CTC holdpool (ATPers)

[Toastal]

Could all 18 of you in the pool tell me if there's any news re the likelyhood of starting a TR in the near future. I don't have my AQC till Dec this year and don't know who, if any, of the major airlines will be recruiting come Jan 2007 (if i'm sucessful of course).

Oh and by the way, I asked CTC for their pre-study pack, but it appears to have been done away with! Does this make the AQC easier or harder?

Answers on a postcard pleeease!!!

T:suspect:

[Sky Wave]

No news here :sad:

It's just a waiting game, one day the phone call will come. :ok:

Remember that the winter is a busy time for airlines as they like to train new pilots and get them on line for the summer program. AFAIK August and September are always quiet months for training.

If I was you I wouldn't be worried about who is going to be recruiting in January, if you get through the AQC at least you’ll know that a TR is not that far away.

I never received any pre course study material. Once I found out which aircraft I was on I learnt as much as I could about operating that type (CBT's, FS Add Ons, ITVV videos). CTC will probably be able to tell you which aircraft you are on 2 to 3 weeks before your course.

SW

[Craggenmore]

easyJet are advertising in the back of Flight International this week for Training Captains for their Airbus and Boeing fleets, presumably to start the backlog of type-rated, but not yet line-trained, FO's :}

Perhaps this will help to empty the hool pool somewhat.

Cheers

[Fair_Weather_Flyer]

The big question is whether Easy can get the line trainers though. Just because they are after guys does not mean that they'll find them. I'd say that's what is going to determine the length of holding time. Meanwhile CTC, continue to recruit guys for the pool and cadets are steadily coming through. I'm sure that everyone in the pool will get in, but it sounds like it could be a while.

[Saffer]

Perhaps someone from CTC can answer this question for me, or at least someone who’s reliably informed.

Are CTC actually still currently providing cadets and ATP’s to their other “partner airlines”?

Are they in a situation now whereby they are running monthly AQC’s as a means of generation turnover without there necessarily been a demand?

Any CTC guys who have now ended up working in ops, having given up their previous well paid jobs, are going to be suffering from a severe loss of earnings, based on the assumption that they are still going to only be paid their £1000.00 per month for six months only once their line training starts.

As opposed to a situation whereby they could have been called forward for a TR once EZY could logistically provide a smooth transition into line training, six months later moving onto full FO’s pay…

Bit of a worrying situation for us that are about to start the AQC and something I would just like to settle in my mind, or at least be able to gauge my expectations going forward?

Any positive feedback would be much appreciated!

[BigGrecian]

Here's a radical thought:
Why don't you call them?
They're normally very helpfull, and if your in the hold pool I don't see what the problem would be in getting most of your questions asked.

[Toastal]

Come on now folks, I think that's a fair point Saffer. Had I parted with £6700 up front for an AQC in the near future, i'd be asking the exact same questions. Surely the fact that Thomas Cook, First Choice and Thomsonfly are running their own recruitment at the mo, should send alarm bells ringing to an extent. I know for a fact that as of this week, the holdpool is sitting in the mid-twenties, and with an AQC every 3 weeks, it won't be long before it reaches the magic 40 (the amount CTC always wanted to have, but never could, due to demand from the airlines).

I too will be paying particular attention over the next couple of months before the house gets re-mortgaged. And for those out there that think this thread is an excuse to have a pop at CTC, you couldn't be further from the truth. Having been in 3 other airlines holding pools, I found them to be the most professional and friendly of the lot. What I am questioning however, is wether they even know themselves who is going to be recruting and when. As i've always been told, a week is a loooong time in aviation, but what do I know is, the AQC still awaits me!!!!!

T:suspect:

[BitMoreRightRudder]

Don't worry guys ezy are begging CTC for pilots, this summer has been somewhat problematic with hundreds of cancelled flights due to a chronic crew shortage and lots of subchartering has taken place to try to limit the damage to the schedule. A lack of trainers isn't helping and the continual introduction of the 319 across the network is a further stretch on resources as crews head off to do conversion courses.

Training is still going on at full pace according to the training captains at my base, there were a couple of guys heading off to do some line training in the crew room this morning! If you are short on cash, HSBC are usually happy to throw a 5 grand loan at you if you tell them "CTC sent you". Not ideal I know just a suggestion if you haven't already thought about it.

Good luck with it all.

[Lee Frost]

I am down for a forthcoming AQC and have been thinking about this hold pool getting larger, and about the likely lag time before entering TR. And also with who? There has been a lot of easyjet mentioned, but what of Monarch, Thomsonfly, TC, and First Choice?

Think I shall have to budget for renewing my IR as well. Encouraging to hear from a previous poster that Airlines like to do their training in the winter.

Will follow with interest.

LF

[DragStrut]

will also be following this thread with great interest, hope to hear some positive news very soon now, sat with my fingers legs arms and everything else crossed ...:O :O :O :O

[Big_Mach]

I've just started my type-rating with easyJet three months after finishing the AQC. Some guys started about a month after finishing but the majority have had to wait until now. As I understand it, this is due to the lack of training captains available for line training which, as mentioned above, is problematic to this summer.

I haven't heard of CTC people working in the Ops Dept. I think this is because we are 'employed' by CTC for 6 months after the type rating (not at the start of line training), so from easy's point of view we cost them nothing. However, this leads to us being bottom of the queue when it comes to line training as TRSS and DE pilots get paid from day one. In theory, we could sit around for 5 months and then be line trained before we cost easyJet anything, which explains why it can currently take several months to complete.

With one new aircraft a week, easyJet are crying out for pilots. On the easy induction day, we saw a welcome schedule which showed several pilot intakes a month. Not all of these are CTC, and Wings Cadets would take priority, but figures of 400 pilots a year are being bandied around, so everyone in the holding pool will eventually make it.

As for CTC and its relationship with partner airlines, I haven't heard of AQCers going anywhere other than easyJet (recently). I was offered a place on a jet2 course, but this was rather irregular, and was eventually filled internally by jet2.

Do the AQC as soon as you can. You at least know then whether you make the grade, and you are in the system. Just plan to be waiting for a good couple of months; plan on getting a job which you can leave with minimal notice; plan on having to renew your IR and medical....plan on being patient!

[FliegerTiger]

It's certainly true that the Ezy Training Captains are being utilised to the max at the moment. I'm guessing that they are trying to put through more experienced pilots (TRSS & D/E) as they need less line training sectors (about 1/4 of the sectors that CTC Cadets need), therefore upping the pilot quota quicker & more efficiently.

[Lee Frost]

For Wings ATP people, I have heard two different things....from one friend that most of us will end up at easyjet, and from another, that its quite likely we will be placed with Jet2, Monarch, First Choice, Thomson, or TC!

I have also heard that CTC expect their hold pool to be back near empty by around January since the winter is when a lot of the charter companies do their training.

Does anyone have any idea if there is a policy on it? Or is it more a case of the first airline coming along needing x amount of people, and they come from both Cadet and ATP sources?

Thanks

LF

[pipertommy]

Hi all,Just a quick one what is financial set up whilst your are under(tr) training,i read CTC will provide an income of sort`s?Got a house,wife and baby to support.

[FliegerTiger]

pipertommy,

The deal is (at least for those going to EZY) that during the type rating you will receive £500 (to last nearly 2 months(!)), then for 6 months thereafter £1000 per month, after that the decision is made whether to give you a permanent contract or not. Recently EZY cadets have been given night stop allowances and holiday (neither of which they had before).

Cheers,

FT

[pipertommy]

Not to bad,Last one if you don`t mind,how long is the TR?Couple of months?

[Gillespie]

The TR is 6 weeks, 3 weeks technical ground school with 3 progress tests and a final written paper, then 3 weeks flying in the sim. That's for the airbus rating anyway, I'm sure the Boeing conversion courses are similar. This does not include base training. There's normaly always a wait between finishing the conversion course and the base training.

[FliegerTiger]

Probably worth mentioning that the Boeing type rating is a tad longer than the airbus, mainly due to the 300/700 differences course.

[Gillespie]

This is true, however if you end up at Easy I'm led to believe that from september you'll only be typed on the 700. If you're on the boeing fleet of course.

[pipertommy]

Thanks!So you will be on £500/month from TR training until you start the base training.So looking about 3 months-ish:ouch:

[Lee Frost]

Are they still training CTC people on the Boeing? I thought all new joins would be going to the Airbus A319?

LF

[FliegerTiger]

pipertommy,

Not quite - the £500 is a one-off payment to cover the WHOLE type rating - the first £1000 will come 2 months after the start of the type whether you've started line training by then or not (at least that's how it worked with me).

[goodwxpilot]

Anyone got any up-to-date numbers of people in the hold pool?? Is it moving at all?

In general have easyjet more or less stopped training until they sort out their training capacity?

Cheers

[DickPilot]

I think it is approximately 30.

I don't know how quickly it's emptying but at the start of our AQC they said that they had been in consultation with the airlines and that it looked like a good time to be in the pool.

I think what he meant was that it was forecast to empty quickly!

[FlightDeckDave]

Just a quick question, what does everyone do with their time after finishing the AQC course and then going in to the hold pool awaiting selection from an airline? Are pilots doing their Type Rating or extra study? Maybe I'm being naive and there isn't enough time to do everything as it is and it all flows from one to the next.

Cheers,

FDD

[Sky Wave]

Sitting around, twiddling my thumbs and spending toooooo much time on Pprune!

There is nothing to do really between AQC and getting hauled out of the hold pool. If I knew which aircraft I’m going to be type rated on I'd start studying the type, however I don't and I think I'd confuse myself if I tried learning about the 737, 757 and A320 :ugh:

I do take a PA28 or a C172 out for a spin every few weeks but apart from that I do nothing else aviation related.

It's very difficult to get work because you have no idea of when the call will come. I'm a contract railway engineer and I have picked up little bits of work to keep the money coming in, however most of the work available is either a long term contract or it's for work starting a month or two down the road, neither of which I can accept.

That said, work is picking up for me now which probably means I'll get a call from CTC asking me to start. :bored:

I would recommend trying to get yourself some work which you can quickly drop as you have no idea how long you'll be in the hold pool for. For me it will be 3 months by 11th Sept and no sign of being hauled out yet.

Of course, things can change very quickly and it could go back to the way it was in April of this year. I've been told that the guys who passed the April AQC finished on the Friday, had a phone call on the Saturday, went to Luton on the Monday to sign Easyjet contracts and started the type rating on the Wednesday.


SW

[Mooneyboy]

To anyone who has done the AQC.

Is there any preperation that you could advise to do prior to the AQC? Is it nearly always carried out on the 737 and if it is which series? Got mine in a couple of months looking forward to progressing with the flying career again after a long period of limbo.

All the best,

Mooneyboy:ok:

[the aviator1977]

Hi everyone,

I've got stage 3 ctc coming up in a couple of weeks and wondered if anyone could give me any info on the interview and group exercises please? Are there any technical quesions or is it more to do with competency based questions? Also, do you know of anyone failing the AQC? What would you all say the % of people who pass AQC is? If you fail the AQC have you just lost £6500 or can you get any money back? Is it true that CTC pay you £2000 back after the 8 month contract? I will also be asking CTC these questions this week but also wanted to get other peoples opinions on this. If I pass stage 3 then I'll have a tough decision to make whether I should try and get the £6500 and risk failing the AQC or whether it isn't too much of a risk and just go for it!! Also, having been to stage 2 last week the chief pilot said that you could expect to be in the holding pool no more than 3-5 weeks at the moment.

rgds

the aviator1977

[Sky Wave]

Guys

There is an AQC thread which covers all of your questions. This thread is really to discuss the hold pool situation.

