PA28R Systems Info

[TolTol]

Hi all.

Does anybody know any good websites where I can get information on a PA28R? The sort of information I'm looking for is:

- undercarriage system;
- aerials and antennas;
- airframe;

I just want a general description of the aircraft systems that a CPL examiner could ask.

I have looked at the POH but it doesn’t really give me enough of information.

Thanks in advance;)

[B2N2]

Can't find any good links right now.
But here it goes,

* Electric reversible hydraulic pump.
The gear switch is not a mechanical switch but an electric one.
Remember how you can make an electric motor run the other way if you switch the wires? If it's a DC motor that is :}
This hydraulic pump works the same.
9 (!) gear switches:
3 "green" light switches on the down locks.
3 up-limit switches that close when the gear is up, this will extinguish your IN TRANSIT light.
Anti retraction switch on left gear.
Gear warning switch in throttle quadrant.
Gear warning switch in flap-quadrant on 2nd notch.

Arrow's are generally older with probably several avionics changes during their life time.
Antenna's are really plane specific.Don't be surprised if you have a couple on your airplane that are not connected to anything.
Your instructor should know which one does what.
Airframe info is in the POH, ailerons and flaps are corrugated (spellcheck?) to increase strength without increasing weight.
Stall strips on the wingtips are mounted at a different angle then the ones at the root, they will disturb the airflow at a different angle of attack.

And OH....
The engine is off set to the right in it's mounts, this to counteract some of the left turning tendencies.
The vertical fin is mounted off set to the left for the same reasons.
And the rudder trim wheel is connected to your pedals, if it's not centered the plane will not taxi straight....:mad:

[Fergal20]

Thanks for the info. Whenever I ask my instructor what the antennas are for he tells me to find out! But I cant find out what they are for, its not in the poh and as you say, its type specific.

Anyway, if you do come across a website please let me know, I'm still searching:{

[Cusco]

Have you tried:
www.piperowners.com ?

Quite a few links there though I confess I haven't looked at them.

May be the place to start asking questions.

Safe flying

Cusco

P28R owner

Sorry I cant help with details.

[B2N2]

Ok let me see if I can do this from memory...:rolleyes:

The wire strung from the top of the cabin to the tail= ADF antenna
Antenna's on the tail= VOR
Two identical antenna's on top=VHF (radio 1&2)
Antenna's on the bottom;
Little sharkfins= DME and transponder
Protruding rod= older style transponder
Oval half inch thick= ADF antenna
Depending on equipment, GPS antenna's on top.
Here's a hint, antenna's are usually marked with the manufacturer's name so if you look on the instrument panel.
If an antenna says Garmin it's the GPS.

[AppleMacster]

In the Arrow I just flew for my CPL, the aerials were arranged:

Cockpit roof: chevron-shaped glideslope aerial
Towards back of cabin: VHF Radio aerials
Top of tail: VOR aerials (shaped in a V)
Undernearth, just behind nosewheel: Transponder (short with a ball on the end)
Underneath, just in front of wing: DME
Underneath, half way between wing and tail: ADF
Underneath, near tail, Marker

There seems to be quite a wide range of radio set-ups for Arrows, so don't take any of our descriptions as gospel for your particular aircraft.

My school provided me with a diagram of the aerial layout. The undercarriage and airframe are detailed in the POH as I recall. It's unlikely that the examiner would ask you anything that isn't in the POH.

AppleMacster

[TolTol]

Thanks for all the replies:ok:

[High Wing Drifter]

TolTol,

The Flight Manual/PoH does have all the Arrow specific technical information that the examiner can ask you. In addition, you must quote your school's approved checklist and operation procedures where they differ from the PoH as that checklist and ops manual is approved by the CAA for your school.

[TolTol]

HWD,

Thanks for the post but the POH doesnt have the answer to what my instructor has been asking, eg:

- colour/type of undercarriage oil
- where is the undercarriage pump located
- what each aerial is for (which the examiner always asks).

I understand that the instructor may go into more detail but he still expected me to know, but the POH doesnt say, especially with regard to the undercarriage.

Toltol

[High Wing Drifter]

TolTol,

Interesting. I was taught to fly them, not fix them :confused:

The aerials are generic and not specific to the Arrow. That's down to the make/model of avionics installed in your particualr aircraft. Although, the Arrow I did my test in has a GPS, I did not need to know or demonstrate any knowledge of it (I'm sure can hear IO540 gearing up in the background ;))

Anyhow, good luck with the test.

[Pronto]

On the last Piper type I flew (PA20-151) the transponder antenna was in a low drag fairing on the underside.

So far as the other questions - pumps and colour of the hydraulic oil - are concerned, have you thought about finding out which maintenance organisation looks after the aircraft and asking them? There should be some clues as to who they are in the aircraft documents.

P

[hugh flung_dung]

There's a good Piper-published sales-type book around which contains all the systems info but (unfortunately) some highly optimistic performance info. Dunno who sells it.

If you only need generic info, the systems are effectively the same as Seneca 1 (and several other Pipers) but this is obviously no good for answering a CAA examiner.

Typical systems questions might be: why did the designer choose to use flaps that create a slot when they're down, what type of ailerons (and why), what's the advantage of a stabilator, how is the gear held up, how does the emergency drop work, how does the auto drop mechanism work (and at what speed), what does the prop do without an oil supply, where do you find the list of servicing things that a pilot can do (change plugs? top-up undercarriage oil? etc), etc, etc

(TBH lots of this should have been covered on the type cvx and, by the time you've completed a CPL course, you really should know what the various aerials are for).

There's a CAA booklet giving suggested questions for examiners, it's probably on the website if you poke around.

HFD

[High Wing Drifter]

HFD,
...top-up undercarriage oil? etc)...
That's kind of my point, that's not an item you can fettle with so why would a CPL examiner ask it?

[hugh flung_dung]

HWD:
Agreed! That was a leading question based on the earlier question about type/colour of oil :O

HFD

[Zulu Alpha]

I think the question about the colour of the oil is so that you know where it has come from if you see a puddle under the aircraft. I must admit I don't know what colour it is

The Arrow hydraulic pump for the undercarriage is in the rear fuselage. You can take a peek if you remove the panel at the back of the luggage compartment...no tools are needed it has knurled nuts, you can also see the bit of the autopilot that moves the controls and the battery.

The pump pressurises the system to retract the gear and when the gear is retracted the pressure rises and activates a cut out switch. The emergency lowering lever just dumps the pressure and the wheels fall by gravity. The nosewheel will not decend all the way unless you slow the aircraft down. I was warned not to use the emergency lowering for practise without pulling the pump breaker on the panel. The problem is that the emergency lowering dumps the pressure so the cut out switch turns the pump on. This then means the pump is running all the time that you operate the emergency lowering. This can overheat the pump and/or wear it out.

I guess this is why they want you to know how the systems operate.

[High Wing Drifter]

I was warned not to use the emergency lowering for practise without pulling the pump breaker on the panel. The problem is that the emergency lowering dumps the pressure so the cut out switch turns the pump on
Exactly my point too; you'll find that advice in the Flight manual/PoH.

[BigEndBob]

www.fitaviation.com
Some good stuff on common trainers.

[Piltdown Man]

And as a point of etiquette TolTol, give your instructor a good smack! You pay him, he comes up with the goods! There are too many of these tossers about and we should encourage them to give a better service.