alcohol smell and smoking in the cockpit

[GoAround-Flaps15]

Hi folks,

Like my college Fmc_apprentice I have recently begun my career as an airline pilot with the big Irish mob. Fmc_apprentice brought up the problems we encounter about smoking in the cockpit a few month a go.
This is still a serious and an ongoing issue, but what anxious me even more is the alcohol smell of some, especially senior captains on early shifts. The best you can do in Ryanair is shut up and keep your head down.
Pls let me know if there are more F / Os out there who suffer with the same problem and don’t know what to do, without open a tin of worms and get fired.

[woftam]

Wind-up alert.
First post.
;)

[AlphaGolfLima]

The kamikaze-way of problem-solving:

How about if YOU behave as if YOU were drunk ?
When some cabin crew member notices your behaviour
they'll also notice the smell.
But they'll soon realize that it is not you who smells a bit drunk :-)
Now you've delegated the problem to the cabin crew ;-)

Well, honestly: I would ask him/her to go sick because
"I think you don't look too well - are you sure that you're fine ?".
And depending on whether there'll be some kind of discussion or
not you can alternatively insinuate that it ultimately will be you
who doesn't feel good (in that situation).

On the other hand: what does your behaviour show if you decide to keep ignoring alcohol smell in the cockpit ?
Maybe inferiority and a lack of backbone ?

Just consider it a "test" for a moment - what if HE/SHE is testing
you and your reaction ?
So, go and tell him/her that you've smelled the alcohol and ask
whether you've passed that test :-)


regs

AGL

[Funnel Cloud]

GoAroundFLap15,

Flying for the same Irish as you, I really disagree with your post here. First of all I really don't understand why you have to shut up and keep your head down. As in any other company you have the possibility to take action if you think it's required.

Second of all I think you shouldn't try to sort it out on PPrune, are you sure you're a pilot and not a journalist? Have you tried talking about it to your colleages, other F/O's in the company?

Third, I don't know about your experience, but I have never had an alcohol-related experience within Ryanair and I really think you're creating a wrong impression by your post, like you fly with 'smelly' captains every week.

[Slides Armed]

You would never get into a car with a DRUNKEN DRIVER would you now?
so if it was really true about captains smelling of drink then why are you so irresponsible in letting a cpt get into the aircraft and fly with 5 crew members onboard and 189 pax sitting behind you?
And risking the lives of yourself and everyone onboard?

[ex-orange]

Reported to work after a particularly heavy weekend and was sent straight home....with a SEVERE reprimand - never did it again - caused major ructions.

Why don't you have a word with your bosses if you haven't got the guts to tackle your captains outright????:suspect:

[A-V-8R]

The Alcohol smell could or could not mean a person has been drinking.

Adult Onset Diabetes shows up gradually in older, usually heavier people.

Even though they have passed their last FAA exam, it is possible that the pancreas has slowed enough so they have diabetes.

If a diabetec consumes starches, they can ferment and form alcohol in the body. This is a well known problem for police who are stopping drunken drivers. In this country they have to discertain whether the drive is a diabetic or not.

It has also been the subject of many movies.

This is why we have to undergo the six month exam (at least for Captains in my country).

[18-Wheeler]

I haven't had a Captain try to smoke in the seat next to me yet, but I will not let them do it.

[Hoverman]

GoAround-Flaps15

The big Irish mob should do something fast when they read your post. What they should do is look at "my college", "we encounter about", "what anxious me", "without open" and "a tin of worms" then look to see what F/O they've hired whose first language isn't English, is probably German going by the syntax, phrasing and construction, and then get shot of him as soon as they possibly can.
Why would they want to employ someone who comes onto a public forum and slags off his company? If no F/O fits the description they know it's someone trying to cause trouble, possibly a journo.
Funny how your "college" Fmc_apprentice went very quiet when someone showed he was using two names to agree with himself damaging his company. Funny how he hasn't posted on the smoking topic since.
If you're genuinely employed by the big Irish mob naming your company on a public website would be bad at any time. When the press is whipping up fears about pilots under the influence of drink, it's disgusting. If you were sincere you could have asked for advice without naming your company.

This thread stinks of a put-up job to use Prune to cause trouble.
If you are genuinely employed by them, I hope they ID you kick you out.

[cat 3a]

Hoverman

dido

[Wing Commander Fowler]

Dido??? What's she got to do with it?

:8

[Boeing_NG_Driver]

HOVERMAN
Have not seen such an unnecessary hateful, racialism reply before. Reason enough to sign up with PPRUN to reply as well. The nationality of GA Flaps 15 does not matter, it is your personal guess he might be or not but has nothing to do with contents of the post. It’s sounds to me you feel personally attacked. Maybe he got some on a weak spot?
However it’s not new crews got caught with blood alcohol. Definitely it is a shame to have such pilots or crewmembers, but it happened in every country, even in moslem countries witch I know out of own experience. Out of many other posts, the politics in FR are obviously to control employees by fear. Bad enough to see so many negative posts about one airline. Question: are they all wrong? or what are the truth.

B737

[Hoverman]

"Racialism reply"?
Fool. My wife's German, that's how I know the syntax Germans use in English.