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=94832

Perhaps the mods can move your posts.

But to answer your questions anyway

Mooneyboy

It seems they just split the group, some do it on the Airbus and others on the 737NG, there’s no telling which one you'll be on.

aviator1977

People do fail. It seems that 90% of people pass. I believe you get £2000 if you pass the AQC, pass the type rating and complete the line training. Why would they give you money back if you fail?

I guess the question of whether you risk the £6.5k depends how much you want to be an airline pilot. If you have plenty of job offers coming in then don't risk it.

The best advice I can give in way of preparation for the AQC is to make certain that your Instrument Flying Skills are 100% up to speed. If you have any doubts get some sim time on an FNPT2 (you don't need to practice in an expensive jet sim).

Anyway, take a look at the other thread.

SW

[DickPilot]

Aviator

3-5 weeks....! I think many people at CTC have very different ideas of how long we are likely to be in the holding pool. There are people who have been in there for nearly 4 months.

If 3-5 weeks was real then I would be flying now!

Don't get me wrong, I'm not ungrateful, I just wish we had a realistic estimate. If they said it would be at least 4 months, then I'd be very happy, but at the moment its hard to plan work commitments (bills still have to be paid).

[Mintflavour]

I sent my application last week so I read this with interest.

In summary of how I understand it from what I have read above, in terms of financials and time line Assuming you are successful getting in.

Selected to attend the MCC/AQC
What is the current length of time from selection to AQC course?
Pay £6500ish prior to Attending the AQC
Three consecutive weeks doing the MCC/AQC
Complete AQC and selected to enter the holding pool, Someone mentioned a lump sum of £2k from CTC at this point? is this true.
Wait in holding pool for the majic phone call.
Phone call recieved and start TR. £500 from CTC to last you over the next six weeks during the TR course.
Completion of of the TR and £1000/month payments from CTC start for six months. Then provided there are no problems (like EZY have suffered from this year) straight into line training.
Do you get flight pay during line training or does this vary between airlines?

How are people financing themselves through the transition from AQC to end of line training

Many thanks for any answers/clarifications

mint

[Sky Wave]

I understand 3 more are starting with EZY next Monday. That's everyone from the AQC that finished on 19th May. I guess that means that there are around 27 in the pool at the moment with another AQC finishing this Friday. So 3 to 4 months seems to be about right at the moment, however demand from the airlines is likely to increase during the winter.

SW

[ChocksAwayUK]

Sounds like you've received 'the call' at last Skywave? Congratulations.

Out of interest, which types and bases are being assigned at the moment?

Also did you get any idea of what order your course was called up in...date of application? Alphabetical? Handicap on the putting green?

[Sky Wave]

Fraid not chocks,

My course finished on 17th June :bored:

Won't be long now, 2 of my course have been called up. None of us have any idea of how the order works, however the putting green is a possibility!

I'll let you know when I know.

SW

[Craggenmore]

Out of interest, which types and bases are being assigned at the moment?

At present you will be able to choose which base you want. Liverpool is a touch harder; you will have to go on the transfer list.

What type is up to Easy. Personally, I would keep your fingers crossed for the Airbus...

[ChocksAwayUK]

Thanks guys and hang on in there Skywave. Can't be too long.

[FliegerTiger]

Craggenmore,

As far as EZY goes, not sure if they'll allow a choice of base (at least that wasn't the story when I went through in February!) - they usually let you know where your base will be at the start of the type rating (on induction day). If 737, the likelihood is either LTN or BFS, A319 LGW or STN initially. Get those transfer requests in early!

Cheers

FT

[Craggenmore]

FliegerTiger,

We all got our choices back in June :}

cheers, Craggs

[FliegerTiger]

Jammy beggars!

[DickPilot]

So...have any of the recent AQC graduates heard any more news about how long we are all expected to be in the pool (assuming that an AQC has just finished)?

Surely they can't still be saying 3-5 weeks?!

[DragStrut]

Hi All,

Just an update, aparently there are 32 people in the hold pool as we speak.

they have just placed three people with easy jet on the 737 and are in talks with their other partner airlines.

hopefully we will be in soon but im preparing for another couple of months swimming ..

Dragstrut:} :} :}

[DickPilot]

Good info

Was this info from CTC or from people who have recently been through the AQC?

I think CTC were expecting a 'bulk order' for pilots from easyjet this autumn/winter and this is why the pool has been allowed to get so full. With only 3 posted it doesn't look like its happening yet!

Does anyone know how many pilots were in the pool this time last year and how long they had to wait?

[ChocksAwayUK]

That info is straight from CTC yesterday afternoon.

I'm sure CTC do prepare for bulk orders in the Autumn/winter though the demand certainly hasn't come yet. I think they ideally like to have around 60 in the holdpool at any one time.

Can't answer the last question, sorry! Though I expect it was probably larger than it is now.

[Lee Frost]

Wow, at selection we were told the hold pool is virtually empty - it seems to have filled up really fast without too much movement. From friends working with easy crews they say the training backlog is still pretty dire...which makes sense, but just makes us feel quite unsettled...however I have also heard that CTC expect a lot of people to be taken on over the winter, and that they will be struggling to have enough in the pool come January?!?!

With ATP guys, will we be through to the other partner airlines, or is it all to be easyjet? I haven't heard of ATP people going anywhere other than easyjet. What about First Choice, Monarch, Jet 2 etc? Do they just take cadets?

Not a problem if it is a 3-4 month wait, but it would be nice to know just a little bit more about what to expect, which airlines etc.

Good thread, lets try and keep it running with any useful information :)

LF

[Gillespie]

Last September Monarch airlines placed an order for 36 pilots in one hit through CTC. CTC had trouble to meet that target.

Not saying that's going to happen again, who knows? Just shows how things can change very dramatically in this business.

[Spitfiire]

They have at the moment started to take people from the pool that was in the AQC in June.

[DragStrut]

hi was this the 26th june course ?/??
:} :} :}

[Sky Wave]

If so, they missed me:{

It's the course that ended 16th June I'm afraid.

SW

[DragStrut]

hi all

just quick one to check if anyone knows of any movement in the pool in the last two/three weeks?? two months swimming and counting my legs are getting tired .. ha ha :) :)

[Sky Wave]

3 months, very tired legs and no further news yet

[ChocksAwayUK]

Oh gawd....

But could you just clarify dodge. Are you referring to those who have been type-rated under CTC Wings (ATP&Cadet) or those recruited direct by easyJet (TRSS and Direct Entry), or just everyone?

[Superfly]

3 months, very tired legs and no further news yet

3 months is still OK. I had to wait, myself, 6 months. I ended up flying the 757 for Thomsonfly. Best ever place to be :ok: !

Be patient, It will eventually come. CTC know what they're doing. And even if tey don't they still do the job in a superb fashion !

SF

[DickPilot]

I think the only thing we can do is monitor!:confused:
A request - If people receive that magic phone call, would they be good enough to post here stating:

when they heard
how long they have been in the pool
how many other people have been pulled out of the pool (if they know)
the projected start date
with which airline
which aircraft type

At least if we can see movement and direction, it does make that light at the end of the tunnel that little bit brighter!

[ChocksAwayUK]

Good plan DickPilot, will do. And for info pool currently looks like this (presumably with anything up to 10 more joining imminently):

29 May AQC 6
26 June AQC 10
24 July AQC 9
21 Aug AQC 7

[Big_Mach]

Not wishing to jinx things but it seems as if, for the last couple of months at least, CTC type rating courses start at the beginning or end of the month. So hopefully another swathe of you will be plucked from the murky depths of the hold pool very soon!

As for delays between type rating and line training, easyJet seem to be ironing out their problems. The guys on the Airbus side of our AQC (April) had refresher training and were due to start line training at the beginning of this week. We're just about to finish our type rating (B737 300/700) and, after a couple of weeks of 'admin', are moving straight into line training - no delays!

I'm sure things will pick up during the usual training period over winter. Best of luck to you all.

[DickPilot]

Good info folks, it's nice to have a positive slant to the thread.

[Lee Frost]

I welcome DickPilot's suggestion for future contributions from those leaving the pool. Just wondering what the system is for leaving the pool - do CTC lift you in order of how long you have been swimming? Or is there any preference given to people who have eg done particularly well...?

No golf putting greens jokes please - I'm trying to ask a serious question! :)

Thanks,


LF

[dankersoe]

Lee Frost:

I've heard that people will leave the pool in the order they came in.
No preference even if you are flying like Chuck Yaeger.


Very good info guys, let's keep it up.

Just went to the Easyjet Roadshow in Copenhagen yesterday - they need 450 pilots in 2007.
Does anyone have info about First Choice, Thomson, Monarch, JET2 etc??

Anyway...
I am on the June AQC swimming team and I will let you know when I leave the pool. ;)


Rgds
Daniel

[dankersoe]

The current breakdown:

May AQC 6
Jun AQC 10
July AQC 9
Aug AQC 7
Sep AQC 7

[Craggenmore]

Stick with it guys. You are probably in the best position out of any low hour job seeker right now.

Sky Wave, surely not too long to go now. Easy want 450 next year :}

With regards from Switzerland :ok:

Craggs

[DickPilot]

Good stuff... thanks.

The months you quote, are they the months the AQC started or finished in e.g. is the May one the AQC that ended in May or started in May?

[ChocksAwayUK]

That's based on the start date.

29 May AQC 6
26 June AQC 10
24 July AQC 9
21 Aug AQC 7
?? Sep AQC 7

[geturwingover]

Little update..

Current CTC cadets on easyJet TR are not as yet guaranteed a placement with the airline, and the next course won't start Type Rating until December. Not sure how this leaves the ATP guys, but the next 5 or 6 cadet courses have been promised easyJet, so you may be looking at other airlines, at least for the next few months.

Some of the cadets are looking at/being offered other interviews, CV's are being typed....

[Flying_bear]

This pool needs stirring, starting to get a little stagnant, calm before the storm I hope.

FB

[config1]

These delays at easy are confimred. The next lot of ctc wings cadets due to start type rating have to wait until at least December. This could be longer if past promises are anything to go by! This leaves them over 5 months behind schedule and it seems that both easy and ctc have left them with no source of income in the mean time! From what I know, most have had to find jobs to get by whilst on this ''sponsored'' scheme!!

[config1]

A rest period yes, you are exactly right there C, it's just a shame that this rest period will cost the cadets in question a hell of a lot of money, not only on general living expenses but also on the interest for the money they owe for the ''bond''..

[config1]

In addition to my last post, my understanding of the scheme is that no contract has ever been signed by the cadet and the airline? Therefor this means that the airline can pull out at any time during the training process? Have I been misinformed?

[geturwingover]

Yes and that has actually happened in the past, when easy have "reviewed their growth expectations". Luckily the cadets involved found jobs off thier own back.

I made the orginal post about cadet delays to give the ATP guys an idea of what is happening in the CTC world, didnt mean to take over the thread with cadet talk, sorry guys! Perhaps talks of financial implications of dealys etc would be best in the CTC Wings thread where all the potential applicants can catch wind of current reality???

stir stir stir... ;-)

[config1]

Good idea geturwingover. Sorry for the congestion guys.

[Sky Wave]

All very disturbing.

Hopefully some of the other airlines will start dipping into the holdpool

SW

[ChocksAwayUK]

All very disturbing.
Hopefully some of the other airlines will start dipping into the holdpool
SW
Isn't it just? At least this post (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?p=2891949#post2891949) suggests some future movement, though perhaps not for a while.
My fingers are pruning and legs are tired from treading water for so long.

