Multi Crew Pilots License and the future of the CPL instructor

[FlyingForFun]

There's been lots of discussion (ok then, a little bit of discussion) over recent months about the proposed Multi Crew Pilot License. But one subject which I don't recall being discussed is how this will affect the career of the CPL instructor.

I accept that the details of the proposed license are a long way from being finalised, but how do the CPL/IR instructors on this forum feel that the introduction of this license will affect their careers? I presume that most CPL/IR instructors have little, if any, multi-crew time. The options, as I see it, are:

1) CPL/IR instructors will be forced to fly for an airline to gain multi-crew experience. After that, they may be able to re-enter the training industry if they desire.

2) There will be some kind of conversion course which will allow existing instructors to teach for the new license.

3) The syllabus for the new license will include sufficient flying on piston aircraft that there will still be plenty of work for existing CPL/IR instructors

4) Most schools will not be able to afford to offer the course, and most candidates will not be able to afford to self-sponsor themselves through the course. Therefore, the existing CPL/IR will still be very much in demand, so no change in the jobs of most CPL/IR instructors.

Are there more options I've missed?

FFF
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[LFS]

Its a very difficult thing to comment on at the moment as there is still relatively little known about it. At the moment it is an ICAO proposition which would then be adapted by the JAA (or possibly EASA by then). It will still probably be a couple of years before we really see what it is going turn out like.

The impression being given is that it is being driven purely by the airlines. From what I can gather it will be a significantly more expensive route, most probably out of reach of the self sponsored student. I would imagine that it will but used exclusively for airline cadet schemes which could be a good thing for everyone as it will hopefully mean a wider return of sponsorship schemes, but there will still be a strong requirement for the traditional route (perhaps more modular than integrated).

As regards instructors, it is again quite difficult to say at this stage. I would imagine there would have to be some method of 'upgrading' current CPL/IR instructors to teach for a MPL as I can't believe there would ever be sufficient supply of ex-airline pilots to fulfil the training requirements. Certainly interesting times to come.

[RVR800]

It will reduce the training requiment in the GA sector as the MPL does not require the pilot to fly single crew except right at the start its then straight to Sim School (Ryanair?) for your multi-crew pilot training.... (There is no requirement to fly light single crew twins and the Multi-Crew Instrument Rating is done in the multi-crew environment

:O

As Dylan says the driver is the airline industry who expect Pilots with an initial AIRLINE pilots licence to have flown an airliner. (naive I know)

See

http://cat.texterity.com/cat/2005-4/?pg=11

Look to 2006 for some movement on this see...(page 21)

http://www.halldalemedia.co.uk/eats2004/woods.ppt

[BEagle]

The MPL proposal (scathingly termed 'Microsoft Pilot Licence' by some due to its reliance on simulators!) is not universally viewed with enthusiasm by airlines in Euroland.

Lufthansa, it seems, are all for it. Whereas the French are allegedly totally opposed to it.

My view is that the absolute minimum acceptable 'stick and rudder' skill level should be that required for the current CPL without IR, but with a MEP Class Rating. After that, they can do all their IR , multicrew and huggy-huggy CRM stuff in STDs, but must take the Type Rating Skill Test in the real aeroplane.

However, all this must be preceded by formal aptitude testing by an organisation independent of any specific airline. Only those who pass the aptitude testing should be permitted to take the MPL course; for all others the traditional system should remain in place.

The airlines have also woken up to the fact that few people will self-fund their MPL - and are wary of the cost that sourcing sufficient simulators and simulator instructors would bring.....so some are getting cold feet about the whole idea.

I can envisage a significant reduction in the number of Senecas droning around NDB holds on one engine etc; however, there MUST NOT be any reduction in basic piloting skills. Thus there should be a remaining demand for FIs although perhaps less so for the 'traditional' ME/IR qualified FI if there is sufficient take-up for the MPL.

As this will be a JAA (or possibly EASA) change, rather than a national change, as I understand it there won't be a UK Regulatory Impact Assessment.

I can't see some countries adopting the MPL and other not - otherwise we might see those who don't adopt the MPL refusing to allow airlines to operate in their airspace unless both pilots hold 'traditional' licences?

[covec]

What will happen to those of us who have the current JAR SPA MEPL IR & CPL? Will there be an affordable mechanism, compulsary or otherwise, to convert to a Multi-crew IR? [Assuming that you wish to fly for an airline one day].

[ATP_Al]

There already is a mechanism for converting your single pilot IR to a multi pilot one. It's called a multi pilot type rating course! When you pass a skill test on your first multi crew type you are issued with a multi-pilot IR, which is then renewed at each LPC (your single pilot IR will expire unless to renew it separately each year in a single pilot aeroplane).

Whether this is affordable or not depends on which airline you work for:ok:

Al

[FlyingForFun]

Thanks for all the input, guys.

As I said right at the start of the thread, it's very early days, and anything we discuss on here can't be much more than speculation, but it's useful to get others' views on the subject.

It seems that the majority view is that the cost of the new license will mean its take-up will be fairly low, restricted mainly to sponsored students, and that's got to be good news for existing CPL/IR instructors (and potential future CPL/IR instructors like me!)

FFF
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[AIRWAY]

Hi All,

Is there any more news regarding the above (MPL License)?

Regards

[RVR800]

This is the season when those that make their living by redefining FCL rules have 'port-and-wine-by-the-fire' meetings
in expensive 5* hotels with industry stakeholders (not pilots under training or members of the general public ) they then rewrite LASORS 05 into 06

On the table at the moment is an introduction of an accessible ICAO IR like the FAA-IR for UK PPLs cos the JAA IR has such a low take-up rate (20 per annum in the UK out of 60,000 PPL's) this is
being promoted by AOPA

The ICAO MPL is being rolled out in 2006 and these pilots will then be trained on a single engined light aircraft before being put into a airbus/737 sim. The reason for this is that some reckon that after having spent £loads on an AIRLINE pilots licence then one should have spent some time in an AIRLINER at the pointy end rather that spending £loads doing NDB holds in a 70s build light aircraft. (btw NDBs are being withdrawn all over the world - out of date)

http://cat.texterity.com/cat/2005-4/?pg=12

[CapedVulture]

Interesting topic this.

FFF
I`m in a similar situation and would like to know more.
I`m an unrestricted FI looking to possibly upgrade to MEP\IR instructing within a year or so. I am very interested to see what implications this MPL license would have on MEP\IR instruction?

I`m wondering whether it`s worth upgrading soon or holding off for a year or so to see what the impact would be. I`m guessing there will always be a need for MEP\IR instructors. They are certainly in demand at the moment.

Anyone else with more info on this topic?

Thanks