What a coincidence one new member whose first language isn't English registers to slag off his company and now a second new member whose first language isn't English registers to support him.
As I said before, this thread stinks just as the one FMC started stank.

[cavortingcheetah]

I dare say that the ability to work out a course of acyion in the crew room is a necessary requirement for progression to command:O

[Hahn]

Hey G/A!
Just let the other guy smoke, so you won´t smell the booze. Damn easy!

[Nassauman]

The actual booze events in the recent past involved BA (twice?), Lufthansa and Virgin Atlantic. One theory being developed here is that we haven't heard about Ryanair because the pilots are too scared to say anything.

Was it not passengers and in one case ,the media ,who brought about the police intervention in the actual incidents?. Not colleagues.

In that case, are the BA, LH and Virgin pilots also too scared to say anything or is it that they are happy to fly with boozy colleagues. Are Ryanair passengers too scared to say anything where B, Lufthansa and Virgin pax are made of sterner stuff?

None of the above IMHO.

All of the cases relate to crews overnighting away from home in a hotel. Ryanair does not roster overnights and crews return to base at the end of every duty. There is no overnight flying and life is relatively "normal".

I don't think this relates to any particular airline (or business) but to the nature of hotel nights away from home with a team of colleagues.

If the alleged Ryanair pilot who started this post has a problem with any Captain he should have reported him/her through the confidential system if he is afraid of colleagues negative reaction or to the IAA or police if he is afraid of Ryanair negative reaction .Although, I cannot believe that either colleagues or company would do anything other than take him seriously.



.....If he was serious...I think he is winding us up.

[Heliport]

GoAround-Flaps15 / Boeing_NG_Driver
(Please delete the username you're not using today.)

Your attempt to damage FR hasn't worked so well this time, has it?
Shrewd readers saw through your friend FMC's little game (under various usernames) last time although, it has to be conceded, you fooled many and one member (not a pilot) even decided to get involved by writing to the company on your behalf. :rolleyes: He hasn't joined in this time, so either he's not falling for the same trick twice, or he now gets out more.

Credit people with some intelligence. You can fool some people once, but they'd have to be really stupid to be fooled twice.

Heliport

[GrantT]

Nicely said Heliport, you could definitely smell a rat in FMC's smoking thread and i'm getting quite a similar odour here as well. :rolleyes:

[Jeffrey S]

Hi there,

student PPL here.

Ive been a member of this website for about 3 months and i have noticed that some weirdo's (i have been looking at past posts and came across a certain "ryanair pilot" from up north who got banged up for molesting (NDR:-( )) who i think have no role in the aviation industry at all, pop up now and then to "pretend" they are pilots.

can someone enlighten me on why people post such daft content like this twit?:mad:

why would anyone pretend that theyre something that theyre not?

why do they dream up these scenarios?

are they management/spies/journalists???
:suspect:

........and may i add..

if your serious about this,

as in any other job if you have any greivance, or your "captain" is doing these alleged things, you go to your superior. its common sense.

Pilot's have common sense.
But you already knew that, didnt you?:suspect:

[SLFguy]

Still waiting to find out what Dido did!



:confused:

[Just_Another_PPL]

She supplied the booze, isnt it obvious!

[tunalic2]

if its a serious post
then of course you just say You stink of booze could you explain why? if not , why don't you take the opportunity of a sudden stomach complaint and go home/hotel and sleep it off.If you don't like the person call the company if you hate the industry call the press.oh and post it on here!

If its a wind up then

Captain as you're pissed bagsy the TO and Landing

[BoeingMEL]

Go-around & flaps 15.... IF there is any truth in your posting
(and I am firmly in the cynics' camp), please note the following and never forget it:

YOU ARE PAID TO DO A JOB OF WORK. YOU HAVE CLEAR RESPONSIBILITIES, THE MOST IMPORTANT OF THESE IS TO ENSURE THE HIGHEST LEVELS OF FLIGHT SAFETY. IF YOU ARE "KEEPING YOUR HEAD DOWN" YOU ARE FAILING IN THE RESPONSIBILITIES FOR WHICH YOU ARE EXPRESSLY PAID AND WHICH YOU ARE CONTRACTED TO DISCHARGE. IF YOU CAN'T FIND A SOLUTION TO THIS ALLEGED SITUATION THEN MOL'S TEAM HAVE APPOINTED A NO-HOPER. bm

[waspie]

Are you guys seriously saying that some pilots have tried to smoke in the cockpits before. Ok it must have happened, but does it happen often?

[Slides Armed]

maybe smoking does happen but the idiot who started this topic is just making trouble for his/the airline and trying to destroy a good reputation and quality of its pilots and crew;)

[Jack The Lad]

My guess is that G/A Flaps 15 is one and the same as Boeing NG Driver, as Heliport has intimated. Easy for a Moderator to check both users IP's which are logged. I'd also venture a bit further and suggest that in all probability it's none other than FMC apprentice and his other chum too!

Assuming this theory were correct, what would that suggest?

One very malicious and dangerous individual with a huge axe to grind. IMHO, this idiot deserves a life ban from Prune at the very least. Better still, I'd like to see his head (his identity) delivered on a platter to MOL and let the FR justice machine sort him out.

