The danger of electrical fire smoke
Thread Starter
The danger of electrical fire smoke
A few years ago I was an FO in a large elderly T - Prop airliner. The cockpit had very poor air circulation so the company had added auxiliary fans behind each pilot seat to held move the air around. One day we were flying along when both the Captain and I simultaneously smelt the odour of burning electrical components .
We looked around and noticed that a stream of smoke was streaming out of the top of the fan behind me. I immediately unstrapped to access the cockpit fire extinguisher and the power switch to the unit, both inaccessible if I was strapped in (great design
)
While doing this the smoke stream impacted my upper head. I immediately felt a strong burning sensation in both eyes and blurred vision. Total exposure was only 1 or 2 seconds. When we got to the destination I went to the hospital emergency ward and was diagnosed with contact conjunctivitis in both eyes. My eyes were flushed and I was grounded for 3 days.
My Take Away:
I was amazed at how little electrical smoke was required to seriously impact my ability to perform piloting duties. In this case having a second pilot meant I did not have to do very much to get us safely on the ground. The cockpit was also a lot bigger than a light aircraft. This has changed the way I think of potential small aircraft electrical fires.
My Recommendation:
At the first sign of electrical fire turn off the Master switch. Don't try to troubleshoot, don't try to get a radio call out, pull the checklist etc etc , turn off all power immediately.
We looked around and noticed that a stream of smoke was streaming out of the top of the fan behind me. I immediately unstrapped to access the cockpit fire extinguisher and the power switch to the unit, both inaccessible if I was strapped in (great design
) While doing this the smoke stream impacted my upper head. I immediately felt a strong burning sensation in both eyes and blurred vision. Total exposure was only 1 or 2 seconds. When we got to the destination I went to the hospital emergency ward and was diagnosed with contact conjunctivitis in both eyes. My eyes were flushed and I was grounded for 3 days.
My Take Away:
I was amazed at how little electrical smoke was required to seriously impact my ability to perform piloting duties. In this case having a second pilot meant I did not have to do very much to get us safely on the ground. The cockpit was also a lot bigger than a light aircraft. This has changed the way I think of potential small aircraft electrical fires.
My Recommendation:
At the first sign of electrical fire turn off the Master switch. Don't try to troubleshoot, don't try to get a radio call out, pull the checklist etc etc , turn off all power immediately.
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BPF
I also was involved with a smoke filled Citation flying out of Biggin Hill when I was an FO!
I had an elderly German Captain on the night flight to Majorca
We had a full cabin and passing FL240 I thought something was wrong with my eyes
Looking at the cabin in the dark cockpit his head was shimmering!
I blinked thinking my eyes had gone funny then came that burning acrid smell!
I looked at the air ducts and could see smoke pouring out!
Looking back at the PAX they were hidden in a fog and becoming highly alarmed
We were given a direct descent back to Biggin to be met by the fire engines on landing
Until you have experienced an electrical fire you don't realise how acrid and toxic the smoke is! My clothes stank of that smoke which turned out to have been caused by a fan in the ducting system
I also was involved with a smoke filled Citation flying out of Biggin Hill when I was an FO!
I had an elderly German Captain on the night flight to Majorca
We had a full cabin and passing FL240 I thought something was wrong with my eyes
Looking at the cabin in the dark cockpit his head was shimmering!
I blinked thinking my eyes had gone funny then came that burning acrid smell!
I looked at the air ducts and could see smoke pouring out!
Looking back at the PAX they were hidden in a fog and becoming highly alarmed
We were given a direct descent back to Biggin to be met by the fire engines on landing
Until you have experienced an electrical fire you don't realise how acrid and toxic the smoke is! My clothes stank of that smoke which turned out to have been caused by a fan in the ducting system
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Be very careful about what you switch off.
Many years ago I was involved in a smoke incident. We smelt burning and wondered what it was. It smelt electrical. The flight engineer checked the galleys - nothing found. Then, suddenly, we were engulfed in smoke which reduced the visibility to less then six inches. We thought we were on fire. Someone suggested switching off the master radio switches - which seemed a good idea at the time, but they also switched off the horizon, the altimeter and the compass, leaving us with only the ASI, VSI and turn & slip.
We nearly lost control of the aircraft. After a while the smoke cleared and we landed back at max landing weight. Fortunately, the smoke came from the air conditioning system and was not toxic, otherwise I would not be here.
You need to react quickly - but make damned sure you know what you are switching off!
Many years ago I was involved in a smoke incident. We smelt burning and wondered what it was. It smelt electrical. The flight engineer checked the galleys - nothing found. Then, suddenly, we were engulfed in smoke which reduced the visibility to less then six inches. We thought we were on fire. Someone suggested switching off the master radio switches - which seemed a good idea at the time, but they also switched off the horizon, the altimeter and the compass, leaving us with only the ASI, VSI and turn & slip.
