Mitsubishi MU-2

[Confabulous]

I've heard good and bad things about the MU-2, but mainly bad things. It seems to be used more and more for private flying and air taxi ops, has anyone ever flown one? It's on my shopping list once the lottery winning come up :}

One accident report stated that the pilot, who was very new to the aircraft, yanked the throttles to idle at 6000ft. Unfortunately he pulled them back a BIT too far and the prop pitch went flat - one slightly before the other. The consequence was that the aircraft snaprolled so hard that a tiptank was ripped off the wing - calculations showed that the roll rate would have to be about 210 degrees per second for that to happen :uhoh: Splash one MU-2 and pilot.

Other delights include an interesting spin mode (not that it's cleared, but was accidentally found by a fellow prooner during a flight test) which needed assymetric power to recover from :ooh:

All that said, it's a stunning machine when properly rigged, and I'm wondering if anyone has any opinions about it?

[IO540]

A lot of these run in the USA, so Usenet (rec.aviation.*) is the place to ask. I would start with rec.aviation.owning.

I think the answers will be that the pilot should receive type specific training, which is not exactly suprising for a twin turboprop.

[Ag2A320]

Confabulous,

Flight idle prop pitch is supposed to be 12 degrees, the only time the blades go flat to zero pitch in flight :eek: is if the Pilot moves the powerlevers over the gate into Beta mode- a very big no-no!!!!!!! on any fixed-shaft turbine engine. On the TPE-331 series - many BAD things can happen as a result of going into beta in flight: engine overspeed, blanketing of airflow over the wings and my favourite: one engine comes out of beta before the other, and the aircraft snap rolls into terra-firma as the crews of a CASA 212 as well as NASCAR racer/pilot in his Merlin IIB all found out with tragic results.

That Mu-2 that RodtheSod spun and recovered, i believe had insidious problems causing a subtle powerloss on one engine and therefore was in effect "windmilling" creating just enough power not to trip the NTS but not enough to produce zero thrust (As torque output is also a function of blade angle) hence the spin during the stall sequence(As was later found by Garrett PHX) and the need for assymetric power to recover. He was very lucky that he had significant aerobatic skill.

Known of a couple Mu-2s being spun without needing assymetrical power to recover and using standard spin recovery technique, but then again this was being done for giggles over the Gulf of Mexico by ex -fighter jocks bored with drone controlling on a USAF contract, engaging in mock ACM before recovering to Tyndall AFB.

Ok! so its not approved, but US military and their contractors march to their own tune. Vagely remeber spinning a T-42 Baron during my init multi training course at Cairns AAF handle pretty well, I havent personally spun a MU-2 but have lost both engines in flight twice!!!!!!

Once after shuting down and securing the left Engine during an NTS testflight, the right engine flamedout :eek::mad: my trainee in the left seat had the bright idea :ugh:to SEE what would happen if he turned the left fuel solenoid-valve off, he didnt look, confirm or announce his bright idea and prompty shut the right valve off :mad::mad:, I had my head down filling out the flight testcard :hmm: Know this both engines can be air-started simultaineously!!!, The second occasion was wamy of mechanical failure, my faulty troubleshooting ( differences in systems between J,L and -60 longbodys) and stupidity ( which i'm still in therapy for :E) but i am ever so gratefull for the gut feeling i had to conduct the air test over the airfield at 8000; (much to the humbug of TWR and APRCH controllers) instead of 20 -40 nm away as was my standard practise, after that fiasco, no more airtests with both engines fresh off the teststand that i hadnt personally seen run the full profile on testcell first.

Still a good airplane, would buy one in a heartbeat

[Piltdown Man]

Nasty machines! With my lottery winnings, if I had to buy a turboprop (money would be better spent on a glider), I'd buy a TBM 700, Turbine Malibu, Cessna Conquest or a King Air. There are too many poeple who are no longer with us due to this aircraft's unpleasant and interesting habits.

[Tuned In]

Read a test report in a magazine recently, which also looked at various views of the accident record. Basically came out that this performs like a low-end jet, and requires flying like a low-end jet and therefore the training of a low-end jet pilot.

Problems are all caused by people persistently treating it like something it is not, a basic twin. For example PPL holders who win the lottery! It is not a TBM700 or a Malibu Meridian, it is a considerably more difficult aircraft to fly correctly. The root of the problem is probably in the US, where it can be flown on an MEL rating. It needs a type rating, as it has in Europe. As a professional pilot I'd like to have a go of one, starting out with an instructor in the right seat!

[Confabulous]

It needs a type rating, as it has in Europe.

Really? That's a step in the right direction. :ok:

Piltdown, the aircraft has no nasty habits, it just requires proper training. It has quirks, like assymetric flap is used for roll trim, and a spoiler hanging in the breeze won't help your single engine rate of climb.

The FAA did two reviews of the MU-2, the most recent in October 2005, both concluded it was safe as long as the pilot is properly trained, which can be said for most high performance aircraft. Even the TBM700 had a nasty history of torque rolling problems - I see they've flat rated the new ones, crafty buggers.

Seem to be a fair few low level accidents in the Moo, something to do with phantom fire warnings? The King Air had that problem as well, not related though.

but have lost both engines in flight twice!!!!!!

Things must have gone fairly quiet for a minute or two :E

Handy to be able to start both engines at the same time though. I've only stuck my head in the cockpit of one so far but it's a very technical beast from what I see.

Have to admit I'll buy one like a shot once I have the money, but I'll take an experienced Moo pilot with me for the first 20 hours after the TR!

[fltcom]

I too would buy one if I had the readies. Impressive performance both high and low speed. Can even be operated on grass due to it's incredibly rugged undercarriage design. Also has fewer AD's that almost any comparable type. Undervalued for a long time due to high fatality rate, but usually down to lack of training on type. The only really negative aspect is that they tend to collect ice easily.

Flt..

[Ag2A320]

They have one of the best handling charateristics of Any GA twin during icing conditions as found during the Ice tests flown behind NASA's KC-135 icing tanker , as required during the FAA Special Cert review. That the aircraft collects ice is a Fallacy, as a Mits PIC i'm required to watch the Icing video every two years in order to fly in conditions of Known or Forecasted Icing. I have flown in harsh winter on both the Midwest, East coast and Canadian Maritimes which the airplane performed flawless during icing condition. But most Ga aircraft arent certd for flight into freezing rain and it is now known that Wx can quickly worsen in icing conditions and one must be very aware of this in any aircraft.

Confab if you ever do buy one pm me i'll sit the right seat no charge! but i suspect it might be closer to 30-50hrs to feel comfortable. At the 135 outfit i flew with years ago New upgrade captains were required to fly aleast the first 30hrs solo to a) build confidence B) appreciate the co-pilot and C) learn to effectively use the autopilot and manage workload & the airplane. it was the bosses rule, he didnt care if you had 150 of SIC time in Mu-2, once you got in the left seat u better be switched on and not form the ass! but the instructors and check airman was very thorough, we had incidents but no accidents or any fatalities in our Mu-2 ops.

[Confabulous]

if you ever do buy one pm me i'll sit the right seat no charge!

Appreciate it, it'll be good to have someone around who knows what they're doing! 30-50 hours sounds like a better target. It'll be a couple of years yet but I will get one, but it'll have to sleep with a microlight in the hangar :ooh: Surprising how (relatively) cheap they are, maybe it's good for them to have a bad rep :E