[Craggenmore]

10 days 'ish

[Saffer]

When did you finish?

We were told within two working days after you have finished!

[Sky Wave]

It was 6 days for the course that finished in June 06

[bigjarv]

Can anyone tell me what the format of the AQC course is as in what happens when, what it covers, what their focus is on and the main things you remember about the course (eg the tough and easy bits!). All would be great info for those of us about to go into the AQC and hopefully join you in the pool!!!! Swimmers at the ready!!!

Bigjarv

[ChocksAwayUK]

Hi Bigjarv - best advice: Just go there, study and focus hard, familiarise yourself with all checklists, standard calls, flight profiles as well as you possible can. This will clear up a lot of capacity so you can get on with the rest of the flying. All the information you need will be given to you once you get there and you will have enough time to familiarise yourself with it while you are there.

The whole course is conducted during weekdays, you will have weekends off. The first 2 weeks are an MCC. Week 1 is classroom stuff about all sorts of multi-crew issues many of which will be familiar to you if you've done an MCC and from Human Perf. & Limitations. Lots of group exercises, discussions, videos involving MCC issues (airline accident stuff etc). Mainly enjoyable and relaxed. Try to get involved and answer questions, instructors will certainly try to involve you. Nothing to worry about here.

Week 2: MCC Sim. 5x4 hour sessions with your sim-buddy. 2 as PF, 2 as PNF. Starts off as a basic introduction to the sim and general handling. Over the course of the week various things are added, engine failures etc until you'll be left more-or-less on your own on day 5 to operate a flight in which various situations will be thrown at you. The important thing is that you follow the procedures you have been taught while adhereing to the MCC principles you've been learning in Week 1. Most of the time this week you'll be using the autopilot so you have the spare capacity to get used to these multicrew principles and procedures. Which leads to...

Week 3: Advanced handling. This is essentially the same as week 2. Except Day 1, back in the classroom for a bit more MCC stuff, consolidation and prep for what is to come. Then 4x4 hour sessions - very much as before but... no autopilot! So this will force you to be more adept at using the MCC and multicrew procedural skills that you've learnt. The last session is billed as a 'Final Assessment'! - but we were assured throughout the course that this was in no way a 'chop check' and it really is your performance over the length of the course that they'll look at. However, I think that if your instructor (in this case one that you have not had previously on the course) did notice any significant problems they would be taking a very careful look at the rest of your file.

I think most people on my course found it hard at times, i.e. the occasional flight where things weren't as smooth as they'd like resulting in a below average report. However, we all made it in the end. If you find yourself struggling with anything, just make sure you do something about it, study, speak to an instructor - they are there to help you, speak to other guys on your course. You should enjoy it - it's a very nice environment to learn in, with some very dedicated and enthusiastic instructors and the steep learning curve you are forced to go through makes it very satisfying.

[bigjarv]

Wow,
What a fantastic response. Thank you very very much ChocksAway. That is really the kind of response and info that makes these forums such a worthwhile resource. I really appreciate it and I'm sure others will to!
Thank you :ok:

[eagle21]

How did everyone log the sim time in their logbooks? Could please PM exactly what to write?

Thanks

[Spitfiire]

Mod,variant = I wrote "B737"
Registration = You need the reg number from the sim you where in...
And only log time under Synth. training.

Thats how i did, anyone that did it in another way? Then please speak up.

Regards, Spitfiire

[dankersoe]

Current breakdown:

Heard a rumour that 9 out of 12 got through the latest AQC:

29 May AQC 6
26 June AQC 10
24 July AQC 9
21 Aug AQC 7
?? Sep AQC 7
?? Okt AQC 9

Total: 48

Congratulations and welcome in the pool :ok:

[Saffer]

Dankersoe,

The waters nice and warm :sad:

Your rumour sources are indeed correct, 9 out of 12 ATP guys made it through. However the latest from the CTC towers is that there are 40 in the pool as we speak and not 48....

Therefore there is the possibility that guys have taken from the pool without our knowledge :eek:

Saf

[bigjarv]

Has anyone heard any more news on movement or potential movement in the pool?

[ChocksAwayUK]

Those in the pool received an email from CTC a couple of days ago.

Basically: Huge demand expected from EZ next year (500 pilots). easyJet anticipate 1/3 of those coming from CTC Wings (40-50 will be cadets, the rest ATPers, so 120ish!:eek: )

CTC want their pool to grow to 50 to accomodate demand. Also things have been slow recently due to the oft rumoured lack of training resources to cater for current demands. Expect the floodgates to open again in December/January, starting with a trickle.

Not much need from other airlines, perhaps due to change in retirement laws. Also, I think, due to most haveing their own big recruitment drives recently.

Looking ok, so hang on in there guys.

[bigjarv]

Thats fantastic news!!! Thanks for the update!!!

[Flying_bear]

heard some news that a group of guys have just gone to Jet2.com last friday

[DickPilot]

If you look at the 2 posts above (17th October) about the numbers in the holding pool, the list provided by dankersoe gives a total of 48, whereas saffer correctly indicates that there are 40 (and still is if you count the number of address in the email from CTC on Thursday last week).

So, are those 8 the ones that have gone to Jet2? If not then:

Is this news from one of the pilots concerned, CTC directly or just rumour?
How many were in the group?
Were they ATP's or Cadet's?

[ChocksAwayUK]

:cool: Well, as we're being detectives:
The 40 email addresses seemed to be listed in 'AQC course order', most recent first. There were only five addresses listed for 29th May's AQC but based on Dankersoe's list we'd expect 6. Incidentally all 10 on my course were listed.
I really wouldn't devote so much thought and effort to this kind of thing if my current job wasn't so very dull.

[Spitfiire]

The mails were mixed up, i can confirm that "the mail" were sent to all 6 persons from the may 29 AQC. And as far as i now, were all still waiting for the call.... Just hang in there, we are all getting that call, sooner or later. :)

/Spitfiire

[Sky Wave]

Agree with spitfire. Don't think any of us May 29th folk were hauled out. Interestingly the last 5 names are from May 29th AQC yet one of the May names is in the middle of the distribution list. No idea why.

SW

[Flying_bear]

it came from a guy at the selection in bournemouth, plus i also know that the wings guys have dates in dec and jan, so its coming, just have to hurry up and wait. then wait a little more. Free swimmers badges for all, Bronze, Silver and gold.

FB

[Thorer]

Well boys and girls! The call came on monday to several of us :ok:.
I think all of us (6) from the May AQC got the call. One is starting in December, and the rest in January and February.

Hang in there! The walls are coming down :D

[Saffer]

Well boys and girls! The call came on monday to several of us :ok:.
I think all of us (6) from the May AQC got the call. One is starting in December, and the rest in January and February.

Hang in there! The walls are coming down :D

Excellent news, am I right in assuming this is for EZY? :D :D :D

[ChocksAwayUK]

Excellent news, am I right in assuming this is for EZY? :D :D :D

Yes, one Boeing course and 2 Airbus courses as far as I know. Maybe more.

[Lee Frost]

I've heard Easy should be coming back to speed with trainers around March / April...does anyone have an idea of any requirements/courses from the charter partner airlines? Or Jet2?

:)

LF

[Thorer]

Yes, one Boeing course and 2 Airbus courses as far as I know. Maybe more.

People from the May AQC were placed on a Boeing course Dec 4th, Airbus Jan 29th and a Boeing on Feb 5th. But I think there are other easy courses around these dates as well.

[ChocksAwayUK]

People from the May AQC were placed on a Boeing course Dec 4th, Airbus Jan 29th and a Boeing on Feb 5th. But I think there are other easy courses around these dates as well.

Ah, well add to that an Airbus course on February 12th.

[DickPilot]

Good news all round I think. This latest post has re-generated the excitement I had when I finished the AQC!

So, does anyone know what the training capacity is i.e. how many pilots can easyjet train on airbus and boeing at any one time and how often are the courses?

[Thorer]

It looks like they have one Airbus and one Boeing course each month. At least from December to February.

[ChocksAwayUK]

It looks like they have one Airbus and one Boeing course each month. At least from December to February.

And to answer the rest of the question.. 6 per course. The February 12th course is all ATPers though I expect there is sometimes a mixture of ATPers, Cadets and easyJet direct entry guys.

[DickPilot]

So if all of the remaining 6 from May are spread across Dec 4th, Jan 29th and Feb 5th (from Thorer's post) and Chock's post states that the Feb 12th is all ATP's, does that mean some of the June pilots have also received the call?

[Sky Wave]

6 from May and 8 from June AQC's have been given courses. The guys from the June AQC are starting on the 5th Feb (737) and the 12th Feb (A319).

I think I recall that there were 10 in the June hold pool so 2 are still swimming.

SW

[Kerropi]

How many people are still swimming in the pool at the moment?
K.

[eagle21]

Should be around 26 left , if all the 12th of Feb are ATPs.

[razzele]

I just met a gent tonight, been in a pool for easy jet since oct 2005 with no progression.


He paid 68k quids to CTC and not a sausage in return after he finally qualified in 09/05.


I really could not believe this could happen, i always thought ctc were a good bunch.


yours sincerely,
Truely Shocked !

:ugh:

[Sky Wave]

razzele

The guy had to be making it up or not telling you the whole story. The fact is that if he paid CTC 68k he would have to be a cadet and cadets don't go into the hold pool.

Secondly, once ATP or Cadets complete their type rating they get 6 months of line training. I'm told it takes about 100 sectors to pass your line check which then enables you to fly with any captain (Not just a Training Captain).
Easyjet are short of pilots, are you expecting us to believe that a fully qualified pilot would not be used when they are cancelling flights all over the place?

It is of course possible that this person did not come up to the mark and couldn't pass the type rating or line check but I've never heard of anyone going into an easyjet holdpool once qualified.

SW

[DickPilot]

Good post Sky!

And this post has to be kept exclusively to ATP and not Cadets, as Cadets do not go into the ATP holding pool (as SkWave correctly states). This is purely to monitor movement out of the pool and to which airlines/aircraft etc.

Lets keep it useful and relevant!

[Gillespie]

Pool movement seems to have slowed down again after that recent stir...

Anyone heard any news?

[Craggenmore]

I just met a gent tonight
Clapham Common?

[DragStrut]

Gillespie

looks like your right the pool seems to have slowed down again.

We (the june AQC) guys got our ratings leaving two from our course still swimming but one of them was called at short notice to start A319 course next week due to a drop out.

That leaves only one left from our AQC so the pool is def moving but just slowly mate the wait is more than worth it ....

hope this helps mate

DragStrut :ok: :ok:

[ChocksAwayUK]

To the recently placed 14: Anyone else just receive a rejection email from EZ? :confused: :\

Jo asked us to fill out the EZ application form on their website. I presume this was for admin reasons and to get our details 'into the system' but I was most perturbed to get an 'after careful consideration' (i.e. 'you don't have any jet hours mate') email today. Should I be concerned? :eek: I hope this is to be expected, so has anyone else got this response or have I made a career threatening error on my application? (i.e. Why do want to work for ez? 'So i can get hours asap and work for Virgin'*) :)

*I did not actually write this, nor do I think it.

[Sky Wave]

Chocks

Suggest you speak to Jo. My application was accepted and I got an email with a whole host of attachments. Did you click to say you have more than 500 hours?

SW

[ChocksAwayUK]

Oh god.. thanks mate - will do. I did click the '500 hours jet' box so I don't know what's happened there.

(anyone else on one of the late-Jan/Feb TRs got a response yet?)

[DragStrut]

Hi jonny

what did the email attachments involve buddy ??