We nearly lost control of the aircraft. After a while the smoke cleared and we landed back at max landing weight. Fortunately, the smoke came from the air conditioning system and was not toxic, otherwise I would not be here.
You need to react quickly - but make damned sure you know what you are switching off!
Thread Starter
Be very careful about what you switch off.
Many years ago I was involved in a smoke incident. We smelt burning and wondered what it was. It smelt electrical. The flight engineer checked the galleys - nothing found. Then, suddenly, we were engulfed in smoke which reduced the visibility to less then six inches. We thought we were on fire. Someone suggested switching off the master radio switches - which seemed a good idea at the time, but they also switched off the horizon, the altimeter and the compass, leaving us with only the ASI, VSI and turn & slip.
We nearly lost control of the aircraft. After a while the smoke cleared and we landed back at max landing weight. Fortunately, the smoke came from the air conditioning system and was not toxic, otherwise I would not be here.
You need to react quickly - but make damned sure you know what you are switching off!
Many years ago I was involved in a smoke incident. We smelt burning and wondered what it was. It smelt electrical. The flight engineer checked the galleys - nothing found. Then, suddenly, we were engulfed in smoke which reduced the visibility to less then six inches. We thought we were on fire. Someone suggested switching off the master radio switches - which seemed a good idea at the time, but they also switched off the horizon, the altimeter and the compass, leaving us with only the ASI, VSI and turn & slip.
We nearly lost control of the aircraft. After a while the smoke cleared and we landed back at max landing weight. Fortunately, the smoke came from the air conditioning system and was not toxic, otherwise I would not be here.
You need to react quickly - but make damned sure you know what you are switching off!
If you are VFR then there should be no need to restore power just go land at an uncontrolled airport, if IFR than you can switch everything off and restore the bare minimum on system at a time.
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I get what you are saying but this is the private aircraft forum
I know one guy who privately owns and flies a CJ1 and another an Eclipse both jets but both would classify themselves as light GA
(Lucky Sods)not all light private GA are piston Pipers ))
Thread Starter
Pace
You are correct I should have been more clear. My advice was specifically aimed at single pilot pilot unpressurized piston aircraft. Pilots of complex aircraft should follow that aircraft's AFM Emergency procedures.
You are correct I should have been more clear. My advice was specifically aimed at single pilot pilot unpressurized piston aircraft. Pilots of complex aircraft should follow that aircraft's AFM Emergency procedures.
Thread Starter
My Take Away:
I was amazed at how little electrical smoke was required to seriously impact my ability to perform piloting duties. In this case having a second pilot meant I did not have to do very much to get us safely on the ground. The cockpit was also a lot bigger than a light aircraft. This has changed the way I think of potential small aircraft electrical fires.
I was amazed at how little electrical smoke was required to seriously impact my ability to perform piloting duties. In this case having a second pilot meant I did not have to do very much to get us safely on the ground. The cockpit was also a lot bigger than a light aircraft. This has changed the way I think of potential small aircraft electrical fires.
At the first sign of electrical fire turn off the Master switch. Don't try to troubleshoot, don't try to get a radio call out, pull the checklist etc etc , turn off all power immediately.
Last edited by Big Pistons Forever; 22nd May 2015 at 00:28.
cable
I seem to recall from my RAF days that the new cable we started using was sheathed in PTFE and that this could be toxic when burnt.Things could have moved on since the early sisties mind!!!!
Last edited by oldpax; 22nd May 2015 at 00:23. Reason: missed letter
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Cabin smoke
I realise that in most, if not all, unpressurised GA aircraft there will not be supplemental O2 available, however not one poster, including those citing commercial passenger aircraft, has mentioned donning an Oxygen mask. First action when O2 is available is to get on 100% oxy. Smoke not only upsets your eyes.
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Old Fella
You are quite right! Apologies in my report which was an over view of the situation and did not go into detail of the emergency actions we took.
This is predominately a PPL piston forum and as such how smoke is dealt with would be different although the Seneca Five twins I flew had plumbed in oxygen.
Apart from oxygen we are pressurised and there is a dump switch which can help clear smoke.
One piston pilot i knew carried a piece of plastic tubing and goggles with the idea that if he had a Carbon monoxide problem or smoke problem he would place the tube in his mouth and dangle it through the pilot little side window breathing fresh air through that and using the swimming goggles to protect his eyes
Pace
You are quite right! Apologies in my report which was an over view of the situation and did not go into detail of the emergency actions we took.
