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PENNINE BOY
3rd Jun 2006, 10:57
:ok: Hi I am planning a flight to Morroco next month, has any one on prune been who can shed any probs.
Cheers

P.B.

MEON VALLEY FLYER
3rd Jun 2006, 11:57
mate, even North Africa is Africa. A thick skin a some green backs help most matters.

Also expect some interest in your activities from big brother. Current security state and all.

172driver
3rd Jun 2006, 18:33
Been there a number of times, here's a brief outline. As you don't specify VFR/IFR, I am assuming VFR:

1) you will have to fly VFR routes. Suggest you program these into your GPS, as the VRPs are in many cases impossible to find/see w/o local knowledge.

2) check NOTAMS, they have a lot of D/R areas, plan around the activity time (a particularly pesky one lies right across your path from Spain to Fes - active, IIRC Mon-Fri).

3) you are expected to call Casablanca at the FIR boundary. Unless you are 7000 ft or higher, you won't be able to..:confused: call the nearest airport (Tanger or Tetouan) for relay

4) you will be expected to make position reports along your route in the format XYZ at VVV, expecting ZZZ (i.e. next VRP) at xx.xx(Z). ATC is ok, but they do it in three languages (English/French/Arabic), which sometimes, well, you get the drift....:ugh:

5) overflight of ANY ciity in Morocco is prohibited

6) if you speak ANY French, use it ! Not on the radio, but on the ground, it makes a world of a difference.

7) Bakshish (i.e. a little tip) to the guy at the AIS is welcome in the South, frowned upon in the North. Use common sense. Generaly staff at the airports are very nice and friendly and, if asked nicely, will sometimes go out of their way to help you. As an aside, you usually have to go through the same checks (both passport and security) as the SLF. Find an official, tell him you are aircrew (and show your license) and you will be escorted past the huddling masses :ok:

8) The Atlas mountains are a serious mountain range; do NOT underestimate them !! You will also be flying in a hot n'high situation, make sure you can actuallly get across (if indeed you plan to do so).

9) In the South, check 100LL avail. Errashidia for example does normally NOT have it. You also pay slightly less for fuel when departing internationally.

In general it's a great place to fly. Fab scenery, nice people and quite different. I personally prefer the South (other side of the Atlas) where it really starts to feel like Africa, but anywhere/s interesting.

Enjoy!

HTH

PENNINE BOY
5th Jun 2006, 11:18
Thanks for your reply, I will be flying a mixture of IFR/VFR so thanks for your pointers.
PB

bose-x
5th Jun 2006, 12:09
I would be interested in your experiance and the pointers you get. I am flying to Mallorca tommorrow on a bit of whim having decided to go at the weekend and have contemplated going on to Africa before returning home.

Finally got my spanish charts this morning so got to draw a few lines on the chart tonight!

7gcbc
6th Jun 2006, 09:20
cracking post 172driver. :ok:

bellyfluffer
29th Jun 2006, 10:58
seconded....

great post 172driver! :D

Has anyone any updates to this thread as im due to arrive in malaga next week for 25hrs hourbuilding before starting my IR so morocco sounds great fun!

Any help appreciated!
:ok:

acuba 290
5th Jul 2006, 21:58
anybody knows where to get VFR Charts of Morocco?

IO540
6th Jul 2006, 06:33
I don't know anything about this area in particular, but the standard place for charts for places that don't publish any would be the American ONP/TPC charts. They are sold by various shops e.g.

http://www.maptown.com/worldaviation/onc_main.html

Some of these you can buy for download too, cheaply. They are copyright-free, I believe (don't have mine handy). I used them for Greece etc.

Even the usual UK pilot shops carry a small collection.

All are seriously out of date (5 years+) and show danger/prohibited areas only (which are also out of date of course), no controlled airspace is shown.

To get the updated information, there are two ways I can think of:

1. Buy the standard IFR charts (e.g. Jepp) and these show CAS etc. A very slow process to transpose and mark up the stuff onto the ONC chart.

2. "Borrow" a copy of Jepp Flitestar/Flitemap/Jeppview with the appropriate coverage and mark the stuff up onto the ONC chart. The "European" coverage is enough to cover Morroco - I have just checked. And you can print off chart sections from Flitestar. PM me if you need this.

However, the Jepp Raster Charts CD for Europe does not cover it.

Leclairage
8th Jul 2006, 14:09
I flew Chichester to Tenerife a couple of years ago, routing through Morocco.

For charts I got the American Jeppersen ones...but I had to find out from the FAA which ones I needed! I just looked though my notes...but couldent find the numbers I called.
I gave all my charts to a Moroccan PPL as I left the country - THEY find it really hard to get VFR charts too!
Flying in the country is a real pleasure - but often there are corridors to fly; dont try and ignore these!

What I would really recommend, is flying into Tangiers, and making time to chat to the Ops guys there. They were incredibly helpful, spoke quite a lot of English, but mainly French, and told me really everything I needed to know about flying in the country. And, most important of all, the co-ordinates I needed to fly the corridors.

I hope to fly more in Morocco sometime, and wish you well!

CBG
9th Jul 2006, 07:50
Flew Morocco, Mauritania, Senegal, etc a few times. After getting all the ONC charts we found out they are pretty useless (hardly any navaids/zones in Africa). The michelin road map is much more useful and we've flying with this on subsequent trips.