I got an email saying that my application had been accepted and they were considering it and would let me know in due course blah blah blah anything im missing out on mate ??

Ben :ok: :ok:

[ChocksAwayUK]

Hi Ben -

Yup.. got the 'application accepted' email very soon after I applied and the rejection email about 10 days later (today). I think you applied the day after me so maybe you'll hear something tomorrow (either with the attachments that Sky Wave mentions or my rejection email) so let me know how it goes.. PM or phone is cool. Glad to hear that Rick or Chris got a headstart. I'm sure it won't be long for the remaining one.

Cheers,

Jonny

[ChocksAwayUK]

Apparently another of my class recieved the same rejection email and it is an error on easy's part. CTC have given me the contact details of someone in easyJet recruitment and the email I've just sent should rectify the problem. Phew.

[Troy McClure]

Chocks,

As one waiting to start an AQC course, I was reading your posts with mounting horror. Good to hear it was an error. Your heart rate back down to normal yet? Prescribe a couple of stiff gins.

Best of luck with it all - hot on your heels.

Troy.

[GoldenMonkey]

ChocksAwayUK.
It seems you have sorted this already which is good. When we went through in February, I remember the same happened to one of our course mates. It was simply an admin error which was quickly rectified. Did raise his heartbeat slightly though.:eek: Oh, and provide a reasonable dose of amusement for the rest of our sadistic bunch!:} :}
All the best with the course.:ok:
GoldenMonkey

[Penworth]

I don't think its the case now, but in the past Easyjet did an assessment day for those put forward from the ATP holdpool by CTC. I know someone who actually failed this. It wasn't a problem though because they just went back in the pool until a place at another airline became available.

PW

[Gillespie]

Penworth: I think nowadays it's just a meet and greet session..You get an induction day at Luton the day before your TR, and that's it!

I believe Monarch still require interview

[ChocksAwayUK]

Well I think my drama should be sorted now. Having just spoke to a very helpful lady at easyJet I understand that the problem was that I had not accounted for my time on the AQC in my 5 year history - so apparently there was nothing to say that I wasn't a non-CTCer trying it on. Hmmm, not sure I fully understand that but it goes to show it pays to be thorough and do things properly - so if anyone else is yet to fill out the form look out for that one.


Seperately, and on the topic above. I believe guys from CTC used to be able to get straight in with Britannia/Thomsonfly without an internal selection but several serving Tfly pilots kicked up a fuss about these newbies getting in 'through the back door' so they had to introduce selection. Having got through CTC's selection and AQC I'm not sure I could handle another.. at least for a couple years.

[Penworth]

Chocksaway, regarding thomsonfly that's correct. They introduced a selection process for those coming from CTC just before I went to them, but in fairness it wasn't the full assessment, just an interview and aptitude tests (no sim ride or psychologist interview). They applied this retrospectively to those already doing their 6 month placement, so even those that had been proving themselves day in day out during line training still had to go back and pass an aptitude test to prove they could fly a plane! :rolleyes:

[FinaltoLand]

Hey guys,

just worried me a bit there Jonny! Still waiting for my reply from easy and as I clicked on the 500Hrs tab not sure if the same thing'll happen to me! My 5yr history is good so maybe I'll be alright we'll see?

Nice to see most of us got courses, anyone know who's left from the June AQC?

Be in touch guys, see you Feb

Mart

[scameron77]

Just an update for all those champing at the bit for a sniff of the ATP program.

I decided to write an email to Lee Woodward (head of the ATP program) as I am about to pick a MCC provider. I have aimed my training so far to apply for the ATP program and was dismayed to see that it was closed for new applications a month before I could apply, shiny blue CAA licence in my hand.

I was just looking for an idea of when they were looking to open it again so I could conisder holding off going through another provider.

I'm now in a position where I could hold off without a definite idea, then go through the whole process or bite the bullet and try to attain anything from 100-500 hours on a JAR25 aircraft if I go via another alternative (my ability and proficency dependent) I have open to me. Obviously people reading this will have an idea of what this other route is and understand that there is quite a difference in outlay costs between the two.

Which leads me to another thread I've just started which hopes to maybe suggest an alternative means of getting that first job http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=254914 (here)

I'm sure to most people on here this is not news, but the following is the current company line as of the 4th of December 2006.

Dear Stephen

Thanks for your email. We're glad to see you are interested in our Wings ATP Programme.

Unfortunately due to the nature of the airline business it is always difficult to predict what our clients needs will be. However, we do hope to see some movement early next year although we cannot be specific as to when this will be yet. Please just keep an eye on our website www.ctcaviation.com where we will reopen our site for new applications at the appropriate time.

Regards

Krissie Streatfeild
CTC Wings Selection Team

[DickPilot]

Hi scameron77

This forum is really only for those who have graduated from the AQC and are already in the pool. In order for you to get as much useful feedback as possible, I would suggest that your post may be more appropriate in the following forum:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=94832

Good luck with whichever path you choose!

[dyingforflying]

Maybe a strange question,

If somebody is in the pool for like saying a month. He is waiting for ctc to call, maybe till next year march. And in the meanwhile another company, for example ryanair, is inviting you for an interview, what would you do? I think I would wait, but that can take a few months or maybe half a year. And maybe you can get a job much sooner somewhere else. Or would you not risk ctc and just wait? Is there anybody who had this or know somebody who did this? And what would be wise?

[scameron77]

Apologies DickPilot,

In my haste to post I omitted to read the 'Holdpool' bit in the thread title and just honed in on the 'ATP' bit.

Stephen

[Mooneyboy]

Just jumped into what is probaly the best holdpools around. Probaly will be monitering this thread for quite a while. Hope the wait isn't too long. Can't complain better get treading water.

Holdpool is now mid 30's,

Mooneyboy:ok:

[Gillespie]

Mooneyboy,

Well done, and welcome to the pool. I assume you've just finished the AQC. Did they say when things were likely to start moving again? Any info from the 'inside'?

Cheers.

[Mooneyboy]

Hi Gillespie,

Just finished the AQC a few days ago. I heard that 14 went to Easyjet on mixture of boeing and airbus but apart from that nothing else. I think that happened a couple of weeks ago. The instructors seem to feel that things will start to really pick up over the next few months but no airlines were mentioned or numbers. Would be great if the charter airlines took a few ATP to help further reduce the hold pool. Sorry thats all the info I have.

All the best,

Mooneyboy

[Fair_Weather_Flyer]

In my crystal ball, I see a lot of the holdpool people going to the charter airlines on the 757. I think that this is where CTC are most likely to have training capacity and the start of the new year is a brisk time for recruitment. I'm sure the demand will be as strong as it was last year and that was VERY strong.

[CPLDAN]

Hey fellow AQC poolers!

Obviously excellent news for everyone on the recent pool movement! Just noticed your part of the thread jonnie about your mishap with the easyjet app, I also got the email like yours, however seems like there was just a mishap with the system also not recognising I was a CTC'er! Have also been informed app has been resurected pheeewww good news, Im sure all will be fine from now!!!

Hope everyone is doing well, at least its onwards and upwards from here.

Cheers guys, Dan

[Mooneyboy]

Fair Weather Flyer,

Hope your crystal ball ( hopefully this inside info) is accurate would be nice for everyone to start type ratings soon.

Mooneyboy

[FinaltoLand]

Could anyone tell me how long their application took to come back from easy, as mine seems to be taking an age and getting a bit worried now!! Is there a number I could call or is it back to CTC to ask them?

Cheers

Martin

[DragStrut]

Hi all Sorry to be bearer of bad news regards to the pool.

I had been in the pool for approx 5 months and was one of the 14 guys mentionned earlier in this thread given a type rating date with easy on 12th feb 2007.

Unfortunately yesterday we were informed that due to line training problems at easy our course has been cancelled and all 6 of us are now being put bak into the pool to await a later type rating date.

hope this keeps you all informed about the status and size of the pool.

Im gonna have to go get my trunks back on ready for another dip in the 'pool'

Hopefully the wait wont be too long we'll all get there in the end as were in the best pool to be in
cheers guys

dragstrut.:ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

[DickPilot]

They failed to mention that in the update that we received yesterday!

If easyjet are going to recruit 450 pilots this year ,with a sizable proportion coming from CTC, then easyjet are going to have to get their training sorted out!

Look on the bright side mate, TCX will be taking 6 ATP's for 6 months (according to the update from CTC) so I'm sure you won't have to wait much longer.

[SplashDown]

Slightly off topic with regards to CTC but rumor has it that a top head in training at easyJet has rolled regarding the lack of trainers. All the current ones are, as you probably guessed, non stop!

All well and good having 450 odd pilots but if there's no one to train them then oohhh s*it its another hard summer for us and a long wait for you guys and gals!!

Fingers crossed for you lot either in your type ratings at the mo or treading water in the pool.

Splashdown

[Lee Frost]

Does anyone have an idea when easyjet will get some momentum back?

I have heard that 8 people may/will :} be taken from the pool for Monarch sometime over winter.

Can someone turn on the pool heating please? :\ I'll get me coat,


LF

[Nice flaps]

Sounds like you guys are in need of some good news.

A number of trainers from another UK airline will soon be heading to the big Orange. Once they are online I would expect Easy's recruitment to pick up massively as it has been needed for quite some time now but held back by the lack of resources. So hopefully this should mean plenty of tidal flow within the pool for you guys.

Hang in there and best of luck :ok:

NF

[Saffer]

Nice Flaps

Thanks for the update, any specifics on timings? It's all about the timings these days, all about the timings :\

This wouldn't explain why EZY has cancelled the Feb TR course though :confused:

[AustralianGoose]

For you guys in this pool.....I have heard that easyJet require 450 pilots next year, preferably before March - and they will all be taken from CTC :D

Hence CTC are ramping up their recruitment this month to meet these numbers, the next AQC will be massive!!!

Therefore all of you should be out of the pool in the next few weeks:eek:

Good luck to all....

[ChocksAwayUK]

Well, following my initial rejection from EZ I have just recieved the acceptance email detailing my start date of February 12th - guess I can disregard that. :ugh:

[SplashDown]

AustralianGoose

The 450 pilots have been floating around for some time and rumor has it they are close to that number at the moment. Then again there are some rumors that should never be believed :}

Call me negative but I'm pretty sure CTC are not capable of training 450 pilots in 3 months! Nursling has some very good facilities but no where near enough capacity to train that number. Even if they pulled a miracle out of the bag and did the ground school for that number, there's no where near the sim capacity in the UK or Europe to finish the ratings or the trainers to do it!

As Mooneyboy (how you doin my friend!!) and others have said the holding pool is quite small and could be drained empty by just 2 type training courses. I hope that will happen just after xmas once easy get their training side sorted (I say easyJet because they are the by far the biggest users from CTC).

My view is the courses going through at the moment are refresher courses for DEP's and TRSS. These guys and gals normally only need 20 odd sectors for line training and can be online pretty quick. As an ex CTC ATP'er I had to wait near on 3 months before starting line training at easy and then had close to 50 sectors before final line check.

To all you treading water in the pool, keep your head above water and keep in the back of your head you could be in a far far worse situation!

Merry xmas
Splashdown

[Rock Lobster]

As for the requirement by Monarch for approximately 6-8 pilots over the winter period, I have heard through the grapevine that these positions would be filled by Wings Cadets and not ATP.
So, my best style of doggy paddle still needed to keep afloat in the pool, but the future still looks orange (easy jet shade hopefully!).

[Gillespie]

I'm confused at this Monarch chat, as I spoke to a guy from Monarch recently who stated they're now fully crewed for this recruitment drive.

