Twin Engine Piston Pilot

[727Man]

Anyone got any idea about salary for a twin engine piston charter pilot?

[eyeinthesky]

Don't know about salary, but freelance rates seem to be £100-£150 per day.

[On speed on profile]

If you are lucky: £20,000 + Benefits.

If you frelance: £100 - £140 (incl benefits) per day

If your not lucky or just on average salaray: £15,000 - £20,000 INCL Benefits

It depends on the employer, the contracts they fly, how many hours you will fly and your experience.

If they ask you in an interview, push for the low twenties. If you are good enough you will get it! :ok:

OSOP

[buzzc152]

In my (limited) experience, £20-25k seems about average............... though there are a few who pay a good deal less.

[727Man]

ok thank you to all who replied now I have an idea of what to ask for!

[Mr Wonka]

Also remember dont pay for your own training. It really isnt worth it. If it where a multi crew jet aircraft, counting towards unfreezing your atpl, then okay.

I was paid 28 000 euro plus pension and medical and training too, for a single crew operation.

Best of luck

Mr W

[Send Clowns]

My pay will work out around £20-25,000 a year, depending on how busy I am and if I take any holiday. I have a small retainer and pay when I fly.

[the goon]

A mate used to fly for a wee charter company up north and he had to pay for his training, got no wages while doing so, also paid for his OPC/LPC:} , he got £15,000pa as a retainer and £15/hour flight pay.

[Mr Wonka]

:confused:

Ouch !

Heard of companies driving a hard bargin, but this is a tough one to beat. But I guess when you need a job you have to take what you can, did'nt know ryanair where in the charter business. :D

Mr W

[MrMutra]

Good one mr wonka, very funny :=

:ok:

[Send Clowns]

Wonka

If you calculate that it really isn't bad! I look like flying about 600-650 hours a year, so the goon's mate can look to perhaps £24,000. Oop north that can go a fair way, and compares well with many FOs' starting salaries. Training is not very expensive if he's flying a piston twin, most can usually be on public-transport flights so you pay nothing, and there will be no type rating.

[Parson]

SC,

Is there much scope for doing this type of work on an ad-hoc basis, say 2-3 days/month?

P

[Oxeagle]

Hi guys,
This is exactly the kind of flying I am looking for for a first aviation position. Does anyone know of any companies who will accept low time CPL/ME pilots?

Cheers

[duir]

I am afraid that low hours people and commercial operations on light twins rarely go together. This is mainly due to the insurers whom usually require a pilot to have 700 hours min.

[duir]

I am afraid that low hours people and commercial operations on light twins rarely go together. This is mainly due to the insurers whom usually require a pilot to have 700 hours min particularly for single pilot stuff. Even some operators that fly single pilot aircraft (king air, 406 etc) as multi crew require 700 hours as I found out recently at the end of the interview, which up until that point it looked like I may have been offered the position............:{

[Oxeagle]

Ah ok, thanks for that duir. I wouldve thought that it would have been easier to start on light commercial twin ops, and then work upto larger aircraft but obviously not! :(

[duir]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings old bean and I am not saying all companies have the same policy. However in some respects I would say that flying a light piston twin single pilot IFR is potentially some of the most demanding and hazardous flying out there and these operators want experienced bods on the job. I would suggest getting into ANY flying job you can and building your experience. I went straight onto the FI course the day after the IR and started work a week after the licence arrived. I simply could not stand the idea of spending a couple of years on training and £50000 to not fly something for a living. After 5 months of full time FI I just had my first interview and looks like I will be getting another interview soon. This is due to having a flying job, several hundred hours, location and most important of all the the contacts I have made through instructing. Lets not be too mercenary about instructing either as it has improved me as a pilot 110% and it's superb fun and tres rewarding. I fully intend to keep instructing in the longterm and I feel it really is the best choice for a low houred pilot to improve.

[winch launch]

Out of those 700 hours, is there a minimum requirement reguaring IFR hours?
(Exept the ones to get the IR of course)

Thanks

Winch

[duir]

Can't speak for the rest but the company I recently had the interview with simply required 700 hrs total time with current CPL/IR. This may be different to others requirements due to the operation being multi crew on a single pilot aircraft.

[WX Man]

Out of those 700 hours, is there a minimum requirement reguaring IFR hours?
(Exept the ones to get the IR of course)
Thanks
Winch

I'm not quite sure about insurance companies, but I know that some companies' AOCs haven't been updated to reflect the change from CAA requirements (700h TT) to JAA requirements (400h TT).

CAA requirements for AOC holders are, I believe:

700 TT
400 PIC
100 ME
40 IFR ME

+ current IR
+ valid recurrent checks

THAT is why most air taxi companies won't be interested if you've got less than 700h. Ravenair is one of the only companies I believe who have the ability to employ a Commander on a Public Transport flight with <700h TT.

[winch launch]

I'm not quite sure about insurance companies, but I know CAA requirements for AOC holders are, I believe:
700 TT
400 PIC
100 ME
40 IFR ME
+ current IR
+ valid recurrent checks


Sorry but I am not quiet sure what AOC stands for.
Do you mean that to operate a single pilot IFR multi engine aircraft, I need 100 hrs multi?
Is this 700 hrs requirement for public transportation operations only (under OPS-1) or for air taxi too (Under GA rules)?

