Hong Kong Joining Cabin Baggage Foolishness

[pontius's pa]

Here we go

It was reported on the TV news last night that from 21 March liquids in cabin baggage at Hong Kong airport will be restricted to 100 mm and must be in clear plastic bags, which will be X-rayed separately, (not being a chemist, what you might find when you X-ray liquid is not apparent to me).

It was not stated whether crews will be affected by this nonsense, the introduction of which is blamed on "ICAO guidelines"

[411A]

Same all over Europe, and of course the USA.
What's the big deal?
Is HKG so special?:ugh:

Also...
Quite frankly, I believe it is high time that airports/airlines started to severely restrict the size of cabin bags.
Some of the rollerboards I have seen recently are large enough for the mother-in-law...inside.:sad:

[pontius's pa]

411A

Just because the USA and Europe, (all of it? are you sure?), have because of one dubious incident indulged in an hysterical over-reaction that severely inconveniences crews and passengers with no perceivable security benefit does not mean that every one else has to follow, unless ICAO has published a Standard on the subject, which I doubt. Of course you can still buy inflammable booze, perfume and other highly inflammable products in HKG Duty Free.

Cabin bags? I quite agree although it has been a problem for years that for some reason authorities have not tackled effectively, probably because some airport outlets inside the restricted area sell cases that are bigger than the allowed dimensions!!.

[ftrplt]

Australia doing the same

[GlueBall]

Yes, Australia's uncle Howard is another distant cousin of Bush. Plastic knives in catering cuttlery on all Oz flights, just as on USA flights, paired with dull stainless steel forks and spoons!
Just had my tiny scissors removed from my bag; the mindless, rabid security hysteria excludes all aspects of common sense and logic. I told this friendly human robot that I was the captain of the flight and that I had control of the airplane with or without scissors. She gave me a kangaroo stare and acknowledged that the scissors indeed were tiny, but that they had a sharp "pointy" end . . .which was prohibited. Never mind about the pointy end of my mechanical pencil.

[christep]

ICAO Guidelines are here: http://www.icao.int/atb/sfbranch/files/SL06-100%20EN%20.pdf

[OldBillXV]

21st March is the big day in HKG.... Should be fun! :ugh: Everyone going through the airport will be subjected to the same security screening requirements no exceptions..... := that includes the a/c drivers and airport staff!

I hear the question noone has tackled yet is what to do with all the duty free booze that passengers will probably dump when transiting..... as Customs will not let security personnel nor the airlines remove it landside.... yet they don't want to handle either! Can't wait!:ok:

XV

[Bangkokeasy]

Oh Lordy, here we go again...

Passing through SIN last evening, noticed a big sign at check-in that read, "Please note hand luggage is permitted on all flights out of Singapore"

I do hope this madness is not going to spread to otherwise well-run airports.

[Load Toad]

I can't take liquids on in my hand luggage but I can take my lap top - it's got a nearly indestructible plastic coated wire cord with it that I could throttle someone with and a fairly heavy plug on the end of that with three fairly pointy brass pins on the end. But nail clippers I can't take on board.

[Schroedinger]

We always repat through Hongkong to N.A. We always get our two liters of JW Blue at Bahrain. Where will they check for liquids? Airside (Boarding) or at check-in?

[the dean]

al_ j,

as i understand it in europe any way...( and i am not sure of your travel details...) if you are transiting bahrain...and purchase in the duty free shop...you are not cheched again unless you are transiting somewhere else enroute and then only if you have to come outside the secure area. if you have to then provided the booze is sealed and you have a receipt for its purchase same day in a duty free shop ( do'nt ask me about crossing the date line ) then you can take it in with you as hand baggage..:D ...and of course in the case of booze the 100ml does'nt apply....

others will correct me if i am wrong but that is my recollection of what was introduced here...presumably to protect sales from duty free shops....

you see...there are rules...and there are sales....:ugh:

the dean.

[Danny]

It's all a big conspiracy by the major players in the airport owners cartel. They have the lobbying power to influence the "experts" :rolleyes: in the DfT and similar departments to introduce these rules as it increases the sales of duty free in their clients shops. Increased sales means they can charge higher rents.

Anyone who doubts this should should try a bit of investigation. Sniff near enough to the truth and watch how quickly there is a clamp down. Usually it is the "need to know" security excuse.

You heard about it here first. :oh:

[tezzer]

What Pixxed me off was last week flying back from Ankara (non EU). Arrived in transit at Munich, with my litre of Jack Daniels, and we were bussed to the terminal. To get to transit, we had to pass through security screening on the way IN from the plane. All liquids, including the duty free I bought 90 minutes earlier was confiscated, as "liquids in hand luggage". It was still sealed in the stapled and taped up, with the receipt !