This is predominately a PPL piston forum and as such how smoke is dealt with would be different although the Seneca Five twins I flew had plumbed in oxygen.
Apart from oxygen we are pressurised and there is a dump switch which can help clear smoke.
One piston pilot i knew carried a piece of plastic tubing and goggles with the idea that if he had a Carbon monoxide problem or smoke problem he would place the tube in his mouth and dangle it through the pilot little side window breathing fresh air through that and using the swimming goggles to protect his eyes
Pace
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Prior to my flying career I enjoyed a 16 year career as a professional yacht captain, much of it aboard large Mediterranean based motor-yachts.. On one overnight passage (Corsica to Palma, Majorca) a fire broke out in the engine-room. The recently overhauled fire extinguisher system failed to activate either automatically or manually and the fire quickly got out of control. The acrid smoke from a multitude of burning elements both liquid and solid made breathing pure torture, eyes were next to impossible to keep open. The most memorable aspect of the entire event was how quickly the fire gained control. Every few minutes it had grown exponentially and any plan for a new attempt to gain control of the situation was out of time before we were able to implement it. The vessel was ultimately abandoned and we spent a night and day in the life-raft.
Very many years later I found myself employed as an instructor with Flightsafety Int. I'm a great believer in check-lists and will only modify the manufacturers check-list when no safety issues are involved. It surprised me that the Emergency Check-List for suspected fire on this particular aircraft called for a series of checks to be run, all of which made perfect sense except for the fact that they were called for without any requirement for the crew to commence a descent. My instruction to the candidates was always; Yes, access the check-list but start getting the plane down immediately and safely as possible ... If it turns out to be unnecessary you may have to fill in a report. If it turns out that it WAS necessary... You may just have saved a lot of lives. It can all happen a lot quicker than you think.
Very many years later I found myself employed as an instructor with Flightsafety Int. I'm a great believer in check-lists and will only modify the manufacturers check-list when no safety issues are involved. It surprised me that the Emergency Check-List for suspected fire on this particular aircraft called for a series of checks to be run, all of which made perfect sense except for the fact that they were called for without any requirement for the crew to commence a descent. My instruction to the candidates was always; Yes, access the check-list but start getting the plane down immediately and safely as possible ... If it turns out to be unnecessary you may have to fill in a report. If it turns out that it WAS necessary... You may just have saved a lot of lives. It can all happen a lot quicker than you think.
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Electrical smoke
One of the main things to consider is how quickly a situation can develop.
Running start checks on a C130 the Flight Eng said "Look at that" looked up to see small wisps of smoke, almost like small seahorse shape descending from overhead panel. As we went to turn off power it quickly developed into dense smoke and filled the flight deck.
All from a minor fault behind the panel and a plastic piece smouldering. Luckily on the ground.
Running start checks on a C130 the Flight Eng said "Look at that" looked up to see small wisps of smoke, almost like small seahorse shape descending from overhead panel. As we went to turn off power it quickly developed into dense smoke and filled the flight deck.
All from a minor fault behind the panel and a plastic piece smouldering. Luckily on the ground.
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I realise that in most, if not all, unpressurised GA aircraft there will not be supplemental O2 available, however not one poster, including those citing commercial passenger aircraft, has mentioned donning an Oxygen mask. First action when O2 is available is to get on 100% oxy. Smoke not only upsets your eyes.
The second action after getting the mask on is to refer to the abnormal/emergency checklist, if you can still see it! The strange anomaly about amateur pilots is they try to use checklists when you dont really need them but never consider them when you really do need them. You could argue for ever what is the first action you should make but the most important action is in fact the last action-fly the aircraft to the safest place!
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Pull What
It is not just smoke but also Carbon Monoxide which is a danger. In pistons I used to have a Carbon Monoxide tester, some are just stick on so cheap and easy to apply.
a friend of mine had Carbon Monoxide poisoning while flying and it is he who also carries a meter length of clear plastic tube to place in his mouth and hang through the pilot side window should it happen again.
A useful addition for smoke too in aircraft that do not carry oxygen and a piece of tube costs literally nothing but could save your life with either smoke or Carbon Monoxide
pace
It is not just smoke but also Carbon Monoxide which is a danger. In pistons I used to have a Carbon Monoxide tester, some are just stick on so cheap and easy to apply.
a friend of mine had Carbon Monoxide poisoning while flying and it is he who also carries a meter length of clear plastic tube to place in his mouth and hang through the pilot side window should it happen again.
A useful addition for smoke too in aircraft that do not carry oxygen and a piece of tube costs literally nothing but could save your life with either smoke or Carbon Monoxide
pace
Last edited by Pace; 26th Jun 2015 at 10:32.