I suppose it could mean they've factored in CTC pilots. I know they're starting the first TR course with CTC on the 5th Feb.

[DragStrut]

hi chocksaway

did your email include all the other atachments you spoke of??

Ive not heard anything bak from easy about my app!!! AHHH ah well bak to treading water think im developing gills in here ha ha ha !!!

hope your well buddy enjoy italy ??

Dragstrut :ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

[ChocksAwayUK]

Yup.. with the attachments. I think things seem to be a bit slow at the recruitment dept. You may still get the email but can probably ignore it!

Italy was great but had a slight dampner put on it when I got the news (not blaming your phonecall - I would've checked my mail later that day). Flew out on an EZA319 thinking it was my new office - not the case on the way back unforch... oh well. We'll get there in the end.

hi chocksaway
did your email include all the other atachments you spoke of??
Ive not heard anything bak from easy about my app!!! AHHH ah well bak to treading water think im developing gills in here ha ha ha !!!
hope your well buddy enjoy italy ??
Dragstrut :ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

[Flying_bear]

just found a warm patch in the water, :uhoh:

FB

[Mooneyboy]

Does anyone know how people in the CTC holdpool are selected out and then put forward to the airlines? Is it on a basis of 'first in first out' or is it done differently? Just curious.

Hi Splashdown, good to see your still on pprune. I'm quickly adapting to the pool and things are going good. Hope your flying is going well.

All the best,

Mooneyboy:ok:

[AustralianGoose]

Does anyone know how people in the CTC holdpool are selected out and then put forward to the airlines? Is it on a basis of 'first in first out' or is it done differently?

Mooneyboy - Selection from the pool is done in order of how well you performed on the AQC. In other words, for a pilot who scored Normal +'s all through the course he/she would then be in the fortunate position whereby they would move to the top of the list - first for selection. Those that didn't perform as well would be lower down, no one individual can remain in the pool for more than 1 year though, therefore even if you scored badly there is small light at the end of the tunnel.

This explains why there are so many swimming in the pool for a good few months now - it's because they scored badly in the AQC...

Hope this helps...

AG

[Thorer]

AussieGoose

You couldn't be more wrong according to the info I have from CTC.

People are put in the order of the AQC's. June AQC people go before July AQC's etc. And if say, the July AQC's are the next to go and only one spot at a TR is available, CTC will randomly pick a person from that AQC.

Thor

[Superpilot]

AG, are you serious? Where do you get your knowledge about CTC from?

[AustralianGoose]

AG, are you serious? Where do you get your knowledge about CTC from?

I am serious as far as my knowledge will allow!

I'm only passing on information that I have heard from a variety of sources. Don't shoot the messenger, after all this is a rumour network:confused:

A couple of the ace pilots such as "Cardboard" and "RocketBoy" have apparently moved to the top of the pile based on exeptional ability and multi - tasking!

[ChocksAwayUK]

I'm fairly certain AustralianGoose is joking. At least I hope so.

Thorer is right. Also, within AQC groups, if you have a particularly good reason to start earlier than your classmates (e.g. IR about to expire) let them know and maybe you'll be given priority rather than subjected to the name-out-of-hat method.

[TartanFlyer]

Hiya Guys and Gals

For all you CTC holdpool'ers, who may or may not know this already, I've heard from a good contact in the industry that Thomas Cook will be dipping into the pool and taking around 6-8 pilots for line flying with them during summer 2007! Things are looking up for you lot I would suggest.

Also, anyone recently in the Southsmpton area know anything about/ seen a cuddly bear floating around anywhere? Any info. would be really appreciated.

Happy Days.

[Saffer]

Also, anyone recently in the Southsmpton area know anything about/ seen a cuddly bear floating around anywhere? Any info. would be really appreciated.



Cuddly Bear!!!

Has someone lost their Teddy then :uhoh:

I did in fact see a naked bear running across the highway late at night after a sim session, looked to me like he had the fear of God in his eyes! Last seem disappearing into the New Forest...

Regarding the ThomsonFly uptake - we all recieved a mail last week from Jo that detailed this, thanks for the heads up though but unfortunately it's not going to change the current situation:suspect:

Anybody got any good news? Would be nice if what AustralianGoose said about 450 pilots needed by March were true! Scheez that would mean the next AQC would have 300 students:eek: Unless of course he knows something we don't....

Take care all....

PS: Will keep my eyes peeled for the Teddy Bear...

[AustralianGoose]

TartanFlyer - Mate I feel your pain, once I to lost my Teddy - for days I clung onto any glimmer of hope. The phone would ring and my heart would skip a beat, there would be a knock at the door and I would have to catch my breath. Teddy never did come back, those were my darkest days and I ended up celebrating my 5th birthday without him:}

Judging by your username I assume that not all the Scots are clinging onto their Teddy whilst watching the TeleTubbies after the age of...oooh lets say, 10:eek:

ThomsonFly news is old news unfortunately....

[ChocksAwayUK]

Regarding the ThomsonFly uptake - we all recieved a mail last week from Jo that detailed this, thanks for the heads up though but unfortunately it's not going to change the current situation:suspect:


Not wishing to be pedantic but rather to prevent any confusion/rumours, it's Thomas Cook (as Saffer probably knows). But you're right - it's a piddly number and hardly going to affect the pool at all. As soon as EZ sorts out it's Line Training issues they'll be hauling us out in our droves.

[TartanFlyer]

Gooseman- Indeed, those days are now, I regret to say, a very very distant memory however.

The request for info. on this bear is actually on behalf of a friend of mine. I'm afraid he's going to be disappointed though, as I'm reliably informed his bear, without wanting to go into too much detail, was clothed head to toe in TOPGUN attire. I believe the bear you saw (quote): "...running across the street..." was naked? Ah well, we can but hope...

Saffer- As Chocks correctly points out, the demand in from Thomas Cook and NOT Thomsonfly, I believe the latter in fully crewed for the forthcoming season, although you holdpool guys are doubtless in a more knowledgable position than myself, so do correct me if I'm wrong.

[AustralianGoose]

The request for info. on this bear is actually on behalf of a friend of mine. I'm afraid he's going to be disappointed though, as I'm reliably informed his bear, without wanting to go into too much detail, was clothed head to toe in TOPGUN attire. I believe the bear you saw (quote): "...running across the street..." was naked? Ah well, we can but hope...



A friend hey:cool:

The bear I saw was naked, but hey he was wearing a pair of Ray Ban Aviators...

[Saffer]

Hey All - did anybody ever get to the bottom of the Monarch story as to whether the uptake was to be from the ATP pool or are they taking cadets:uhoh:

TartanFlyer you wouldn't happen to be the same Scotsman who demonstrated impeccable skills with the Belgium women recently, if so I bow down before thee in admiration always...:cool:

[Flying_bear]

Can't say i saw a bear anywhere sorry.

FB

[TartanFlyer]

TartanFlyer you wouldn't happen to be the same Scotsman who demonstrated impeccable skills with the Belgium women recently, if so I bow down before thee in admiration always...:cool:


I would indeed Saffer.......

It's amazing what rugged looks and a Scots accent can do to the ladies (being a pilot isn't a bad thing either:ok: ), watch 'em fall!

[nosewheelfirst]

You guys are :mad: bored aren't you... :p

[FlyBoyS340]

TartanFlyer you wouldn't happen to be the same Scotsman who demonstrated impeccable skills with the Belgium women recently, if so I bow down before thee in admiration always...:cool:

I gather there was only one Scotsman in Belgium!!! It was I that lost the Teddy in the Forest Park Hotel, God Bless him!

[Mooneyboy]

I guess the selecting thing out of the holdpool is a bit of a gray area. Will have to wait and see.

If you lost a teddy in the Forest Park Hotel its probaly those yellow ducks that got him.

Beware the yellow ducks hunt in packs!:suspect:

[ChocksAwayUK]

I guess the selecting thing out of the holdpool is a bit of a gray area.


:ugh: It isn't at all.

[TartanFlyer]

:ugh: It isn't at all.

You get selected based on how well you performed on the AQC, as AustralianGoose mentioned in a previous post. The important thing is that you can't remain in the pool for longer than 1 year :)

Basically the guys who have been in the pool the longest are the guys who did really badly and only just got through the AQC...they know who they are :cool:

I did really well and scored mostly "normals" throughout, luckily I therefore shouldn't be swimming for much longer. Feel free to PM me if you need any more info...

Good luck everybody,

TF

[Mooneyboy]

ChocksAwayUK

I based the 'gray area' bit on the fact that Thorer didn't agree with AustralianGoose nor did Superpilot on the previous posts.

Also when I meant 'gray area' it wasn't to mean 'dodgy' or anything like that at all if that is how you understood it. I'm sorry will make myself clearer next time.

Basically I was meaning that not everyone seems to fully agree on what method CTC select out of the holdpool. Thats not an unreasonable comment to make. I've only derrived this from what has been said in previous posts.

At the end of the day I'm not complaining just very glad to be in this holdpool.

MB

[ChocksAwayUK]

OK.. well suggest you re-read the posts. Superpilot, Thorer and myself are all in agreement and Australian-Goose is (I hope) joking. Is it not obvious that the method that Australian Goose describes is totally bonkers and goes completely against everything else in this thread?

Anyway, welcome to the pool - hope you're not swimming as long as me! :ok:

[Sky Wave]

There's nothing grey about it. It's exactly as Thorer described it.

SW

[Mooneyboy]

Okay its as Thorer says, thanks for clearing that up for me.

All the best and lets hope were all not treading water for too long :ok:

MB

[Honeycomb]

Hiya everyone! I just jumped in the pool a few weeks ago (hi MB , good job:D !) and I've been monitoring this thread ever since. Today I thought it was time to make an appearance.... I might just soon want to join in on this increasingly interesting discussion about the way this pool is being drained....

Anyways, it's very very nice to be here with you guys and gals, can't wait to see you on a type rating!

Best of luck!

[Saffer]

You guys are :mad: bored aren't you... :p

This comes on the back of months and months of twiddling ones thumbs, tentatively logging onto PPrune to see if there's been any movement from the pool towards the airlines - waiting for that elusive mail to appear in the inbox setting a start date. You see it’s all about the date, about having a set time to work towards thereby having set expectations...

Without expectation the wait will eventually start to drain your sanity, confidence and community standing. Your pets and family will start to look at you in a different light, one day you will arrive home and "they" would have padded the walls for you, the nice nurse will take care of you though and administer your medication with a glowing smile always. Your dreams will be plagued by those bloody yellow ducks, with their beady yellow eyes and sharp yellow beaks, the will hunt you, chasing you till you fall from exhaustion…

Fear not, welcome to our World – the World of the deep dark holdpool :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

[nosewheelfirst]

Well if its any comfort to you guys easyJet do need you and it is down to a complete lack of training captains with hours left. There are a few captains who are going on courses and captains who are just getting the experience they need on the bus before commencing duties again so expect to see movement again. I was lucky enough to go through when the pool was being cleaned ready for you guys :ok:

[Lee Frost]

I hear easyJet now have all the required trainers in place, but there is some restriction in sim time available. The sims are full of ongoing easyJet currency work through Spring, so April / May should see some movement.

Have not heard anything about the other partner airlines since.


LF

[Mooneyboy]

Hi Honeycomb,

Welcome to pprune and congratulations with passing the AQC. Bet your already missing the ducks, suicidal horses and especially the tasty and healthy cuisine :yuk: of a certain hotel! Think we maybe here for a while.



Hope there are pool movements soon don't think Saffer can take much more.


