Ooops, missed that call...!

[Dude~]

Imagine the scenario, you are receiving an FIS, and you are busy navigating and looking after your pax, when suddenly you pick up a narky call asking where you've been as you'vve missed two calls and they've been trying to raise you.

So how do you get out of that one?

(This is purely hypothetical of course...!!)

[Keef]

Apologise profusely! I think we've all done it - turn down the volume cos of all the chat, then forget to turn it up again.

[buzzc152]

This works for me :........

'Sorry, I was on the land line'

[Genghis the Engineer]

"Apologies, distracted by a navigation task, please say again".

G

[BRL]

"Aaarr Eeehhh, sorry 'bout dat Liverpool tower but our Brittany just threw up all over our Chantelle and our Kylie wont stop crying......! :D :D

[Dufwer]

I had a simliar situation not too long ago, but a bit closer to home. I was in the circuit doing downwind checks and I missed the call from ATC instructing an orbit. My excuse is that I was new to the aircraft and was trying to figure out if fuel pump on was switch up or down. Didn't tell the controller that. Just said "G-xx go ahead" The tower had a distinct "yoohoo are you there" tone. Embarrassing, dangerous, poor airmanship, etc. Live and learn.

D

[mad_jock]

If its a FIS just humour them.

If they can't be arsed telling you about traffic if they are feeding there faces. So what if you miss the calls AS LONG AS you keep a fecking good look out.

I am may be getting bitter a twisted due to the local service in my Area (lossie) but they don't give you jack unless they want to move you in class G to make their life easier with IFR traffic.

So just follow the rule book and don't worry about it. BUT KEEP A BLOODY GOOD LOOK OUT.

MJ

[witchdoctor]

"Sorry, I was ....err...... chasing a baloon"

(yes I include the man in a basket variety there too.) :O

[Maxflyer]

Aviate, Navigate, Communicate... Tell them that they are number three on your list of things to concentrate on. So you'll get back to them shortly - if only!

I had this happen recently and I just apologised, didn't seem a lot else to do. I did learn from it though. Now I make sure my pax are quiet in the vicinity of an aerodrome just in case I get a call:confused:

[SwanFIS]

Dont worry. Everyone misses calls at one time or another be they Mil or Civil, big or small, controlled or uncontrolled.

If it was London Info, I am often surprised that more of you dont miss your calls.

We are after all "just" an information service there to help you the pilot.

:ok:

[Holdposition]

You would expect better from people in so - called positions of authority!!!!!


as they say" I blame the parents you know";)

[BRL]

blame the parents you know

That should read Parent ;)

[Jepp]

Any pilot that tells you that they never miss a call is telling fibs !

When it happens to me, I just say, "Apologies G-XXXX " and leave it at that. Dont bother giving a reason, it's just wastes frequency time.

[Whirlybird]

It's really not a big deal, and neither you nor they should make it one. You missed a call; you were doing something else. They wondered where you were, as they had something to tell you. You're both human; it happens. You apologise - well, you had asked for an FIS hadn't you - and carry on.

[Spitoon]

"Sorry, I was on no 2 box" is what I normally get!

[mad_jock]

Or if you really want to take the piss


tell them you were on the land line

[Kingy]

It has happened to me a few times - it's usually because my bloody radio's broke again and I'm furiously wiggleing wires trying to get the TX to work again! - mind you, those new little gas powered soldering irons have really helped recently he he :D

Kingy

[Gertrude the Wombat]

SWANFIS:If it was London Info, I am often surprised that more of you dont miss your calls. My usual approach to London Info is to call up, ask for FIS (having usually taken many minutes to get a word in), turn the volume down, then call them again when arriving at destination (well, I start trying several minutes before destination, so as to have some chance of getting a word in). So I don't expect London Info to have time to call me and I'm not really listening anyway. Really all one usually expects is an alerting service.

Imagine my surprise then the other Saturday when they kept calling me up, more or less just for a chat, as if they were bored. Clearly there was a lot less traffic than usual around that day! - don't know why though, there was nothing wrong with the weather.

(Or was it perhaps because I was only *just* outside the restricted airspace round a nuclear power station?)

[Eira]

Missing one call may not seem important to you, but when an ATCO is working there socks off trying desperately to get traffic information out to you and then has to repeat it several times its no joke.
On a FIS we are obliged to tell you about known traffic also working us, it is not just an alerting service.
Yes we all miss calls and as an ATCO I'm no different but for those who regularly don't listen out why bother asking for a service in first place, if all you want is the pressure setting why don't you just dial up the ATIS.

[rodan]

I agree with Eira.

It may not seem important to you, but you might not have seen the fast moving millitary traffic converging at the same level. The increasingly frantic atco has, and also has their license flashing before their eyes - he/she has very particular legal responsibilities once you are in receipt of a service, even if it's 'only' a FIS.

Also, if you are unable to respond to a request to confirm your level, or negotiate a course of action ( 9 times out of 10 what you were intending to do anyway, but we need to check ) then you might be causing major hassles to the atco who is trying to work IFR and/or heavy jet traffic around you.

I have to qualify the above - the odd missed call doesn't matter in the least. Atco's (mostly) appreciate that it is a lot noisier in your cockpit than it is in the tower. They also realise that you can be busy or distracted. The problem is the pilots who habitually call up for a service and then turn down the volume because they can't be bothered listening, and then bumble through an instrument approach leaving havoc in their wake. At the end of the day, why request a service if you don't want to keep your end of the bargain?