Mine was the first bottle confiscated, but surely not the last from that flight.

[ACMS]

al_jamieson: In HKIA after you arrive in transit you will be required to proceed through security before you get into the departure area. So I would guess they wont let you keep the booze.

[ACMS]

A question for those crews that already have the rules in place:
Are you allowed to take toothpaste in your carry on bag in it's original Colgate tube?
What about deodorant "sticks" it's not a liquid or a gel. It's more like white soap. So will they take that off me too?
thanks

[BusBoy]

Ex UK no toothpaste, no smellies (unless in sealed 100ml container)
even had Gel type deo confiscated in see through dispenser as it is not a liquid (eh??)

however came back from holiday in Europe, bottle of water unwittingly left in hand luggage, no problem.

Why the hell anyone would choose to route through countries which have these measures in place is beyond me.

Level playing field?

[LH2]

Just a thought, and I'm sure I'm not the first to have such an occurrence, but couldn't the legality of these "security measures" as they call them, be challenged in court?

What would happen if it could be proved that the inefficacy of said rules, coupled to their high profile and cost, amounts to misleading the public as to the level of security which is effectively being provided. Doesn't it essentially amount to negligence and fraud? The "need to know" trick which Danny mentions should only get them so far given enough judicial pressure.

Anyone know if such challenges have been made before a court yet? If not, perhaps it would be possible to explore this option and if viable, a legal fund could be created to which interested parties (i.e., us) can contribute. Much better than sitting here whingeing and doing nothing methinks.

/lh2

[llondel]

I'll second Danny's comment about the financial side - I can't take through my litre bottle of water, I can't take through an empty litre bottle and fill it from a water fountain airside, but I can buy an overpriced bottle of water from a shop once I'm in the lounge and take it on the flight. Just wait until they stop us taking chocolate bars and other snacks (really useful if flying LoCo) and expect us to buy them at inflated prices once past security.

Anyone know if you can still buy razor blades in Gatwick Duty-Free (or what happens if you actually try to buy them)? I haven't been through there for a while.

[Rockhound]

Hey Tezzer,
Weren't you offered the opportunity to chug-a-lug your Jack Daniel's there and then or did they insist on relieving you of your bottle in toto? The security staff must have some rip-roaring parties after hours.
Last Sunday at SXM (St-Maarten), before passing through security on our way to YOW (Ottawa), security spotted a can of Orangina, which I'd forgotten I had in my carry-on bag, but the guard generously said I could polish it off, or at least drink all but 100 ml, on the spot.
Everyone had to remove their footwear (even flip-flops, which some daft booggers were still wearing). At least this idiotic "security" measure wasn't enforced at YOW on the way down. Surprising, considering that the Canadian authorities fall over themselves to ape whatever measures other countries institute in the name of "security".
BTW has anyone heard anything more on these solution chemists/bombers/terrorists that the British police apprehended in the nick of time last year?
Rockhound:rolleyes:

[MaxRange120]

Rockhound
Those of us who were around the UK last summer will well remember the chaos which ensued, and these effects which still continue in force today, following the discovery of an alleged plot to bomb aircraft by use of liquids.
The alleged plot prompted a massive security clampdown of pax and crew !!!!
However is all as it seems
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/6175427.stm
Here is an independent assesment of whether it could be done or not ...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/08/17/flying_toilet_terror_labs/
Hope that helps.......................
BUT on the other hand do you recall this washington post article?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/twa800/bomb.htm
So who really knows?
Safe flying to all.
MR120:ok:

[Rockhound]

MR120,
Thanks for posting those links. The article from The Register makes for hilarious, though ultimately sobering, reading. Sobering because the author rightly points out that the danger of explosive devices in hold baggage being detonated by cellphones in the cabin far exceeds the threat posed by the antics of "Chemical Alis" in the lavatory.
Rockhound:ok:

[tezzer]

No, the whole bottle, still sealed, which was the first. By the time my Oppo came through there was already one hell of a party there for the carrying !

[Haven't a clue]

According to the Dragonair website the clear plastic bag and the 100ml limit per item also applies in Japan, Korea and Taiwan effective today

http://www.dragonair.com/icms/servlet/template?series=131&article=3045&lang=eng

[OldBillXV]

ACMS.... I stand to be corrected here, and I'm sure you'll find out on the 21st March, or shortly thereafter, but your toothpaste, deo stick will be permitted, but they must be placed in a clear, resealable (ziplock) 1 L (size) bag. You'll only be alowed the 1 bag so all your stuff must fit in the same bag. The liquids will have to be in bottles no bigger than 100ml and placed in the same bag. I guess the average traveller will have 1 tube of toothpaste, 1 deo stick (or 1 100ml size aerosol deo can) plus aftershave in a bottle no bigger than 100ml all in the same 1L size ziplock. This apparently has to be carried through screening seperate to your carryon and can be placed inside your carryon after screening. Exceptions for medicine (with accomplanying medical certificates / Dr. Notes) will be allowed and treated seperately, as will baby milk / formula.

