are like the LED's on an '80s Matsui stereo, Fantastic!!!!

[Green Meat]

Double Zero - The Final Countdown indeed! Superb Navy sequences before the toning down job.
The Bridges at Toko Ri - same but earlier!
Strategic Air Command - just to see Jimmy Stewart back in a bomber!
Dambusters is good - obviously!
Pathfinders TV series for more lovely Lancs!
By Dawn's Early Light, just for the amazing quality radar picture on the rear gunner's scope (think green screen video game!) and the use of a "Special Weapon" as a defensive measure. Won't give the game away any more than that!

I always want to like BoB for Hamish Mahaddie's outstanding organisation of the world's 23rd or 24th largest air force (I sure someone knows the right answer!), some superb sequences and so forth, but I can't help getting to the end and getting the feeling that something has been missed out. Heresy, I know!

[Strangelove PhD]

Wonderful. I had forgotten al about George Formby's classic:

It's In The Air

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kyXPT4GgurA

It highlights Tom Cruise as the charlatan he is.

Anyone know what the dog was called :eek:

The more synical commentators may point to the excellent portrayal of a stereotypical back-seater; hasn't a clue what's going on, realises and gives it silk :p

[Tyres O'Flaherty]

Narvik, the one set in the desert with the B25 is ''sole survivor'', iirc, with the crew actually (SPOILER ALERT !!) dead. But they don't know it. & Richard Baseheart as the weaselly member that jumped and survived.

Top film actually

[Wigan Warrior]

Strangelove, nice clip :ok:

In a 'Top Gun' styleee, what do you think George Fomrby's callsign was?

'banjo' (I can't spell ukelele)

A top bloke from Wigan, not much of a warrior though, watching that clip, more of a worrier.

[Double Zero]

That B-25 film, which I have not seen or heard of, sounds quite like the book & ( poorly done with Robert Powell ) film 'The Survivor' where a 747 captain is the only survivor of a crash, and seeks down the corrupt company guy who shed safety standards for profit - point is once he's sorted the chap out, he finds HE's dead all along too but sent back to seek justice...

On a slightly serious note, there seems something about air accidents which encourages ' paranormal ' stuff...plenty of 'evidence' if one has an open mind, though what it actually is, is way beyond me or anyone else it seems - I did meet an ex-hostess of the 'Ghost of Flight 401' fleet, and she seemed a thoroughly normal person ( esp. by hostie standards - sorry ! ) , also utterly convinced.

Maybe this is just 'Jet Blast' material, but thinking about it how about a thread on airfield / aircraft 'Ghosts' for want of a better term ?

Military airfields seem particularly prone, which doesn't seem surprising...

[Max Shutterspeed]

Maybe this is just 'Jet Blast' material, but thinking about it how about a thread on airfield / aircraft 'Ghosts' for want of a better term ?

Military airfields seem particularly prone, which doesn't seem surprising...

There's the St George Hotel at Teesside. One of the rooms was supposedly hit by a Vampire in the 50's - the pilot crashed into his own billet. Apparently, he survived the crash, but was killed by falling masonry.

Bugger....

Or, of course, it could be a rumour put out amongst the female cabin staff by visiting airline pilots, "Don't worry, I'll keep you company, darling..."

MS

[Double Zero]

That's not too much of a surprise either, on several levels - at the range at West Freugh a rather attractive secretary (indeed a rarity in that area ) had a lot of zaps on her window, which visiting A-10 pilots naturally used as an aiming point - not on approach there, but over the 'field, I quite often saw them less than a wingspan up, inverted...

It's possible Harrier 2 pilots did similar but more skilled & sensible things - I couldn't comment - though I did see a Tornado F3 head flat out very very low for the hangars, to the extent knowledgable people were running, to pull up sharply & carry straight on skidding on the same trajectory, jetpipes around 6' above the grass they were blowing away - the thing eventually scraped over the hangars, I imagine those on the ground were not the only ones to find ' adrenaline is brown' - felt very sorry for the backseater !

As for my previous comments, yes might sound a bit weird but try spending a night at Brooklands or Dunsfold !

[richlear]

Most of my flying these days is in the back of an Air France 777 sipping cheap champagne...but on the last CDG-LAX I saw a film (in French naturally) which revolved around the theft of a Mirage2000 & the efforts to recover it by a couple of yo-yos & a couple of nice ladies. The plot was pants but some great aerial sequences. The chase scene where a Mirage & Alphajet play tag is especially good.

Cheers

rich

[JEM60]

Re the comments on the film about the B.25 in the desert. I have seen this film twice over the years, and it is one of the most imaginative and intriguing films I have ever seen. My wife adored it. As well as Richard Baseheart, it also starred William [Star Trek} Shatner as a military lawyer. I would love to acquire this film on video or DVD, but I think the title, Sole Survivor, may be incorrect. I can find no reference to it. If anyone can point me in the right direction to obtain this, I will be delighted, and , if anyone sees it advertised on television, I urge you to watch it. As someone says, Top Film.

[JEM60]

:)I have just discovered that the correct title of this film is indeed 'Sole Survivor',so apologies for all those thousands of you who were trying to help me.:):):)

[JEM60]

Made in 1970, Made for TV, and may well have been directed by Steven Spielberg

[Strangelove PhD]

Is this the film?

A B-24 is found deep in the Libyan desert which was reported missing in action - except for the navigator who had bailed out over water. The story is told by the Air Force investigators, the navigator who was brought along to help identify his old aircraft, and the ghosts of the crew who have been at the plane since it went down due to lack of fuel. It is a story of panic, courage, survival and the conscious thoughts of the navigator. Does not end as how you expect it.

Inspired by the discovery of an almost intact B-24 in Libya in 1954 by an oil exploration team who discovered both it and the remains of the crew with the plane.


If so, according to the Internet Movie Data Base, it wasn't a Speilberg film. William 'James T' Shatner was in it.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0065007/

[Wiley]

Off topic, (sorry about that), but I think the B24 in question was the victim of a jetstream (before anyone knew they existed). Coming back from a raid over Italy, the aircraft picked up unusually strong tailwinds, which went unnoticed, as they were IMC, and when they tried to get a homing on their base's beacon, (or it might have been a VDF - [anyone else out there old enough to remember VDFs?], or even a Radio Range), they got the back beam (there were no needles in those days, just a null, which you tried to stay on to aim for base).

They correctly stayed on the null ... and flew further and further into the desert, their base behind them, until they ran out of fuel.

[JEM60]

Cheers, Strangelove PHD. Spieberg was second hand info. To my delight, I have found a seller on the internet. Cheers people.