MB:ok:

[Saffer]

I hear easyJet now have all the required trainers in place, but there is some restriction in sim time available. The sims are full of ongoing easyJet currency work through Spring, so April / May should see some movement.
Have not heard anything about the other partner airlines since.
LF

Would it not make sense for them to lease sim time from an outside organisation whether at home or abroad? Thats one option vs. the cost of wet leasing a/c and cancelling flights as per the fiasco that took place last year :confused:

[dankersoe]

Hi Guys
I just returned from 6 weeks travelling and believe me: It is more fun travelling and drinking Piña Coladas in Thailand than swimming around in the pool!
Anyways - Hopefully we will see some movement soon.
Some entertainment while waiting:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAAMPS2MaTs&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsNlaSbGSeI&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3UDCoQnXjA
Merry Christmas to everyone
/
Daniel

[AustralianGoose]

TartanFlyer...

Mate, for a chap who just lost his Teddy and can't move on with life as a result, it suprises me that you would post in the Cabin Crew forum asking about your chances of success on layovers due to your "senior" role on the flight deck :ugh:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=256405

Not suprisingly they closed the thread!

[FlyBoyS340]

TartanFlyer...

Mate, for a chap who just lost his Teddy and can't move on with life as a result, it suprises me that you would post in the Cabin Crew forum asking about your chances of success on layovers due to your "senior" role on the flight deck :ugh:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=256405

Not suprisingly they closed the thread!

You wrote it Goose/TartanFlyer!!! Man you must be bored!!!

[Honeycomb]

I did really well and scored mostly "normals" throughout, luckily I therefore shouldn't be swimming for much longer. Feel free to PM me if you need any more info...

TF

Not as confident around the ladies as with the old stick and rudder?

[triple_2]

Hi folks!

For everybody in the pool: Hoping for places for everybody soon in 2007! :)

Anyone positive info? Been swimming for a couple of months now and I need some good news......

P.S. about the australian goose holding pool sequence story: everybody is in line on date, not results (unfortunately); asked CTC myself... Please use this thread for valid input, not the other kind....

[ChocksAwayUK]

P.S. about the australian goose holding pool sequence story: everybody is in line on date, not results (unfortunately); asked CTC myself... Please use this thread for valid input, not the other kind....

Agreed - just in case anyone else gets confused (see Mooneyboy), the AustralianGoose/Tartan Flyer is a comedy account and anything that it states as fact should be ignored. By all means laugh at it, of course.

[Craggenmore]

OzGoose

The guys who did not score well on my AQC course failed. They were not put into the pool to be walked over.

Where did you get your 'information' from?

[Saffer]

AustralianGoose/Tartan Flyer is a comedy account and anything that it states as fact should be ignored. By all means laugh at it, of course.

I would reckon that Chocks has pretty much nailed it on the head, OzGoose is having a laugh (or has swallowed to much water while trying to stay afloat and it's affected his mental stability :} ) and Tartan is simply misguided...

Heres to the New Year and revised recruitment policies and practices that have been waiting to be initiated in 2007 bringing with it a tidal wave that will turn the pool into a puddle :) And before you can say "wheres my P45", we will all be back in the Forest Park Hotel looking for teddy bears and discussing the merits of spending to much time and hope on this forum :} ...

Hey heres some interesting news for those of you that don't know. Oasis Hong Kong Airlines and easyJet are in talks regarding a possible alliance, allowing passengers to therefore travel intercontinental on an EZY ticket - interesting future possibilities for the likes of us should the two LCC's decide to tie the knot, or not:E

The futures bright, the futures ******:}

[AustralianGoose]

You wrote it Goose/TartanFlyer!!! Man you must be bored!!!

FlyBoyS340

I'm confused, or is there another Goose flying around? :confused:

As far as I can tell TartanFlyer wrote the thread or is there a TartanGoose to which you perhaps refer, in which case that would make sense However I did a search and can't find a TartanGoose. There's only one Goose and shall only ever be!

Anyway - why so defensive?

And yes you are right about the boredom :ugh:

[boredaccountant]

January 2007
Hello. Has anyone got any recent information from people ahead of them in the holdpool as regards start dates for type rating? Someone told me today that no ATP pilots will commence type rating until late April/ May 2007 because of the volume of wings cadet pilots filling the courses.
That would potentially put guys who completed AQC Aug/ Sept/ Oct time almost a 10 month swim in the pool by the time they actually commence training again as I understand some people from july last year are still swimming?
I hope this information is wrong and that we all get a call soon. But at a very boyant time in aviation I would have hoped that a 2/3 month swim was a sufficent waiting time for anyone.... especially in the busy winter months.
Regards

[Saffer]

January 2007
Someone told me today that no ATP pilots will commence type rating until late April/ May 2007 because of the volume of wings cadet pilots filling the courses.


Interesting news, how valid is the source of the information though - would it be Wings cadets filling the sim slots or would it be TRSS applicants with the required hours?

Didn't realise that CTC prioritised Cadets over ATP guys and girls, is this truly the case :eek:

[dodge123]

Didn't realise that CTC prioritised Cadets over ATP guys and girls, is this truly the case

Cadets do get priority over the ATP guys, and given that they were effectively taken on by Easyjet at the start of their courses over 18mths ago you can't really complain.

[Go_Detent]

I've also heard (from a fairly reliable source) that EZY type ratings are quote "...booked until the end of April." Whether this means that slots have already been allocated on these courses remains unclear, however, having finished the AQC late last year, I'm expecting to wait until May at the earliest. Things could all change if EZY have a recruitment glut of course..... :)

Anyone got any update on other partner airlines' plans???

[boredaccountant]

Well Thomas Cook have agreed to take 6 ATP pilots as stated in the December mail from Lee Woodward.
Monarch have taken ATP pilots every winter since the beginning of the ATP scheme, although I haven't heard that confirmed for this winter.
As for the others.... anyone with news it would be great to hear anything!!
The good thing is that if the other partner airlines have a demand for pilots, they will almost certinaly come out of the ATP pool, rather than cadet, due to most of cadet pilots already being signed up to EZY etc... from early or mid way through their training.
Some good news is that the CTC website is still taking fresh applications for the ATP scheme............so at least CTC are confident that future demand from the airlines is still there!

[Mintflavour]

Just been to the ctc web site, it allows you to start a CTC wings application but it still does not allow you to start an ATP application.

Watching this thread closely even though Im not due to start the AQC until May, (passed phase 3 in November), If the trend continues the same for 2007 into 2008 I get the feeling Im still going to be swimming this time next year. gutting as my desk job is getting more and more unbearable.

If any of you people have any AQC preperation advice in the mean time please PM me, (I dont want to Hijack this thread with unrelated info)

All the best to you all,

mint

[ChocksAwayUK]

Well Thomas Cook have agreed to take 6 ATP pilots as stated in the December mail from Lee Woodward.

Yup, they were placed with TC after an interview at Dibden last week and start on an A320 rating next week. Somewhat annoyingly they were from the August AQC thereby leapfrogging those of us from the July AQC who were initially supposed to start with EZ in February but have had our Type Rating cancelled and been plunged back into the pool.

edit: Oh god, and a glance to my personal info on the left there shows my age has increased as of yesterday. The goal was always to be an airline pilot by the time I'm 30. :{

[DickPilot]

August being the course that finished in August or started in August? I think it's time for another update from CTC!

[ChocksAwayUK]

August being the course that finished in August or started in August? I think it's time for another update from CTC!
Ended in August. Or at least the 8 were mainly from that course though I understand there were a couple of exceptions.
At the beginning of December us EZ cancellees were told we'd get an update in "the next few weeks or so." <<< bit non-committal that.

[DickPilot]

I'm not aware of anyone being taken from the pool who started in July, let alone August. As far as I know, all 9 are still swimming. Why would they dip into the August and bypass all of July? Are we sure of that info?

[ChocksAwayUK]

Uh-oh, could be opening up a can of worms here. Things we are sure of:
8 CTCers were placed with TC last week on a Type Rating starting next week.
At least 4 of these were from the August AQC.
1 was from the July AQC.
1 had some unusual circumstances that I didn't fully understand - something about already being rated on something - dunnow, possibly irrelevant.

Why would they dip into the August and bypass all of July?
That's the question. Possibly because when the TC list was drawn up all of the July AQC group were placed with EZ. The one July AQCer was perhaps called in later due to someone dropping out of the TC group after the February EZ rating was cancelled.
Another theory: With TC being a new/unusual client CTC may be trying to impress them with higher quality candidates and put candidates forward who performed particularly well on the AQC - many of those just happened to be from the August AQC. I think this is unlikely for many reasons but do admit that it is a possibility.

[Port Strobe]

With TC being a new/unusual client
Guess who took the first cadet course?

[Mintflavour]

Cadets have priority over ATP people for entry into easyJet and other airlines.

L Met

Who decides this? the airlines choice or CTC normal practice.

Are ATP guys/girls used to fill the gaps by cadet short falls?

Cheers

mint

[triple_2]

I guess it's something about them paying 60k and us paying 6...

Fair enough!:)

[AustralianGoose]

I guess it's something about them paying 60k and us paying 6...
Fair enough!:)

and

Cadets do get priority over the ATP guys, and given that they were effectively taken on by Easyjet at the start of their courses over 18mths ago you can't really complain.

Oh come on, tell me you are joking :ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

At the end of the day we are the customer, we were sold the whole concept of the AQC, we had choices at the time.

Cough up 20k and buy a type rating, with a 90% chance of a job in this current climate at the end of it...or pay CTC 6K, accept a loss of earnings for 8 months with a guaranteed job at the end of the term. Biggest drawing card was the fact that the pool would be empty by Nov '06 :mad:

However the pool never emptied but grew, and grew and grew! With the possibility of some Wannabees spending possibly up to 10 months in the pool, who knows – maybe even more.

Now with hindsight would you have still spent the 6K or have done the TR instead? Everybody will no doubt have differing opinions, some for and some against. I certainly didn't recieve the product I was sold, but thats tough and I'll grin get over it and bide my time in the pool, fortunately I can continue to earn money and pay the mortgage, etc. Not so for some others in our swimming class is it?

But please don't tell me that the cadets have every right to move and be placed ahead of us - holy smoke we are the consumers here – why would you just roll over and play possum!

[DragStrut]

Austrailian Goose

Good post mate, hope we're not swimming much longer, when did you arrive in the pool?? i have been in a number of months now.

I cant agree that we were miss sold the product but what i would have most liked to see was a constant supply of information from ctc which has not been forthcomming. The last we heard was a group email in october with the promise of monthly updates regarding the state of play ie recruitment and placement (but heard nothing since) Have you had or know anyone who has had more regular updates.??

We are im sure still in the strongest and most admirable position in the industry ie being in the hold pool of ctc, but after seeing two friends before me visit the holding pool only for a matter of days the swimming is now hurting my legs.

And yes i dont ever remember being told that the cadets would have priority over us and dont agree with this position at all as we still have upwards of 60/70 grand invested in this career.

Dragstrut:ok: :ok:

[Fair_Weather_Flyer]

All of the delays centre around easyjet's lack of training capacity. Back in July, I'm sure CTC, believed that EZY, would snap up their ATP and Cadet pilots as fast as they could train them. With 400+ pilots as EZY's 2007 recruitment target, it's no wonder they believed that. I did! Then came EZY's capacity crisis. Pilots were leaving so fast they were having to charter work out, which hit their profits. Worse still they had lost many line trainers so they couldn't even train enough newcomers to satisfy demand. Along comes a new Managing Director, who kicks butt over the capacity crisis and heads roll. Since then they've recruited more line trainers and made efforts to try and retain pilots for longer. They are still VERY tight on training capacity from what I hear though. The CTC, guys take double the number of line sectors to train, have the longest time to command and in the past have been the hardest to retain. Is it any wonder the new management are concentrating on the SSTR pilots recruited from other airlines? Have EZY fallen out of love with CTC Cadets and ATP'ers? Or is it just a temporary blip? Time will tell.

