1st cross water flight (Dublin - Isle of Man)

[genius-747]

Hello,

As a PPL with aprox 100hrs TT, I will be doing my 1st cross water flight shortly with an instructer to get signed off as competent do make international flights.

I will be flying from Dublin (EIDW) to the Isle of man (IOM) VFR.

I would appreciate it very much if any body had any tips, hints, suggestions what way to do it, what to expect with UK R/T and any information on how the UK ATC differ from Irish ATC etc..

Basically any stories or information on flying from Ireland to the UK in a light aircraft, the do;s and dont's!!

Any help greatly appreciated.

[Romeo Romeo]

I've flown the other way (from Caernarfon, where I landed for fuel, to Weston). The things of note are:-

1) When going from the UK to Ireland I had to inform Special Branch to comply with the Pretension of Terrorism act and also they informed customs. I've no idea what the law is from Dublin to the Isle of Man, but no doubt your instructor will know.

2) The accent of the ATC who I talked to really threw me to start off with. There was a huge amount of 'Say again'ing going on.

3) Local knowledge is really useful. I rang up the airfield before departure from the UK to check with an instructor what I should and shouldn't do and what to expect. I did the same when I left Weston to find out the technique to avoid the military zones.

The main tip is to enjoy it! The aeroplane will fly the same in any country - and that, rather than a bit of naff RT or dodgy circuits, is the bit that will kill you!

[Dewdrop]

I Live on the Island and fly everywhere over water, just make sure you pay full attention to safety (life jackets and dingy) other then that just enjoy, nothing high to hit !

[PushingTin111]

hey genius-747,

I work in dub atc. As you probably know we get to talk to a lot of you guys out of weston. I'm just wondering what kind of routing you prefer, ie west and north of dublin control zone, clear of controlled or out along the liffey not above 1500' till we can get you higher and then up towards the island?

We get a lot out of weston goin that way. Which is prefered?

By the way, what do you think of the info service from dub. I hope you can appreciate were kinda busy sometimes with the line stuff and we tend to forget you guys. Forgive us!!! Especially busy this summer.

Quick tip........if you hear were busy, just remain clear of controlled until you can get a word in. Sometimes it's really off putting when you get a real slow one when it's busy. I know you guys in weston appreciate that but some are just unbelieveable.

[dublinpilot]

Hi PT3,

Well I don't do much cross water trip! (Still waiting to get a cross water checkout). Anyway, I did do a trip to the IOM during my ppl training, and our (read my instructors ;) )prefered route was keeping west and north of controlled a/s. Main reason, and I have to agree with him, was that it significantly shortened the cross water part of the flight.

Having said that, if the destination ment that the two different routes resulted in a similar cross water leg, then I'd tend to prefer the one out along the River Liffey. It's quite nice to see Dublin city from 1500'. I've flown out this route a couple of times just to Dublin bay, and back to Weston, to show some pax the city, and am always grateful to get cleared on this route!

As for the FIS, yes you do sometimes forget about us! Still, we do know you are busy, and tend to expect that you'll forget anyway, so it's not really a big deal for anyone who is used to it!

Keep up the good work!

dp

ps. check you pm's

[Horsepower]

PT3,

Of course, there was a time when we could fly direct from DUB but things have changed since we were effectively turfed out. :mad:

[dublinpilot]

Horsepower,

In fairness, that's hardly Pt3's fault.

dp

[Horsepower]

I never suggested it was PT3's fault.

[DFC]

Things to take note of when completing an internationsl flight;

Read the relevant parts of the AIP....the UK AIP in this case. Alternatively, read an amended up to date flight guide.

Things to remember;

Life jackets and how to use them. Remember to ensure that everyone wears one and is briefed on how to use it.

Life raft and how to use it. How to right it. How to get into it from the water. Make someone the person in charge of getting it out in an emergency. Brief all occupants on how to deploy the raft.

ELT if you can get your hands on one.

If you fly a Cessna, remember that when in the water, you are going to have to flood the cabin in order to get out. Consider the sequence of evacuation for any aircraft. Do the rear seat pax know how to release the front seat in a Piper?

What is the sea surface temperature......decides on how quickly you die after a ditching unless you get into a life raft.....slowly or quickly!!

For further info, read CAA Safety Sense Leaflet 21 which is available at;

http://www.caa.co.uk/srg/general_aviation/document.asp?groupid=231

You may also find some of the other leaflets useful.

As to the Isle of Man....Read the AIP for the exact up-to date details of Special Branch and Mandatory Handling.

The Isle of Man is in Class D airspace.....revise what services are available and who is separated from who. Remember that if you get traffic information on an IFR flight, it is up to YOU to separate yourself as you see fit in class D not ATC.

Try to do some instrument brush-up before the trip......sea merging with sky when flying into late afternoon sun can be just as bad as flying in cloud.

On the trip get as high as possible since this gives you time should something happen and improves communication.

Select 121.5 on the spare radio. If you don't get a reply to a MAYDAY on the normal frequency, jump straight to the spare radio and get the UK Distress Service looking for you.

That should give you some light topics to cover :)

As to flying up the liffey when going to the Isle of Man.....never a serious option because;

a) 1500ft QNH or even 1700ft QNH is illegal in a single engine aircraft because it can't glide clear of the built up area from that height. (The Phoenix Park is within the congested area).

b) In a twin, having reached the chimneys at 1700ft, I would not expect any further climb until well north of the approach to 28 i.e. somewhere between liffy int and lambay island......not good.

c) All departures from Weston are required to route initially to Maynooth regardless. Far simpler to fly round the zone and intercept the radial from DUB somewhere NE of Balbriggan. Chances are that ATC will give higher once north of Dunshaughlin possibly with a more direct route. A much simpler. legal and safer route.

:ok:

Regards,

DFC

[dublinpilot]

Sorry Horse power,

I mis-understood your comment.

dp

[genius-747]

Hey guys thanks for all the replies. Really some good info.

I didnt realise there was so many PPRUNEers from the Dublin area with so much local knowledge!! good to know.

Any how, I actually fly out of EIDW not EIWT but I done my PPL training from Weston so I know the area well also.

The trip to the Isle of Man was great. Dublin ATC were very busy on our departure and I was holding for close to 30mins on Echo 5 waiting to get onto Rwy 10. But once airborne and after an early left turn out to the DUB VOR, ATC cleared us right up to FL35, our requested cruising alt, and then direct to BOYNE and on to IOM.

Our return trip was the exact same route inverted, and we cruised at FL45, flight time back with a bit of a tail wind pushing us along was about 50mins!

Lovely short trip once you have a few sterling in your pocket!