Such posts in the current climate are reckless and highly damaging to the whole aviation business and every other professional crew member worldwide.

[Heliport]

Jack

I entirely agree with your sentiments (and personally think he/they deserve what he/they get if they really do work for FR) but these are anoymous forums. Pprune does not reveal identities behind usernames.

Malicious and dangerous?
Agreed, but tricks like this only work if people are daft enough to fall for them. There's a very prominent warning at the entrance to the forums pointing out in big red writing that posts may not be as genuine as they appear to be.

Look again at the previous thread here (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?threadid=100296)
167 posts and 23,263 hits?? Unbelievable!! :rolleyes:
I repeat, tricks like this only work if people are daft enough to fall for them. Well, a lot of people did. A few people made sensible posts, but they were largely ignored and, understandably, gave up.

[Alty Meter]

Heliport
I agree, but was he/they any more irresponsible than some of the pilots on the earlier troll thread who made smoking in the cockpit out to be a flight safety issue rather than anti-social behaviour? The passengers who posted can't be expected to know any better but the pilots have got no excuse.
The change in rules have come about because we know more about the health risks of passive smoking and there's been a change in attitude to smoking in the workplace not because there's any evidence that it's a danger to flight safety. People smoked in the cockpit for years and there's no evidence it ever caused an accident. Smoking has been banned for social reasons and as a non-smoker I'm pleased but it's not a flight safety issue.

[G-Foxtrot Oscar 69]

I am a bit non plussed here why a new fresh faced F/O would not know what to do. The element of if in doubt Speak up is covered in every HP&L exam from PPL to ATPL.

I accept commercial pressure and not making too many friends. The fear of being stuck as a 2 ring F/O for years or being pushed out of the company but in all realit if you flew with a drunk Cpt you would got no respect from your bosses or colleagues!

I guess a Journo does not need to pass HP&L!

[14FIVE785]

:( WHY SHOULD ANYONE ON THE FLIGHT DECK BE SMOKING WHEN HE (OR SHE) WOULD REPORT AND POSSIBLY HAVE ARRESTED, ANY WALK-ON FREIGHT DOWN THE BACK WHO DARED TO LIGHT UP IN THE CABIN OR BOGS???!!!:ok:

[Fropilot]

This problem is not exclusive to Ryanair, nor to Senior Captains. There are young and old drunken pilots everywhere and they should be kicked out.

[Getyer flaps out]

Found this thread interesting as I have just passed interview for Ryan TRSS F/O scheme and I am STILL thrilled at the potential chance to join Ryan despite the scaremongering by Go around Flaps 15 AKA boeing driver aka FMS apprentice and no doubt others.

On a serious note - drunk on duty - pi:mad: d up captains?, I just do not believe they would allow their extremely hard fought reputation to be flagrantly abused and potentially jeopardised in this way.

there was talk in our group interview about the contingency to deal with a hull loss should, (God forbid), it ever happen and how it would effect the business.
Whilst, obviously, there is no defined answer to that, if something like this was to happen due to Ryan flight deck crew being pi:mad: d, do you think this scenario could have a positive impact, increase Ryans sales or public perception?.

I just cannot be convinced somebody as astute as MOL who, rightly or wrongly in your opinion, has put so much of his life, energy and acumen into making Ryan the phenomenon it is would allow all that to be threatened by such negligence from any line pilot, even less likely, allow a culture to develop, ala BA

My guess is they would be on a 'free' one way ticket out of Ryan.

I would not fly with a drunk colleague even if it meant my job and a huge debt, (which I don't think it would), rather that than have 'inexperienced spinless F/O who failed to act" along with the blood of 189 pax on my epitaph.

On a lighter note (no pun intended) - smoking - ....... I don't know if it happens, what the law or company regs are. I hope it doesn't, but if it is allowed then you just get on with it and don't whinge, you certainly don't come on a public site and bite the hand that feeds. I was taught that ' you have to lick ar$e before you can kick it', the captains earned his stripes, so you simply keep your head down, keep your nose clean.... and.... (tongue in cheek, from here on in)

passively smoke the low cost way?.

You accept your captains generous offer of free smoke on all flights ... and... they also pay all the government taxes and charges!!

you then use the money you've saved to buy some soap, wash your clothes and hair a few times,

suddenly you awake one day, 3 years later, and you find yourself in the privilaged left seat as a captain of STILL the largest low cost carrier in Europe... and...

the largest scheduled carrier in the UK??

(Yes.. Mr Eddington, you can beg to differ, but those are Ryans plans for future shape and size),

(I hear what you say Mr. Webster, that whilst your in charge of the competition..... it certainly won't be Easy)

all of a sudden,

"hey presto....."

the fags have completely disappeared and every sector you fly is now non-smoking.......

magic?

No.... common sense

[Smedley]

I'm not a smoker myself, but I have no objection to smoking in the cockpit, unless of course it is from electical equipment.

It's a demanding habit, and smokers who are denied this are like basket cases after a few hours. I've seen this in my crews. They become useless.

I'd rather have a real crew with me.