Thanx

Winch

[Dude~]

winch launch, can you confirm it is 100 hrs multi? I thought it was 100hrs IFR of which 40 must be IFR Multi engine.

Just wondering, still a few hours to get to that stage.

[buzzc152]

You'll find that different companies have been able to negotiate different requirements for their particular operation. Though 400 hrs TT including 40 hrs PIC in multi IFR is quite a common basic requirement. There are some (Scotland Air Charter springs to mind) that require just 700 hrs TT. Also there are plenty of small operations out there not on a AOC and so may not have any min requirements as such (I'm thinking of stuff like flying businessmen around in their private company twin, aerial survey work, ferrying etc)

Duir hits on a good point. It strikes me that in some respects the career route many of us end up following is all backwards, i.e going straight onto the the very demanding single pilot IFR ops where potential for cocks ups is high and then later moving on to airlines. Wouldn't it be more sensible to start off all low hours guys in the nice safe environment of a big jet in an aircraft that won't let you make any big mistakes and having the extra safety net of an experienced captain sitting next to you ?

Good luck

[Fair_Weather_Flyer]

I see what you are saying buzzc152. However, the reason that the 700hrs requirements plus all of the other fiddly bits exist is to prevent very low hour pilots from doing single pilot IFR. They are by no means starter jobs. Hence the reason that these jobs pay more than turboprop FO starter salaries and more than some jet jobs.

[rmcdonal]

700 TT
400 PIC
100 ME
40 IFR ME
+ current IR
That well get you a Single Engine Job in Aus. :ok: :}

[winch launch]

I am 15 hrs of multi IFR short :-(
Can I do the remaining in the US?

winch

[Dude~]

Winch launch:
Can I do the remaining in the US?

Of course you can, no where does it say that any of the hours have to be done in a particular country.

[On speed on profile]

CAA requirements for AOC holders are, I believe:

700 TT
400 PIC
100 ME
40 IFR ME

+ current IR
+ valid recurrent checks


This is a legal requirment, you can not fly public transport IFR without it. Cargo or Pax. There are no exceptions! The last one, I think is 40 M.E. P1. I believe the wording was, "100 IR of which 40 must be ME P1".
You may be able to make some of it up on line training possibly.

Aerial work is not subjected to this requirement.

[EGBKFLYER]

Can anyone post a link to a CAA document where the above requirements are stated?

[D'vay]

I'm back out to riverside in tulsa next week to build some hours before my ir. c-152 is about 40 an hour with no instructor, 172 is i believe about sixty and the duchess (multi, like your looking for) is only 100. as most multi's in this country are about 300 quid per hour you'll save money as you start your 3rd hour (as getting to tulsa is £400). Try calling their british owner on01992577707. If the number is edited out by the moderator, pm me.
winch, those fifteen hours would cost around 1500 in at rvs compared to almost 4500 here!

[Fair_Weather_Flyer]

those fifteen hours would cost around 1500 in at rvs compared to almost 4500 here!

Problem is though, you have to deal with all the TSA hassles and buy tickets and pay for accomodation, get checked out by an instructor (not P1 time) and will they let you solo the aircraft IFR? I doubt it! It's hard to see how anyone who has trained in the UK from the word go can get the required numbers together for single pilot IFR.

[D'vay]

Assuming that you do the 15 hours in two weeks you are looking at 144 pound for riversides own accomodation (based on £11 per night) you can enter the us on the visa waiver as you'll not be undergoing any training (this is only hours building right?) this is merely a flying holiday. Personally i cant see why the school would let you solo the duchess IFR if you pass a check ride and have the neccasary licences?
Best people to talk to on this matter are riverside themselves on the number above or try this link. Remembering that a great majority of thei students are british
http://www.riversideflightcenter.com/
regards
d'vay

[Snoop]

Try non AOC survey companies. They might take a low houred CPL/IR if they were desperate. Money will be crap though. There are plenty of potential candidates out there that would probably work for free in return for multi hours. I was lucky I got paid when we flew, and I had a quite busy season when I first started.

One word of caution. Even though I now have 1100 hours tt of which 400 is multi, I still can't get an interview with anybody. Could be 'cos I am in my mid 30's or that I can't pay for a type rating - not sure which!

Anyway best of luck any more info please pm me.

Snoop

[Send Clowns]

The 100 hours PIC IFR can often be worked around.

Parson

Sorry for the late reply. You might find there is some work like that around. Depends when exactly you are available, and where you are.

[WX Man]

Even though I now have 1100 hours tt of which 400 is multi, I still can't get an interview with anybody. Could be 'cos I am in my mid 30's or that I can't pay for a type rating - not sure which!
Anyway best of luck any more info please pm me.
Snoop

Who have you applied to?


Quote:
700 TT
400 PIC
100 ME
40 IFR ME
+ current IR
That well get you a Single Engine Job in Aus.

Ummmm. OK. So what would be the lowest experience that you could expect to get say, a regional turboprop job in Oz? And what would be the cut-off age for getting into one of the major airlines out there?

Getting pretty f*cking sick of this country and thinking about emigrating. NZ and Oz spring to mind.

[Dude~]

Even though I now have 1100 hours tt of which 400 is multi, I still can't get an interview with anybody.

Snoop, when you say 'anybody', do you mean jet operators, turboprop operators, or literally every single company in the Uk?

Just trying to work out why someone with your experience hasn't got a job as I know plenty of people who have moved onto turboprops with less total time and fewer mulit hours than you.