[Dufwer]

I'm surprised at some of the responses above! :uhoh: Why call for a service and then turn the volume down. Doesn't make sense to me. To the ATCO types that have responded above, is it possible, or even advisable, to request an alerting service if that is all the pilot is after? At least that would remove you from the requirments of a FIS.

D

[IO540]

I would just say "apologies" and leave it at that. Happens to all.

However the original post mentioned an FIS and not e.g. an RIS. An FIS is possibly worth very little at best when it comes to alerting to traffic which might come within a light year or two within you anyway.

An RIS is wholly different, and often a controller with a radar will give you an "FIS" due to workload (especially if you are "VFR") but in reality he's got on on the screen and will tell you if you are about to get close to something.

So, I often just maintain a listening watch on known-non-radar services, e.g. London Info but if I was getting an FIS from Thames Radar then I would be 100% with them, no exceptions.

[Whirlybird]

Reading between the lines, does some of this happen because PPL students are told they MUST use the radio? So once qualified they ask for an FIS, then turn down the volume?

You don't have to do this; there are alternatives. You can switch your radio off and not talk to anyone, if that's what you want to do. :eek: If you just think it might be nice to be able to call someone in an emergency, you can tune into a frequency and turn down the volume - London Info, D & D, the nearest big airfield, whatever you like - so that in the event of engine failure or similar you don't have to twiddle any knobs to get out a Mayday. Or you can maintain a listening watch, which means you listen in and might hear useful things about the traffic in your area...unless of course they're all doing the same thing.

I'm not saying any of the above are sensible. But you CAN do them. You don't HAVE to get an FIS from London Info just because way back your instructor said you did.

[IO540]

Agree entirely... PPL students are taught to talk to London Info etc etc and most of the time it' s a waste of time because (apart from flight plan foreign trips) almost nobody else talks to them.

If maintaining a listening watch for emergency purposes, why not 121.5? I believe there is guaranteed coverage over the entire mainland over something like 3000ft, and 2000ft in the London TMA region... in practice the system works much lower down. I have also seen airliners (pre-9/11) having the cockpit speaker set to a radio tuned to 121.5 - then you get 100-200nm range :O

[Rupert S]

How about, "London Info, G-XX readability 2" :}

[Eira]

I only ever advise people to switch to London Information if i know they will be crossing an area where there is absolutely no other coverage, if they require an Airways joining clearance further along their route or they are en-route to another country.
Listening out to the local airfields frequency is of much more use.
I like one of the ideas raised by the Fly on track team of wearing a specific squawk that indicates you are listening out to the airfields frequency but do not want a service. This allows ATC to contact you in an emergency and lets us know you are maintaining a listening watch.

[NinjaBill]

I cant understand why anyone would turn the volume down on their radio so they cant hear it, you can talk over a radio transmission on an aircraft intercom, aslong as you listen out to the callsign at the beginning.

However, i often find that listening to others can give you information on the position of other vfr traffic, that you havent been alerted to, because the atc is busy. You would miss out on this if you turned your radio down, so why do it?

NB

[Dude~]

Interesting replies, thanks. I didn't intend for this to become a London info discusion. Infact I was on Maston radar and going to France so in my case I had no option other option.

I do have a small confesion to make though. A few years back when I was very low on hours / experience, I was flying a C150 and receiving an FIS. At the time, I was nearing the end of what was at the time my longest and most demanding flight, and my pax was asking me where a certain landmark was. Suddenly, I heard my callsign followed by a frantic call and at the same instant my pax pointed out, with a surprising lack of surprise, a bloody great military sea king in my 10 o'clock, very close, same level, heading left to right across my track, entering a very steep desending turn. I didn't quite have to take evasive action, but it was obvious we would have come extremely close or even hit if the sea king hadn't turned. Due to our relative positions, the sea king had been obscured by the port wing on my C150 as we closed.

In short, the military pilot filed an airprox against me, but months later, 'blame' (Airpox reports tend to avoid the word blame, and in any case, who care whose fault it was if you actually have a mid air) was actually directed towards him, since he was undergoing IFR instruction in open FIR and had failed to keep a sufficient look out for his student.

Nevertheless, the incident shook me up, and taught me a few things. Small things that ar wrong with the planes we fly can take up large ammounts of our concentration. I had a slipping throtle (friction nut knackered) and the radios were terrible. These factors combined with flying in an new area at the end of a long flight with a demanding pax all added up.

This is what prompted me to start this thread because I was dissapointed with myself for having missed another traffic call under FIS. At the end of the day though the most important thing is - How good is your lookout?

[RodgerF]

One of the members at the club has a feature within the radio installation on his aircraft so he can play back the last few transmissions received.

[dublinpilot]

Now, a radio that could identify your call sign and flash a big red light when it heard it, would be even better ;)

[Beethoven]

I'd only end up missing the bloody light:(
Beet

[FlyingForFun]

Or a radio which beeps at you when you get a message so you can turn the volume up.

Oh, hold on - airliners already have that. It's called Selcal! :D

FFF
------------

[Onan the Clumsy]

Dublin, great idea though I think it should be a green light.

[dmjw01]

a bloody great military sea king in my 10 o'clock, very close, same level, heading left to right across my trackSo in fact you were "on the right, in the right", and were maintaining course and speed as the rules of the air demand. I'm not surprised the airprox assigned the "blame" to him!

[witchdoctor]

I always found carrying an irrascible old instructor to beat me furiously around the head at missed calls helped tremendously.;)

[Davidt]

TRY TELLING EM YOU WERE TOO BUSY WITH YOUR AEROBATIC DETAIL, THAT'LL CONFUSE EM IF YOUR IN A SPAM CAN!

[dublinpilot]

Aeros in a spam can would definately keep you very busy! ;)