As regards the duty free, anything you buy airside SHOULD be placed in a clear plastic bag and sealed with the receipt showing. When going through security screening (as in a transit Pax) they will inspect that the duty free bag, with the unopened duty free still sealed inside with the receipt. If it's all good, then no problem, if the seal's been broken (too thirsty:eek: ) then say goodbye to it as it will be taken off you. I know from 1st hand experience in the US that they are using tamper proof DF bags to seal your booze and liquids in, everything else is in an open bag. If you buy your duty free in DXB (say) and it's not put in a sealed bag with the receipt.... it's going to come to tears:{ , even if the bottle is not opened (I guess...... this hasn't been confirmed as far as I know...) so I suggest if you're going to be buying DF, check with the shops first that they do have sealled bags before you buy.

Happy Days........

XV

[HKPAX]

I had my 150ml toothpaste taken off me boarding UA in Singapore a few days ago. 100 ml would have been ok I was told. I was deeply grateful for this prompt and decisive action to save us all from disaster at 30,000 feet. Could I have squeezed out 33% of the contents?

[Rockhound]

HKPax,
I guess they nailed you at SIN because you were boarding a US flight. I believe the authorities at Changi have enough common sense to impose these absurd restrictions only on passengers flying to the US or UK. The shoes-off regulation at SXM is no doubt due to the fact that US airlines dominate the heavy-jet traffic in and out of SXM.
Rockhound

[Middle Seat]

I could kick myself for not buying stock in the parent company of ziplock(R). :}

[OldBillXV]

I couldn't agree more with the ziploc shares!!!! I went through SFO last week..... they were insisting shoes off and belts off too! This was a quiet time for screening... but I had 1 carry on... 1 laptop removed from carryon for separate screening, separate tray for mobile phone, coins etc.... separate tray for shoes.... then a separate try for my trouser belt! It took a couple of minutes to offload all this for screening.... and then a few more at the other end to get dressed again.... with 5 separate trays to account for....... almost left my watch behind in the panic! :eek: Thankfully there were only 2 people behind me..... god only know's what is going to happen on a busy holiday weekend...... lots of claims for mislaid items and oportunist thefts to occur.........:ugh:

The easyest solution is to pack all your toiletries in your hold baggage and stink out the flight instead! Mind you..... if you're in the US, the chance of your hold baggage arriving at the correct destination with you at the same time is remote....:mad:

XV

[gavin360]

i go to the U S 5 or 6 times a year it is a pain taking shoes ,belt,hat,watch,ect ect but if it makes travelling 1% more safe its has to be worth doing .
if i keep any metal on me at all i send the screening machine mad so i remove all into the tray. last year in newark i left my wedding ring in the corner of a tray i went back 30 seconds later it was gone it vanished into some security guards pocket assho1e

[Haven't a clue]

OK - question for you all.

The cabin baggage rules from UK require you to have one bag x by y by z in size and chapesses have to put their hand bag into it to pass through the BAA security shambles. But are you allowed to carry that (stereotypically British) accessory - the umbrella - in addition to your suitably sized bag as well? You can wear/carry a coat, so perhaps such an item might be on the approved list??

I ask because I am charged by Mrs Hac to bring back a Chinese parasol from my next HK trip and I have little enthusiasm for my carefully selected purchase to be consigned to the pile of confiscated (and no doubt expensive) items as I pass through HK and subsequently UK security on my way home....

[pontius's pa]

HAC

I have just looked at the CX cabin baggage guide, issued pre clear plastic bag era, and you are allowed an umbrella.

However, a Chinese umbrella has those nice bamboo spokes, poking of eye out for the use of, and more rigid than the normal metal spokes. I do not know in the current climate whether you could hand carry such a potential weapon or not.

I suppose you could pack it in a fishing rod case and mark it fragile, ha ha.

Incidentally, you may also carry crutches on board, which I suppose you might need if Mrs HAC does not get her umbrella.

Good luck

[Haven't a clue]

Thanks P pa for that.

I've just been through IoM security and took the opportunity to ask one of the staff about an umbrella. He said it depended on the airline, and it would be OK with BA. Now that suggests thay it isn't a security issue....despite the spikes and things. Ho hum.