Should I become an ATCO?

[stringfellow hawke]

OK, OK, so every second message in this forum seems to be from aspiring ATCOs, but I've not been visiting PPRUNE for long, so please forgive me if I'm posting questions which have been asked a hundred times before.

I'm interested in changing my career to become an ATCO. I've got as far as reading a few books and looking at the NATS web site and I seem to meet the initial entry criteria. What I would like to know is all the kind of stuff that I guess you can only ask someone who's been through the system already, namely:

What is the initial 74 week training like? What does it involve?

Once complete, do you get any say over where you are posted? Ideally, I would like to come back up North to work at Manchester or Liverpool. Is this at all likely, or are the great majority of jobs in and around London? Do you get to request where you go?

Are the majority of jobs in area control and is this a better/worse option than aerodrome, or does it just depend on what floats your boat? Do most people (like me, from what I have seen so far) want to work in the tower?

Does anyone know if I can visit ATC at Liverpool or Manchester (my local airports)? Who do I contact?

What is the career like? Exciting, challenging, involving, routine, stable?

What are likely career paths for ATCOs?

Do NATS look after you in terms of pay and conditions? Are they a good employer?

The inevitable question - what are the salaries like? I understand that whilst training it's 22k, but what then?

I've read a fair bit of negative stuff about privatisation. What's likely to happen with that?

Any honest words of encouragement or discouragement would be gratefully accepted. Thanks in advance.

[No speed Restriction]

I'm sure we can sort a visit to manchester for ya ......

email me...

As for liverpool they are "RUN" by peel holdings (the trafford centre folk) so no chance of posting there unless ya leave NATS....

[eyeinthesky]

Wow, what a lot of questions, many of which will be answered for you by a trawl through the archives. However, my very brief tuppenceworth, taking your questions in order:

1) It is mainly based in the College of ATC at Bournemouth. It is modular and takes you through the Aerodrome Control, Radar Skills, Area Control theories, with so-called continual assessment all the way through. You get some on the job training interspersed with it, so you will go to an Aerodrome and an Area Control unit to get used to talking to real planes. You also get 15 hours' flying training to help understand that side of the equation. The College of Knowledge is not the end of the story, however. Once you finish there you are posted to a unit, where you have to validate your rating. At an Area unit such as LATCC/NERC this can take anything up to 3 years (1-1.5 years waiting and 1.5 years training) until you are a fully fledged ATCO.

2) You can express a preference but it will be usually ignored in favour of where you are needed. In most cases this will be London Control shortly to be at NERC.

3) Area control is VERY short of staff, so I think the majority get sent there. It is what I do and I don't think it would be right to comment on the Aerodrome bit. I think Area is great fun and challenging, but the pressure can get to some people.

4) Ring up and ask to speak to the ATC manager. Or post here with an email address and someone will probably get in contact with you. I would recommend visiting an ATC unit before you go for interview should you get that far.

5) Great career. Challenging and all that and generally stable, albeit with some concerns at present regarding the long-term effects of Privatisation. It is a job with instant results: you know straight away if you've made the wrong decision! You can never take it home with you, either.

6) You can choose to remain operational all your career if you wish. Or you can move into management. Depends on what lights your fire. Most people like the shift work because it gives them good time off, and the management ladder is not very well thought of.

7) Pay is generally good (see next answer for levels). All agreements are union-negotiated with the benefits and disadvantages that that brings. Pensions are a concern at the moment as we are suspicious of NATS' intentions post privatisation.

8) Once valid you move eventually onto normal ATCO pay (as opposed to the Training and Development scale you mention) and if you stay operational you rise up a scale annually to a maximum in excess of £57k, more if you get promoted to a higher grade.

9) Your guess is as good as anyone's.

Hope this helps. The only word of warning is do not underestimate the long haul you will have to get valid. Many people find the constant scrutiny while training very hard to handle and the wastage rate is quite high. If you manage it, though, it is a very rewarding and challenging job. We all moan as in any business, but very few actually get so fed up that they leave!

[Contact London 131.12]

EYEINTHESKY

HEADINTHECLOUDS more like

7) Pay is generally good!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You what? Are you mad? You seem to be the only person in NATS that thinks so! <img src="eek.gif" border="0"> <img src="eek.gif" border="0"> <img src="eek.gif" border="0">

[stringfellow hawke]

Hey Contact London 131.12, you leave EYE IN THE SKY alone. He/She was very helpful with that reply. Thanks EYE!

So go on then, what's wrong with the pay?

[eyeinthesky]

131.12: He/she was asking what the pay was like by reference to other jobs, I thought. In those terms £56k+ is pretty good. Within the industry, however, I'm with everyone else: crap.

Stringfellow: Consider the B747 Captain with a large national airline. He/she has the responsibility for making command decisions which will get him and his 400 or so pax safely from A to B in all weathers etc. He is also trained to cope with almost any emergency. In recognition of that responsibility he is well paid, reputedly up to about £100k all in. (This may be inflated but it is certainly in the high 5 figures.)

Now consider the ATCO at LATCC/NERC. He is controlling upwards of 15 of these aircraft at any one time, and is responsible for ensuring their safe passage through his own bit of airspace, while also keeping spare capacity to cope with any emergencies which may be declared. For this he is paid anything from £25k to £56k depending on how many years he has been there. Pay rises are unlikely this year so in real terms he takes a pay cut as traffic increases. Many would argue that the responsibility is at least commensurate with that of the aforementioned Captain, but the remuneration is not.

Perhaps that helps you understand why ATCOs moan about pay. Incidentally, it starts early as many Student ATCOs moan about pay. £22k to be a student is not bad!!


p.s. I was a HE last time I looked!

[Contact London 131.12]

LOL at Strinfellow Hawke, Cocky and not even on the books yet!!!!! I only picked him up on point 7 I agree the rest was goodish advice <img src="wink.gif" border="0">


I think you will find it's not even good pay outside of the industry for the responsibilities we have!!!!

[stringfellow hawke]

Perhaps I should try and find 60k to get an ATPL then...Anyone fancy lending me it?

[Zulu]

eyeinthesky - I think you'll find the days of the 100k+ skipper numbered...only a few BA guys with 30 years seniority and training captains to boot are earning that sort of money.
ATCOs at the top of the scale, certainly at LATCC, are earning more than any F/O, and equivalent to most Captains.
Added to which, you don't have to borrow 50k+ for your training, it is all paid for by NATS, and you're not even bonded!
Most crew have had their pay frozen this year, quite a few have had it cut, along with numerous others who have lost their job.
I don't think NATS have ever made an ATCO redundant, in the 'we've too many, you're laid off' sense.
I'd say ATCO pay is very good within the industry - albeit my experience is limited to LATCC. I'm sure an ATCO3 or equivalent at a small regional isn't on anything like that, but...they're not shifting 2,000,000 a/c a year...