Australia Investigates Alternative to F-35

[ORAC]

TheAge.co.au: Govt wants alternative to F-35 fighter

The federal government has ordered a new proposal for a "well-developed alternative" to the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) amid concerns the $15 billion project can't be delivered as promised.

Fairfax newspapers report that Defence Minister Brendan Nelson said he wanted a back-up to the warplane. "We don't have to finally commit to the Joint Strike Force (Force) by 2008 but I want to make sure we have a well-developed alternative well in advance of that," he was quoted as saying.

Dr Nelson would not move the project to cabinet until alternatives were analysed and at least one selected, the papers said, although he would not identify any alternatives. He was impressed by the fighter's potential and believed, if delivered on time and for the promised price, it would be the "correct aircraft for us".

The JSF is in development but concerns have been expressed that its cost may rise too high and delivery time fall back years. The fighter was not only the most expensive Defence project ever, it was the biggest investment by the commonwealth since Federation, the papers said.

[GOLF_BRAVO_ZULU]

Now that is Smart Procurement. Doesn't demonstrate commitment, solidarity nor trust to the USA, though.

[Wiley]

Looks like history is repeating itself yet again. The very same thing happened in the late 60's after the TSR2 was ditched in favour of the (then on paper only) F111. Two squadrons of F4E's were leased to cover the gap when the Triple-1 was delayed - and delayed, and delayed. (A little bit of trivia that might be of interest given what's currently dominating the headlines, I understand that those Oz F4's, on their return to their owner, had the kangaroo roundels replaced with a six pointed blue star before they were sent on a very hurried one way deployment to take part in the Yom Kippur War.)

I suspect that recent events might have helped convince a few of the suits in Canberra that what those boring men in uniform have been telling them all along might be true - the F35 simply will not and can never provide a believable replacement for the F111. I forget who it was who originally coined the ‘speak softly and carry a big stick’ phrase, but in an increasingly uncertain world, the F35 simply isn’t a big enough stick (or to be more accurate, doesn’t have nearly long enough legs or long range low level capability) to provide Australia with a credible deterrent force.

[ZK-NSJ]

100 or so new model f-15E's would probably cost a lot less, deliverys could start almost straight away, and the aircraft could still clean the clock of anything else in the area

[NURSE]

Looks like history is repeating itself yet again. The very same thing happened in the late 60's after the TSR2 was ditched in favour of the (then on paper only) F111. Two squadrons of F4E's were leased to cover the gap when the Triple-1 was delayed - and delayed, and delayed. (A little bit of trivia that might be of interest given what's currently dominating the headlines, I understand that those Oz F4's, on their return to their owner, had the kangaroo roundels replaced with a six pointed blue star before they were sent on a very hurried one way deployment to take part in the Yom Kippur War.)
I suspect that recent events might have helped convince a few of the suits in Canberra that what those boring men in uniform have been telling them all along might be true - the F35 simply will not and can never provide a believable replacement for the F111. I forget who it was who originally coined the ‘speak softly and carry a big stick’ phrase, but in an increasingly uncertain world, the F35 simply isn’t a big enough stick (or to be more accurate, doesn’t have nearly long enough legs or long range low level capability) to provide Australia with a credible deterrent force.

From what I remember reading some of the former Aussie F4's became F4G wild weasel aircraft so not all of them went to Israel.

[Pass-A-Frozo]

Now that is Smart Procurement. Doesn't demonstrate commitment, solidarity nor trust to the USA, though.

You've obviously never dealt with the US Foriegn Military Sales process / people :} :E :E

[Not_a_boffin]

This is standard practice in the Aussie DMO. Any procurement submission must include both the desired system (in this case Dave) and a MOTS fallback (so expect to see Typhoid, Gripen with extended range or possibly F18E).

They're doing exactly the same with their shipping projects - they want to buy a spanish assault ship design tweaked to AUS requirements, but are mandated to include the French (in-service) equivalent.

[BombayDuck]

How 'bout the Su-30MKA? ;) :ok:

We'll sell you the air-launched Brahmos too! :}

[Pass-A-Frozo]

Did someone say Air Launched Brahman?

http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/cattle/brahman/images/brahman-web-1.jpg

[antipodean alligator]

From what I remember reading some of the former Aussie F4's became F4G wild weasel aircraft so not all of them went to Israel.
Well Nurse, I reckon that they are both extremely valid uses!

[Washington_Irving]

Now that is Smart Procurement. Doesn't demonstrate commitment, solidarity nor trust to the USA, though.

Indeed. Anyone want to put a bet on when exactly John Howard is going to be compared to Hitler, Dick Cheney starts making snarling, thinly veiled threats and Donald Rumsfeld starts making vague assertions about WMDs hidden in various Northern Territory cattle stations North, South, East and West of Alice Springs?

Bagsy UK forces get headquartered in the Whitsundays!:}

[GreenKnight121]

As Governor of New York Teddy Roosevelt fought with the party bosses, who threatened, to "ruin" him if he didn't cooperate with appointments. In the end the bosses gave in.

Nathan Miller in his book "Theodore Roosevelt, A Life", page 337, writes

"Looking back upon his handling of the incident, Roosevelt thought he 'never saw a bluff carried more resolutely through to the final limit.' And writing to a friend a few days later, he observed: 'I have always been fond of the West African proverb: "Speak softly and carry a big stick; you will go far." ' "

This proverb popularly attributed to Roosevelt served him well in his presidency.



So, which West African people originated that saying, I wonder?

Obviously, he learned it on one of his many safaris... showing that "travel broadens the mind" is also a true saying.

[BombayDuck]

Did someone say Air Launched Brahman?

psst, PAF (ooer, thats an unlikely TLA!), I do believe you didn't intend to offend, but the Brahmans (or Brahmins) are a caste among the Hindus, and a comment like that would upset some people. Not moi, though

This (http://www.brahmos.com/), is more on the lines of what I had in mind, though....

[ORAC]

Is that Sikh hitting missile? :}