I reckon that recruitment in the next 2-3 months will come from Monarch, Jet2 and Thomsonfly, all of whom are adding airframes in the very near future. Problem is that all three have been doing a lot of recruitment themselves recently. Between them they could hoover out the hold pool very fast; if they don't though it's bad news all round.

And the issue of favouring Cadets over ATP pilots? CTC have invested serious time and money in their NZ and Bournemouth training facilities. They have to use that capacity to make money out of it and they can't easily turn off the tap of cadets coming out of the system.

On the bright side I'm sure they'll find jobs for everyone in the pool; even after 9/11 they still managed it, so it's just a matter of time.

[Go_Detent]

I'm with Oz Goose. During my AQC we were told by an overwhelming majority of CTC employees that the ATP hold pool will be emptied in very quick time and we can be fairly certain of starting type ratings within months.

Alas, this was not the case.

I am fully prepared to accept that CTC (and indeed all of their partner airlines) perhaps don't know themselves what recruitment plans are to be implemented, if indeed any.

What's so furstrating however, is the lack of contact that is forthcoming from CTC. Promises of 'e-mail updates in the near future' is simply not good enough, not least because they're so infrequent.

On completing my AQC, I was full of praise for the way in which the course itself was conducted and pleased to say that it met, if not exceeded all of my high expectations. Unfortunately, the after-sales service has, in my opinion, fallen short of acceptable, leaving me feeling disillusioned and moreover, far from (to coin a phrase) 'In the loop...'


GD.

[Honeycomb]

Another theory: With TC being a new/unusual client CTC may be trying to impress them with higher quality candidates and put candidates forward who performed particularly well on the AQC - many of those just happened to be from the August AQC. I think this is unlikely for many reasons but do admit that it is a possibility.

When I was at phase 2 Lee Woodward, the Head of CTC Wings, held the introduction. Among other things he told us that he was working for Monarch part time. Next he said that CTC only gave the best pilots to Monarch, upon which I laughed out laud….and this wrongly because he was dead serious :oh: . At first I really thought he was joking *ha ha*, I must have seemed stupid. Anyway, this might answer a few questions.

DragStrut: My latest update was the 8th of December where Lee Woodward told us, via an email from Jo Ward, that 14 people were going to EZY within the next 2-3 months and that 6 were going to TC.

Try to enjoy your time while swimming!

HC :ok:

[DragStrut]

Fair Weather Flyer!!!

where do you base these interesting**** assumptions!!!! ?????????

That is completely the opposite to all the evidence I have and all the related articles relating to CTC trained pilots who have shown above average aptitiude and above average commitment when given the chance to progress to the big jets ...

interestingly negative post from you bearing in mind that this thread is populated with CTC's excellent pilot end product!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:= := := := :=

[Fair_Weather_Flyer]

I wasn't questioning aptitude or commitment. You seem to have got the wrong end of the stick. I'm in the pool myself.... Was it my line about needing double the number of line training sectors that you found offensive? That is part of the deal with the airline and CTC. You WILL get double the number of line training sectors that the direct entry SSTR pilots get, whether you need it or not. That is an increased training burden for the airline that they cannot accomodate at present.

Perhaps you have another suggestion as to why EZY cancelled the TR courses for CTC ATP'ers recently and why they are giving priority to experienced SSTR pilots at present?

[AustralianGoose]

That is completely the opposite to all the evidence I have and all the related articles relating to CTC trained pilots who have shown above average aptitiude and above average commitment

Dragstrut....

What colour is the sky in your World :rolleyes:

Fair Weather Flyer has hit the nail on the head :D

EZY is a business model, a LCC built around happy shareholders and healthy profit margins, a business model that is designed and managed by businessmen, not pilots.

So no matter how great a pilot you feel you or the rest of us are, the facts are there that CTC pilots do take double the number of sectors and therefore training capacity than an SSTR guy off the street. In the long term we will take more time to reach a command and cost more money.....who would you go for given the option?

It's common sense, we are all in an extremely fortunate position at the moment but lets not assume that that makes us invincible!

AG ;)

[Flying_bear]

i agree with the start of theis page about the whole wings over atp guys,

some wings guys have had to wait months to get T/R's upto 4 months, so its not all roses for them either, what would annoy me was if they just tried to get rid of the backlog of wings in one hit leaving ATP guys holding for upto 10/11 months.

i also agree that the communication from CTC has been absolutly rubbish, a supposed newsletter every "month". no idea when in the month , maybe only when enough people start pestering them.

would i have done this or a type rating, well hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Yes they did get guys jobs after 9/11, ten months after if i remember rightly, well thats what the famous brittania pilot/ actor said. but he also told one lot of phase one appilcants in october or whenever it was that 13 people had left the pool for jet2.com, which as far as i am aware and those i've spoken never happened, marketing perhaps.

but nether the less , i'll swim in this pool and make the odd pointless comment on here till i leave, then hopefully i'll be so busy i'd have forgotten all about this site, except jet blast(which is a good laugh) and that thread about who wears hats and doesn't.

Night

FB:zzz:

ps 2 guys from the july(start) course left and then the rest of us,

[Sky Wave]

Just to answer the comment of double the amount of training slots for CTC. Having just joined EZY from the CTC hold pool I can tell you that I will need 46 sectors on the 737 (they write it in your training file). I have 250 hours on either PA28 or BE76. Other people that have come in via TRSS are being put down for 20 - 25 sectors. These people already have a full ATPL and one was a Flybe Q400 Captain. I've no idea how many sectors a SSTR entrant would require if indeed EZY actually take SSTR, but I would be certain they would need a significant amount more than a Q400 captain and I suspect probably the same amount as me.

To the guys in the pool, hang on in there. I was in the pool 8 months but it is well worth the wait. Things would have to get a lot worse to make me buy a Type Rating.

Chocks, sorry to hear you got passed over, I guess that means you're just waiting for the next EZY placement. Let me know when you get the call

SW

[AustralianGoose]

These people already have a full ATPL and one was a Flybe Q400 Captain. I've no idea how many sectors a SSTR entrant would require if indeed EZY actually take SSTR

Skywave...

We are talking about one and the same thing, to qualify for TRSS/SSTR (!) with EZY you need a minimum of 1,500 hours of which 500 multicrew. Therefore they have more experience than most of us and require half the sectors.

Thanks for clarifying the above though :ok:

[DickPilot]

OK... time for an element of perspective I think!

This is how I see it:

1) If any of us would have failed selection at any time (including the AQC), we would be very p*ssed off and would be envious of those in the pool.

2) I understand that CTC have always managed to place successful candidates and so we will all be employed some day.

3) Would you rather be applying for hundreds of jobs right now and getting nothing back, not even an acknowledgement?

4) How about paying thousands of pounds for a type rating followed by no hours (or very few) on type and no guarantee of a job? Combine that with the possibility of seeing it lapse after 12 months!

As wannabe’s, we are in one of the best positions to be in with nothing more to worry about other than keeping current and waiting. How many other pilots are there that wish they were in the same position? You only have to look at the other forums to find out!

So, a little update from CTC would be useful and then we can all get on with dreaming about the day that we WILL sit in that right hand seat for the first time.

Remember, CTC said that easyjet want 450 pilots of which a third will be from CTC with most of those being ATP.

I don’t know about you, but after being in the pool since the summer, I’m still very excited about that!

[Wing_Bound_Vortex]

All i can say is hang on in there guys ( and girls ), you will be plucked out of the pool at some point, CTC want their investment back believe me so they will place you. Shame they're not more forthcoming with info, but i guess the answer to that it that they're prob a little unclear as to when the flow will pick up.

I can tell you that we seem to have a much larger number of guys coming through at the mo than in recent months, such has been the training backlog, many of who are from the ATP scheme. The past couple of days there's been groups of 5-8 guys in the crew room about to go off and do base training...look at all those excited/nervous ( delete as applicable :E ) faces!

Lots of guys doing famil flights on the jumpseat as well, prior to base trn.

P.s. required number of sectors seems to be variable depending on experience, ATP/Cadet guys seem to be getting about 50 prior to line check, if you're ready for it earlier then it's possible to have an earlier check, but above all easyJet would like you to pass it the first time around so even if you're ready most people seem to do the full amount, just to be sure.

WBV

[BitMoreRightRudder]

The recent ezy pilots newsletter confirmed we are recruiting 500 pilots this year. Thats a lot of people! As has been mentioned the sole problem is training capacity. Bear in mind it isn't just new guys taking up the TR/Line training slots, current ezy pilots are undergoing training onto the A319 as current 737 bases convert to airbus bases and new bases are opened in Europe. Madrid and Milan are the two most recent additions.

My base started converting to Le Bus' in early summer and we are only just finishing the last few guys training. So thats over six months of reduced training capacity with all the guys at my base alone requiring 20 sectors line training each on completion of the airbus conversion course. They are now going to be concentrating on getting as many of you guys in before the summer madness begins - last summer was a debacle due to crew shortages and they are very keen to ensure it doesn't happen again.

Keep the faith, I can ensure you the light at the end of the tunnel is worth the wait. Hope to see some of you guys at ezy ;)

[Lee Frost]

I agree. Its human nature to become accustomed to being in a relatively 'good' situation, and then find other things to complain about. I think those in the pool would do well to try and find some interesting or fun short-term work and concentrate on enjoying the small time we will have to wait before going to TR.

If its half a year then so be it - but don't crowd that time with moaning and complaining, when there are hundreds of others out there with absolutely no response from airline HR depts. We are all in a good situation in the (...to coin a phrase) 'big picture'.

Looking around my AQC there were no spoilt-brat style characters - we should be careful not to present ourselves as such on this forum. Even if the flow of information from CTC could be better (and I think it could), its not our train set; we cannot affect decisions being made on our immediate futures.

What we can do is shift our outlook - I'd say the one above would be a fitting template - and try to enjoy life....when we all get stuck in to our 900 hrs/year there may be some looking back to the time in the holdpool thinking...."that wasn't such a bad time after all"!

Sorry about the slight thread creep.....back on course now....I'll look forward to more info anyone has on airlines, and possible recruitment plans :)

Stay positive! :ok:

[triple_2]

Lee Frost!

I couldn't agree more, mate!

It's very easy to see things negative, even in a relative positive position as we are in.

Lets stay positive and hope we get some good news from CTC soon!

[Go_Detent]

Am I right in thinking that as from Feb. onwards, EZY are no longer running B737 conversion courses? I seem to remember hearing this fairly recently- which may help explain the current lack of (or at least reduced) throughput from CTC to EZY.

This is obviously understandable, I'm sure the company are prioritising base/ internal conversion courses before introducing more people to an already saturated training programme.

Please correct me if I'm wrong....

GD.

[SplashDown]

Go-Detent

I find it hard to believe that easy are going to stop 737 conversions. The fleet may be small compaired to the busses but is still going with 30 aircraft. The trainers are all still there, the facilities (okay just 1 sim at Alteon now with the -700) are all there and I don't see any busses coming to NCL, BFS or LTN anytime soon!

I'm pretty sure the delay for you all treading water is mainly down to the training problems at easy. As I said in an earlier post, easy are concentrating on DEP's and TRSS guys and gals who need 20 odd sectors line training and can get online ASAP.

All the best.

Splashdown

[AustralianGoose]

I find it hard to believe that easy are going to stop 737 conversions. The fleet may be small compaired to the busses but is still going with 30 aircraft.

