View Full Version : IFR fuel reserve
Frunobulax
22nd Jul 2006, 10:17
Imagine 2 separate airports in one single TMA: one civil, one military. Do the normal rule for IFR fuel reserve, i.e flight to alternate plus 40 minute holding apply also for the military traffic (let's say F-16)?
All traffic is handled by civilian ATC staff, both airports are controlled.
ComJam
22nd Jul 2006, 10:30
I wouldn't have thought ATC would have anything to with it. Surely that's a matter for the Operating Authority (particularly in the case of a Military a/c)
Frunobulax
22nd Jul 2006, 10:47
Well, ATC wouldl be more than concerned if the jets were returning with extremely low fuel with no reserve every single day breaking down all planned sequence (the airports are close together)
stillin1
23rd Jul 2006, 11:59
Need to be specific here - is this hypothetical or not?
If not - ask them?
If hypothetical - 40 mins hold fuel for a Mil FJ and div fuel, no way, far too impracticable for day to day ops.
40 mins hold fuel for a Mil FJ and div fuel, no way, far too impracticable for day to day ops - back in the days of the Lightning (aaahhh!) you woud be lucky to take off with fuel for 40 mins flying time.
At Leuchars in days of old we carried an IFR diversion fuel (normally Lossie), one approach and go, and we used Edinburgh as a 'crash' alternate ie someone has blocked the runway at Leuchars when you are in the circuit.
Crash diversion fuel for the Lightning was 800lbs and involved shutting down one engine to get there on a Mayday. I suspect yer modern jet is a bit better, but I'd be surprise if they had 40 mins holding!
stillin1
23rd Jul 2006, 16:11
"I suspect yer modern jet is a bit better, but I'd be surprise if they had 40 mins holding!"
They don't. 40 mins is 1/4 of my fuel load on a good day. I get home with 5 to 10 mins fuel above divert.:ok:
Hold West
24th Jul 2006, 00:41
My airport is dual-use, with heavy civil traffic and F-15s based on the field, along with visiting F-16s, F-18s, etc. The fighters have some magic number of pounds they are supposed to have in the tanks when they land, but don't have much margin above that. Typically when they recover they are somewhere between dry and dryer, judging by the number of minimum fuel calls I get. It doesn't hurt that we are CAVU about 350 days a year, and have 4 runways to play with if one gets shut for some reason.
Frunobulax - this sounds to me like a little bit of missing 'liaison' from the military. Why not have a chat about their ops with them?