Rans Flyer
9th Jul 2006, 08:12
I’m planning a microlight trip to Morocco next year.
What’s the best route over (or around) the Pyrenees (remember I’ll be flying low and slow without a transponder or oxygen).
I usually fly 2-hour (or less) legs, but I have got a 3.5-hour range. So I’m looking for a recommended French (start) and a Spanish (finish) airport.
Thanks in advance,
Les.
www.FlightForLife.co.uk

Leclairage
9th Jul 2006, 13:08
I usually fly Carcassonne - Reus or Valencia on this route - along the valley from Carcassonne then turn right at the coast and follow the coastline. Glorious flying.
There's a great VFR route around the back of Barcelona, and all ATC stations are really helpful.
If range is short, there's Perpignan, Gerona etc.

Just beware winds between Carcassonne and the coast - 50-60 knots not uncommon.

Good luck!

172driver
9th Jul 2006, 14:12
Have to agree with CBG, the ONC charts are pretty useless. The Morocco charts are next to impossible to get, you have to write to some office in Rabat (could also be Casablanca, can't remember) to get them mailed to you. No idea if that works. I've got copies (made on an architect's plan copier), were current last year, AFAIK they are still ok. Forget the usual pilot supply shops, they don't have 'em.

Landing in GMTT and getting a briefing is a good idea, Leclairage :ok: especially as you WILL need the coordinates of the VRPs/corridors. Once you have this, marking up a Michelin map might really be the best solution of all, as the 'official' charts aren't the greatest either.

Bellyfluffer, Aerodynamics in Malaga have them and will lend you a kit for your trip if you fly one of their a/c.

CBG, how did you get on with 100LL south of Morocco ? (assuming that's the favourite tipple of your a/c, of course ;) ) It's a trip I'd like to do, but have - so far - been informed, that there's no 100LL in Maurentania and only limited supply in Senegal.

Leclairage
9th Jul 2006, 17:13
Oops - forgot to add also that most airfields around there will not let you in without transponder. Can you get hold of one?
There are few airfields in Spain anyway, so those that there are tend to be major.

IO540
9th Jul 2006, 17:48
If you can fly with a Michelin road map then there's not a lot of point in asking on pprune :O Just don't try it in the UK, when you get the CAA "interview" after busting some controlled airspace and causing some ATCO to tear all his hair out.

Yes the ONC charts are of limited use but I did say as much. They show airports, navaids, terrain elevations. One then needs to get hold of some up to date aviation data to fill in the details and unfortunately this costs money. I am happy to print off some stuff from my Flitestar if anybody wants it - PM me if that is of some use.

172driver
9th Jul 2006, 18:54
Oops - forgot to add also that most airfields around there will not let you in without transponder. Can you get hold of one?
There are few airfields in Spain anyway, so those that there are tend to be major.

Rans,

Suggest you check out the transponder situation for Morocco also. AFAIK, there are no 'small' fields there, with the exception of two hotel strips near Erfud (that's near to the sand dunes of Erg Chebbi) and some military ones that aren't marked on any charts :E . I've only flown there with a transponder (in fact, IIRC, I've never flown w/o one...), so not sure if you can get in w/o.

Leclairage, there are actually a lot more strips in Spain than meet the (Jepp) eye, most small ones are microlight fields. I am not familiar with the requirements / limitations for micros, but Rans Flyer may actually be in luck. How you transit the LEBB corridor w/o transponder I know not, however...

CBG
9th Jul 2006, 19:13
RE Fuel south of Morrocco. They had fuel in La Ayoune but we had to arrange for 800 liters of avgas to be delivered to Atar. "Funny" thing is that Atar was the only place where we had armed guards for the planes (5 DR400/HR100).....it's also the only place where it appears we had fuel syphonned off!

Then onto Mopti where they had fuel too (but we got done for the landing fees), Ouaga, St Louis and all the other airports were OK with fuel (but they knew we were coming). With regards to navigation,all the aircrafts had the small Garmin Pilot III GPS - don't do Africa without one (unless you are flying the aeropostale route down the coast).

Rans Flyer
9th Jul 2006, 22:37
Thanks guys, so far the information has been great.

It looks like the only way to do the trip is to fit a microwave oven with no door (otherwise known as a transponder) to the Rans. I’m worried though. With only a Dacron cloth covering between me and the aerial, it might will be me doing the squawking!

Does anyone have a list of Spanish (and French) microlight fields (or have them in a Jeppesen FliteStar / MemoryMap / Garmin / Lowrance waypoint file).

:ok:
Les.
www.FlightForLife.co.uk

selfin
10th Jul 2006, 04:18
https://164.214.2.62/products/digitalaero/index.cfm (En Route charts, left side)

Puts you here: https://164.214.2.62/products/digitalaero/charts.cfm (scroll down for the areas.)

Africa here: https://164.214.2.62/products/digitalaero/terminals/enroutelist.cfm?charttype=enroutechartscur&country=afr

172driver
10th Jul 2006, 07:48
Selfin,

while this is a great resource :D , it doesn't give you the VFR charts discussed in this thread. These are the ones that are almost impossible to come by.

CBG

Thanks - will start flight planning :ok:

172driver
10th Jul 2006, 07:53
Rans

Here

http://www.aviacionulm.com/menu.html

go to 'Aerodromos' in the left hand column which in turn gets you to a clickable map of Spain. Click the region you want, this opens a list of airfields with coordinates and runway info.

172driver
10th Jul 2006, 12:35
Mods just noticed the threads have been merged, but wouldn't the original title of the older thread be better ? I.e. 'Planning a trip to Mororcco' ? After all the thread is about flightplanning in those parts, microlight or 172 heavy ;) makes no difference.


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