Saying that there does appears to be a rumour that EZY are looking at options on 22 Saab 340's for July delivery for some new domestic routes on the mainland.

This being the case then one would expect that the ATP guys would fill the slots for the Saab as the trainers appear to be coming from Logan Air...

At least this would dry out the pool all in one swoop :O

[DragStrut]

fair weather flyer and Austrailian goose

thank you for the information you provide as from the posts it wasnt clear initially that the comparison was between ctc pilots and prieviosly employed and experienced pilots which was the basis for my origional post.

I fully agrree that nothing we could do would affect the overall picture at easy or for that matter anyother airline.

AG: dont know where the Invincible reference came from!! i for one take nothing for granted in this industry.. ha ha ah:ugh: :ugh:

hope to see you all on line in the near future...

Dragstrut :8 :8

[Superpilot]

22 Saab 340's for July delivery

I heard it was 209 PA28's due for 1st April.

[ChocksAwayUK]

Ah, we're being crazy pranksters again are we? Just when you think AutralianGoose is making some sense *bam* he pulls the rug from right under you! :\

[golfrocky]

As CTC doesn´t seem to be updating us, I thought we could update ourselves. If people from the different AQC´s could write how many currently are swimming from their classes, it would be great.

Start July?
Start August?
start September: 9 pro swimmers
....

Anybody been contacted lately regarding start of TR´s?

thanks

[Uniform46]

Start of July - at least 1!!

[DragStrut]

hi all

June 26th start course - we have all been allocated type ratings now as far as i know at this point

hope this helps

Dragstrut :D :D :D

[ChocksAwayUK]

hi all
June 26th start course - we have all been allocated type ratings now as far as i know at this point
hope this helps
Dragstrut :D :D :D

Or have we? You'd think, with the amount of emphasis that CTC put on keeping each other 'in the loop', they might adhere to it themselves. ;) Anyway, optimistically standing by for confirmation of the March 12th start.

[DickPilot]

Which leaves 3 still swimming from start of July course.

[Saffer]

Anyway, optimistically standing by for confirmation of the March 12th start.

Chocks, does this mean that you guys were recently called, and would I be right in assuming that it's for EZY?

So we have:

July - 3
August - ?
September - 9 pro swimmers with loads of talent
October - 7

[ChocksAwayUK]

That's right, or so EZ tell us (remember we are already in their system due to our previously cancelled TR, so they can contact us directly ) but CTC haven't confirmed yet. :confused:

[bigjarv]

December - 6 olympic swimmers with even more talent and a raft!!

[Saffer]

December - 6 olympic swimmers with even more talent and a raft!!

You'll find the raft a useful asset :\

Any knowledge on the August numbers?

[Mooneyboy]

November AQC - 4 dived elegantly and with style into the pool.

[golfrocky]

So August people, you´re gonna come out of the pool and tell us others how many you are?

[Saffer]

Apparently the August guy 'n girls are not the best of swimmers (unlike the Sept AQC who are primarily athletic Adonis like figures who excel at swimming and golf) and therefore are finding it difficult to speak up.... However there is a strong rumour circulating that there are 7 of them :sad:

July - 3
August - 7
September - 9 pro swimmers with loads of talent and Adonis like abilities, much admired by all :D
October - 7
November - 4
December - 6

So here's hoping the next call up is for 36 of CTC's finest, at least the Forest Park Hotel has a heated pool :}

[Lee Frost]

Does anyone know why the Nov course was so small? Was it a very lean intake or were some people chopped?
Hopefully an update will come soon from CTC. If anyone has any info on recruitment plans from partner airlines other than EZY that would be interesting.
Cheers,
LF

[Sky Wave]

November was probably a lean intake. The current AQC only has 3 ATP'ers.

[Kerropi]

Hi,
What kind of jobs are you guys doing while waiting in the pool?
How many people failed in your AQC course?
K.

[Mintflavour]

This might be a trend as CTC were concentrating on Wings applicants from July onwards. As an ATP applicant I applied in August, didnt get offered Phase 2 until October, where there were only 3 ATPers and I think I was the only one to get through, Phase 3 end November where there were only 2 ATPers we both got through, but we cant get on the AQC until May.


mint

[Mooneyboy]

I think the main reason why the Nov AQC was so small was that there were 4 guys who were all pre-assigned to aerocypria and started their 737 course about a week after the AQC finished. There were 6 Wings so in total there were 14 doing the AQC. I would imagine that they had room for only 4 ATP'ers. Luckily no one on our course failed AQC.

MB

[Mintflavour]

K
Continueing with my full time proffesion as Project engineer, Taking 3 weeks annual leave for the AQC so I can work up until TR. Current employment have no idea of my flying intensions, and hopefully won't until I get the majic phone call. Aviation is not a business to go into where you would want to burn your bridges.
An indication of why people fail the AQC would be of interest, as I have the AQC in May, failure is not option but feel anxious that it is possible
Mint

[Go_Detent]

...And yet still no word from CTC Towers. Forgive my cynicism, but I can't help but feel that the 'floodgates will open' idiom was perhaps a little ill-advised and promises of regular e-mail updates were somewhat empty.

[Lee Frost]

From the 'direct entry embraer flyBE' thread on terms and endearment....


"Particularly as over 200 Bacon guys are trying to get into Easyjet."


I wonder how this is impacting on easy's plans to use ATP people. With the previous poster's comment about no of line training sectors required, would these more experienced pilots automatically take their place in front of ATP folk?

Some communication from CTC would be useful..I can't imagine they are completely in the dark over future plans?!

LF

[Go_Detent]

Some communication from CTC would be useful..I can't imagine they are completely in the dark over future plans?!

This is exactly what's so frustrating. CTC claim to be in weekly contact with their partner airlines and yet remain reluctant to divulge any sort of information whatsoever.

As LF says, the guys trying to get into EZY from FlyBe would certainly help explain the recent downturn in numbers taken from the ATP hold pool, but if this is the case, I reckon we have a right to be told so, so that we can make more permenant arrangements (living, jobs etc...) in the meantime.

Glug, glug, glug...:sad:

[boilerhoose]

Hello fellow ATPers,

Firstly I’d like to say that I’m a product of this fantastic scheme. You will not find many schemes like the ATP, where they take totally inexperienced pilots straight out of flight school, type rate them and place them with a Major Airline…all for the cost of 6K.

Secondly, it really shocks me to read what some of you have been posting here. It’s not rocket science to figure out who’s who. Baring in mind the pool is only 40 odd strong with some of you posting which course you were on. Couple that with age and location….

You can not afford to become complacent. You can not afford to become greedy. I ask you to remember where you are, and how luck you are. The reason you are not getting regular updates from CTC (they did say you’d get one update per month – which they’ve honoured) is due to there being nothing to update.

Stop blaming CTC. They are the ones providing you with an opportunity. Easyjet are having difficulty due to lack of training captains. This will improve over the year, which should see most of you placed. Placed in a brand new shiny jet, so count yourselves lucky!

[Sky Wave]

An indication of why people fail the AQC would be of interest,

Lack of recent flying practice and rusty instrument flying skills. There's a lot to learn on the AQC and you do not have the time to re-learn how to fly an ILS or how to deal with an engine failure. The Boeing 737 is a twin engine aircraft and you need exactly the same skills to fly it as you do a Duchess or a Seneca. If you are in doubt about your skills I recommend getting some sim time with an instructor. Do not bother wasting money on a jet sim, a FNPT2 will be good enough.

SW

[Fair_Weather_Flyer]

I don't buy it that the number of pilots applying from regional airlines has made any difference whatsoever to the recruitment of ATP pilots. I should think that half of the pilots from these airlines have always had an application in with EZJ and most of the other jet operators. I can't think EZJ were ever short of applicants as they are well up the food chain.

I see Thomsonfly are after FO's again; but they seem to be after experienced people with low timers coming from their own FTE cadets. Jet2 have recruited heavily from the GECAT scheme run with OATS. GECAT seem to be making inroads into what, was CTC's turf i.e supplying low time pilots.

[Captain_Trim]

Hey boys n girls,

Not yet an AQC Holdpooler myself but i'm waiting for an AQC. Did my Phase 3 in September and passed with initial allocation for a AQC on March 5th. There was only 1 other AQC'er in my selection although i have no clue if he got through. Unfortunatly interview times crossed and never got contact details. All you peeps are going to be well into a TR before me (if i pass) but i thought i'd give you the info about what's bringing up the rear and hope that it can help complete some of the CTC jigsaw.

Seems that CTC are being more selective at Stage 1. I got through within a week to stage 1b etc. My training partner during CPL/IR (who has just got a job with Cityjet) didn't get a reply until Nov. Seems CTC are restricting AQC numbers from the offset. I also went through CTC Wings Cadet selection and they are given 'priority' as mentioned before. This is only because airlines can say 'next year i need x amount of pilots'. CTC can turn around and say how many are coming through their integrated scheme and assign them appropriately. We all know that airlines prefer integrated to modular or ab initio (even if we don't like it). To managerial staff CTC Cadets must be perfect as they can budget over a year in advance and know who they are going to get.

I've also had an recommendation to FlyBe, but due to their BACON takeover they've stopped taking people on. I'll be getting an update on their state of play soon. As said before on this thread, it's also been affecting employment all over cos pilots are jumping ship. Pilots are choosing whether to stay with BACON or goin to FlyBe or ESY. Most (according to the forum) seem to be moving on. To be fair, who are airlines going to prefer, the seasoned BACON guys with turbine time or the 250 hr wannabes with an AQC? Unfortunatly it's bad timing that one of the British budget carriers has sold out right over our employment windows. We just have to hang on and hope things sort themselves out. The amount of pilots with jet/turbine time looking for jobs will affect holdpool movement without question.

I'm still happy with the AQC scheme although as with most people on this thread i think the lack of info seems to be dire. I still haven't got the 100% confirmation that i'm on the March course and it took an email to the CTC team to give me a little more reassurance that it still looked ok. A little too close to confort as i have to book off work etc. Also seems weird to have no course material. As mentioned it's a hard course and most sensible people will want to commit time to getting SOPs as slick as possible (at least EOPs) before arriving. How hard would it be to have info online in PDF to download and read through.

Every airline has probs with training capts atm. I know (from staff contacts) that FlyBe had them and Easyjet. As the training capts retired off the top of the ladder captains had to be trained to be training capts before FOs could be trained for command before we could start to be trained as FOs. It's a vicous circle that started with the airlines lack of recruitment after 9/11. A friend had to wait 2 months after her type rating to do her base check. This with the aforementioned BACON buy out has reduced the amount of low houred FOs needed this year. CTC could not have envisioned BACONS demise back in July/August.

Think that this is (although i hope that it isn't) a year that CTC couldn't have foreseen and they're going to be struggling to clear the pool over the next 12 months. I hope i'm wrong for all our sakes. It still remains the most professional outfit for low houred pilots but ultimately seems to need to work on comms with its customers.

CT

[Kerropi]

Any news??

[Mintflavour]

:eek: :eek: :eek: Where's the life guard quick, I think they are drowning Throw in the life buoy!!!!

:uhoh:

mint

[mattd2k]

Maybe the lack of replies is due to the fact the pool has suddenly emptied and they are too busy on Type Ratings to bother with this thread anymore! :rolleyes: Here's hoping as I am about to join the pool very soon.

On a positive note, I was speaking to one of EZ's Line Training Captains last week and he was very positive that they would be dipping into the pool fairly soon. :ok:

Keep your heads above water but watch out for the splash, I'm about to jump in. :eek: