Rwy 23 at LHR

[Double Hush]

As SLF the other day, I got a good look down Rwy 23 at LHR and am curious as to when it might be used, especially as the over-run doesn't look terribly inviting. Anyone out there able to enlighten a nosey non-truckie?

[Over+Out]

Its used a couple of times a year when there are very strong South Westerly winds, especially when the runway is wet. It has no ILS, so SRA (radar to visual) approaches only. The landing rate is much lower, so there will always be delays when runway 23 is in use.

[point5]

R/w 23 is out of use well into 2004! They will shortly be starting work to create a new apron for remote stands capable of takin a couple of B744 opposite the old Delta's, close to the 27L holding area.

Cheers!

[Jerricho]

Rwy 23 becomes promulgated when the cross wind component on the main runways exceeds 25kts, and as O+O said, we use SRA's to 2 miles or visuals, which really can stuff up the landing rate (tied in with the fact the strong headwind makes them go backwards down the approach). Of course, some jets may still want to land on the main runways (23 is about 1960 metres long, and some of the big stuff may want longer!!), which can make life a little more interesting.

Stuff can depart from it (somebody correct me if I'm wrong, something about MTOW 25000kg max etc....), although I'm sure some of the more experienced guys and gals out there could relate a story or two.

point5, are you the long lost relation of the esteemed Point 7?

[GT3]

think they have to be prop jobs to mate! 7 is meant to be in work at the moment - unless ive got it wrong ;)

[Gonzo]

esteemed?????????

[Max Angle]

What genius decided to put 23 out of use over the winter which is about the only time it gets used?. Surely summer would have been a better bet.

[Double Hush]

Thanks for the gen.

[fast cruiser]

Max Angle

Thats a very good point!!!

Anyone care to comment who make the decision's

200/45kts gust 55kts STN here we come!!!

cheers

fc

[Jerricho]

Oh Gonzo, I ain't even going to bother

[Gonzo]

23 is out of use at the moment not only due to the new stands, but the work going on in 77o. And soon, the top three stories of our new tower building are going to be built just south of the Royal Suite, which will prevent 23 ops I believe.

[Golf Charlie Charlie]

And to think that Heathrow was originally built with six runways (twelve including reciprocals).... And we talk about a runway shortage in the southeast.

[Gonzo]

Yeah...third runway at Heathrow? Na, they're just moving it!

[Mark Lewis]

So will RWY23 ever be used again then?

[Gonzo]

I doubt it.

BAA have over the past ten years increased the notice we need to give them for it to be promulgated. If 23 is in operation, it's hassle all round. BAA would rather not have to deal with that hassle. And to be honest we are so busy, and 23 slows us down so much, that delays go through the roof. I've been at Heathrow for four and a half years. I've never seen it in use. (I should have seen it twice in that period, but both times I was on leave) On average we use it for one day a year, if that.

[Double Hush]

I take it from what's been said so far that Rwy 05 doesn't exist? Or at least is non-operational?

[Gonzo]

05 became disused ages ago.

Remember lads, the disused runway 05 is closed!

Sorry, in-joke.

[Fokkerwokker]

I remember landing my Trimoth on it a number of times in the 70s and 80s. Always looked a tad 'aircraft carrier' like from the flight deck as I recall.

Secret of putting it on accurately was to monitor the F/E's lower rear end orifice cycling 'half a crown/sixpence' and then flare when it went to full dilate mode.

Actually, in truth, DLC made it a bit of a non event.

[Golf Charlie Charlie]

<<<
05 became disused ages ago.
>>>

Good thing it was open for the BOAC 707 for its on-fire crash-landing in 1968.

[Scottie Dog]

Gonzo

You will have to forgive a Northern for asking this question, but you make mention of 'our new tower buidling'. Seems a very silly place to put a new VCR?

I'm sure you will give me an answer - and tell me I'm a silly sod and that you were not actually refering to a VCR!

Cheers

[BLK 33]

Well Scottie - not a silly question but........

It's true what Gonzo says, a 600 ton section of the new VCR will be constructed beyond the end of 23, behind the 450 stands. However, what isn't mentioned is that on completion it will be transported to its permanent location, just North of stand 365 in T3. There it will wobble around for years to come. That's the theory anyway.

As regards 23, I think you can say goodbye to it forever. Not only are new stands being built near the 27L hold, but new ones will also be built near the Virgin hangar. Furthermore I heard a rumour that in the near-ish future new pavement is to be constructed from the 23 blastpad round to the 27R blastpad to give another line-up option for the latter. I believe also mooted are stands parallel to the 150s, bang in the middle of 23.

Add to this the chaos caused to BA's operations when 23 is promulgated in (a) T4 - to clear the eight stands at the end of 23 and (b) T1 - where the 150 stands have to be restricted to 767 size a/c, then I think its days are severely numbered. I believe the beancounters in BA have deemed that they they would rather have a/c divert all over the place on the few occasions it happens than put up with the bloodbath that ensues when the loss of remote parking snarls up a (mostly) finely tuned operation.

Whilst it is sad from a safety point of view that the accountants rule the roost, Heathrow is now run flat out and using 23 only makes it exceedingly difficult to keep the thing on an even keel.

The only things preventing BAA/HAL from saying that 23 is no more are the political/PR issues if the government announces another runway is to be built at the airport.:rolleyes:

[Mark Lewis]

BLK33, a couple of questions: How do you "move" a tower? And what will happen to the old (current) tower when the new one is in place? Also what is the timescale (Well supposed anyway!) for this building work?

[Gonzo]

Slowly............five hours to cross the runway to the central area. The idea is to move the three storey VCR to its fianl resting place, and then hoist it up every so often and build it up to its fianl height.

Old tower will remain in place, and will be our contingency.

[woodpecker]

230/65 G75 and the gripper (Trident) stopped in 600M, but that was in the days when it was called 23L.

Also landed on 23R (so old) with the threshold just a few metres from the entrance to the two tunnels

[Mark Lewis]

Thanks Gonzo, sounds like fun! When is this due to take place?

[Gonzo]

No idea. Overnight at some point. Maybe in 2005? I'm sure we were told at our last meeting, but I wasn't paying attention, obviously!

I remember there being talk that we may have a party that night in the tower, as we watch the tower being dragged across the runway, and see how much the BAA reps sweat and pray that something doesn't break while 600tons of steel and glass are bang on the centreline of 27L.