Direct Bondi,

you are quoting from a superseded contract. Notice period either way for those who have signed a Contract with OSM /NAR ES /NAR FI is 3 months. Most are now on these "permanent" contracts.

It is your legal obligation to ascertain whether you are fit to fly, and a company attempting to impose disciplinary measures on a crew member who has (in his own judgement ) assessed himself unfit, is in very serious contravention of all National Aviation Authority rules.

What has happened , with the Scandinavian based crews, is that the company has withdrawn the right to "self-certify" for the 1st 3 days of sickness. This could well be extended to the EURO pilots, but, it will (as discussed earlier in the thread) be self defeating.

No Doctor is going to put his name/career on the line by failing to sign off a flight crew member who states that he is unable to perform due to stress, and, as further stated in the previous post, is more than likely to sign the individual off for more than a couple of days, and probably demand a return visit to recertify the individual as fit.


I do however totally agree with your assertion that . . . . . . " Contractors flying for Norwegian have a golden opportunity to join their Scandinavia colleagues and demand you ALL be included in a collective agreement and that Norwegian is your "employer". At such time you will truly be ONE GROUP OF NORWEGIAN PILOTS."

jw411, i completely resent pretty much your entire comment, from you, your military experience, and all the airlines that have been in their right mind to leave you with nothing but..... the uniform.

the fact is that the euro based pilots, are mostly based in veeeeery reasonably pricing areas of europe, both tax, housing, food and allowance. those of them that have half a brain, stick by their :mad: colleagues, respect what they have build, and stand by them in thick and thin, yeah they cannot support a strike YET.... trust me this fight is far from over.

As reported in Norway's Dagbladet evening edition, the Spanish pilot union, SEPLA, are considering their intended course of action:

"Today was the message from SEPLA that union lawyers are now considering the matter"

"Javier Martinez de Velasco believes pilots must be a permanent employee of an airline"

"we will have good working conditions and wages and a collective employment contract, says SEPLA president Javier Martinez de Velasco"

*Link:

Norwegian-piloter i Spania «håper og ber» for norske kolleger - nyheter - Dagbladet.no

*use Google Translate

I think you should ALL go for it. Good luck, whatever your 'collective' decision :ok:

Funny how eager the "colleagues" on pprune are to heckle the 0.001% of the industry who have some smidgeon of self-worth left.

Never mind. I'm pretty sure I'll be leaving it all behind, after which I'll be travelling exclusively with Ryanair on their two euro offers. They can fly me at a loss and the rest of you can miss out altogether. I'll break out a crate of cold ones and watch the matiné of "Death of a Career" starring all the clever monkeys who couldn't wait to bend over for another peanut.

Keep staring blankly out the window there Captain Cheeks R Spread. I'll be at home, living life.

RPG supports Norwegian pilots:

https://www.ryanairpilotgroup.com/si...3rd%202015.pdf

Latest news is that Norwegian have transferred (as in, it's already done) their Scandinavian pilots to 3 different subsidiaries: Pilot Services Norway, - Sweden and - Denmark. As per a management press release, it's done to 'enable pilots to better influence their future' and that present terms and conditions will prevail.

What they don't mention, is that the pilots will be split in 3 separate CLAs, and that future T&C negotiations will take place with each individual subsidiary. In other words, they've split the Scandi pilot pool in 3 and will, undoubtedly, use that in the future to play one against the other. With the fantastically egoistic attitude of many pilots, they'll probably have much success further suppressing the T&C's if they can pull it off.

"Divide and conquer".
Classic strategy...And classic union busting strategy.

Yes, but can the company actually do this without agreement from the pilots concerned? Is it actually legal to do this? Wouldn't the pilots need to give their consent for their employment to be transerred to another entity?

It'll be a sign it or leave type of deal...:uhoh:

(I'm in shipping and we are paying close attention to all of this since our employers look with envy at the LoCos)

SMT Member,

"With the fantastically egoistic attitude of many pilots, they'll probably have much success further suppressing the T&C's if they can pull it off." may apply to some sad individuals, but the collective will of the K Area pilots is to stay together believe me. They are only too aware of the repercussions of being split into ever smaller groups, and I doubt the offer of a better pension deal for the Norwegian (nationality) pilots is going to have much influence in whether they wish to stick with their Swedish & Danish colleagues. For once, pilots are actually seeing the "big picture" here, a refreshing change so far.

It has been written elsewhere that the company cannot exercise control over striking workers, so, even if they have de facto established 3 new companies, the "kind offer" has not been accepted.

It ain't over till the Fat Lady sings, and she is not even yet in the auditorium.

chksix,

the "offer" is indeed worded in such terms, however . . . . half of the companies pilots are on strike, and another 30-40% are just waiting on a legal ruling which will hopefully confirm that (as they are "employed" in another country / company. . . . bit of an own goal there ) they cannot pick up the Baton & run in another territory in strike -breaking style.

This is far far from being done & dusted, & BK would be best to leave the Moet & Chandon on ice for another day.

From the Red Nose article 'Enough is enough', 3pm has come and gone...... did anything happen?

Please read the 6 posts (including one of your own) above your last . . . . . . the strike continues tomorrow, nuff said (doesn't sound like a "resolution" to me ) :rolleyes:

CaptPS, I appreciate that the pilots are still on strike and I am aware of previous post content - I was just curious to know if the parties actually got as far as sitting around the table again this afternoon regardless of any outcome.

Good luck I hope Pilots will win the battle and Also I expect that spanish Pilots contacted by The company for a base changing don't accept this unilateral decition.
Regards from the other side of the Ocean

LoCo, there is a meeting at this very moment. . . .who knows what will be the outcome, yesterday was just another attempt by NAS to enforce their will, which is to split us into ever smaller groups.

samca, at the moment we cannot refuse any duty in SCAN, however, many colleagues have found the prospect of "strike breaking" too stressful & have reported "unfit to fly". If this sorry mess continues we are waiting for a mandate from a Spanish court ,that SEPLA has requested, forbidding us on Spanish Contracts employed by a "Spanish company" ( as ES based contractors are) to strike break in another jurisdiction.

only partially related to the ongoing strike...some food for thought, when "clever" corporate structures end up in court (such as ltd companies providing "pilot services" by one employee), a court of law may consider whether the set-up was made to circumvent a law, and may decide to disregard it. Another obvious example, a parent company may not set up a daughter company as an operating entity solely to run it into bankruptcy and thus get rid of debt. And another example, there is some precedent in some jurisdictions, including Norway, that a parent company may have certain responsibilities towards employees of a subsidiary, even if the subsidiary is the legal employer. Lets consider the unlikely case that NAN goes bankrupt: NAS may well be held responsible for certain obligations. Legal structures are not written in stone, a court of law can disregard "creative" coprorate structures that are used to circumvent other laws. Same goes for collective bargaining, or strikebreaking, a court of law could well decide that a "clever" set up with pilots employed in different legal entities is irrelevant ...however the outcome of a legal process is highly unpredictable, and can take years, so obviously it's best if the parties can agree :ok:

Jet2 is present in OSL doing flights affected by the strike. What do the crews operating these flights think about this? And what does BALPA say?

I was told by a friend that there had been a deadline set by the company for 16:00 today, any news on this?

Swedish Pilots in NAN were told to accept the reorganization, and get transferred to Pilot Services Sweden, or terminated.

The Swedish Pilot Union responded by suggesting that pilots on strike stay calm, don't respond to any threats, and let the Union lead negotiations, and that the strike will continue until a new collective agreement is reached.

The 16.00 deadline to get transferred from NAN to Pilot Services Sweden passed. Some more information will suppesedly be forthcoming 19.00