Oceanic

'I'm sure you would agree that the levels of flying 'experience' are vastly different.'

Yes, I would agree with you and as an ex crab I am fully aware of the inherent poling skills of the winged master race. However, I have flown with many, many 'civilians' whose poling ability has been equally on a par with ex mil.

I would also point out that for every civilain pilot that can log 20 hrs on a return trip to Singapore, there are half a dozen that would take a week of 4 sector days to log the same time so that 3000hrs only comes up in a short period for a minority.

And don't fall into the trap of equating experience with ability. Whilst I understand Virgin wanting crew that are already familiar with Boeing or Airbus systems, I think they are misguided in discriminating between ex mil with no commercial experience and and civil pilots with a great deal of the aforementioned.

I'm sorry but that is utter rubbish.

If you arrogantly assume civil flying entails following magenta lines you are very misinformed.
What does someone flying a C-17 from the Middle east to the UK do all day? How relevant is flying a Harrier or F3 to airline ops?

Speak to most TRE's and a fair percentage will say that EX FJ drivers have problems adjusting to multi crew ops.

And 300 hours per year?! Some may argue that isn't enough to safely stay current.

I have masive respect for Mil pilots and their skill set and what they put up with lifestyle wise. But i take issue with anyone trying to justify that they are somehow better adjusted to civilian long or short haul operations. I have flown with two. One was a good guy, eager to learn and realised he had a long way to go before being considered for command.

One airline, not all airlines.

I wouldn't bother telling someone at an interview that all airline pilots do is follow magenta lines - it might not get you very far!

San Expiry - why should the fact you fly fare paying passengers on a commercial basis necessarily put you at an advantage over someone who has essentially done the same job but for the MoD with the same constraints? Same job is it not?

There are very few FJ mates who could meet these hours criteria so I wouldn't be too disheartened. These guys may not have commercial experience but have proven handling ability, learning ability and flexibility so much so that some employers recognize the value of such, notwithstanding the obvious learning curve of operating multi-crew.

I fully agree that these days mil pilots are not inherently better than any civilian counterparts. However, Oceanic 815 is broadly correct in stating that the attainment of 3000 takes a mil pilot umpteen years,even those of us on heavies. My average annual total for the past few years is around the 400hrs mark including many months in a sandpit.

I dont think any current or ex mil would advocate we are better, because it certainly isnt true. We just bring a different skill set to the party and generally we are fairly content in being flexible and handling last minute changes because I guarantee you guys in the civilian sector have not been bu**ered about as much as some of us have! I dont know what I'm doing tomorrow never mind in one/two/three weeks time!

Don't think so, I've just completed my application. :ok:

'I dont know what I'm doing tomorrow never mind in one/two/three weeks time!

Chris, perhaps to not quite the same degree as the Services expects but there are a lot of guys out here on the other side of the fence who also have to put up with life like that. We're not all on BA bid lines.:{

Of course it's the same job. My point is that Virgin is discriminating, as is their right, against the non Boeing/Airbus type rated 'civvy' in favour of the non Boeing/Airbus type rated mil pilot, that's all.

I've just submitted my application too so all seems to be well with the website

How many days off between trips?

depends on the trip but normally its 2 days for east coast/caribbean and 3 days for west coast/South Africa..

B747-400 does'nt go eastbound.

Just announced on the BBC website the creation of 450 new jobs including 50 pilot positions. All linked to the arrival of the 330 and new routes. Good luck everyone.

Virgin launch recruitment drive today
 

Link
 

Good stuff, hopefully my 330 rating will come in handy. :ok:

I think the requirements are driven by the desire to take candidates eligible for Zero Flight Time (ZFT) training. Similarly, I imagine pilots with B744 or Airbus ratings, especially 330/340, are ahead of the pack as the company can save money on their training.

I don't doubt the flying ability of, for example, fast jet pilots, but airlines ops are all about making money. It's that simple.

FWIW Virgin already has a good mix of ex mil and civvy trained pilots.

Guys it is all about lowering the costs and importanty lowering the training risk. I completely understand why they have done it. Good for them. Please be patient your time will come. It took me10yrs!

Sadly for all you hopefuls,this is old news.The A330's are just about here and the recruiting has been done.

This is just another attempt to get the airline in the news again

A 1 to 8 office to flying staff ratio,says it all really.

Hi

Could I please ask any current Virgin pilots whether commuting from the Scottish Central Belt on a Virgin roster is realistically an option, whilst also maintaining a family life? Please be as brutally honest as you like as it may well determine whether I go for the interview or not. I see a number of Cabin Crew commuting daily, but not many Flight Deck Crew, which may answer the question anyway. I've read a lot of the info that you've all kindly put on here and in other threads, so this really is my only question about it all. If anyone is wanting to know, I'm at 6000 hours, 1600 jet and 3000 turbo.

Many thanks

Fast cruiser - thanks for your reply.

My application was submitted a few days ago.

757,

there are guys in the company that commute from all over the uk and europe.

you have 3 simple options, fly, train or drive.

Edinburgh and Glasgow are fine for flying, depends if you are looking at mainly Gatwick or Heathrow trips. Many guys commute this way from your area. Your staff travel concessions start after 6 months so there will be a few issues to start with.

Train from Glasgow is easy with virgin trains (reduced fares)

Driving will be too far. I drive from N Yorkshire occasionally which hurts after a trip.

Hope it helps

Would anyone on the inside be willing to give a rough idea of a year 1 F/O take home pay per month? Also perhaps an idea of how the increments go up through the years?

Thanks a lot.

We have hired several expats at Virgin America. I also know of at least one Indian. Of course you need a green card/right to work and the FAA licenses. But if you have that, getting hired as an expat at Virgin America would be no issue.

Really hoping for a pilot exchange program between Virgin Atlantic and Virgin America similar to the flight attendant exchange between Virgin America and Virgin Blue...

I know, wishful thinking.

Hi,

I ve got all the requirements except for the UK issued licence!
Can anyone tell me how serious they are about this? Surely I would have plenty of time to convert it should I be one of the lucky ones to join the holding pool.....Do they ask about a UK issued ATPL during the web application?
How long does this web application take? Do they have open questions like with BA?

Thanks

WAT

3wings, many thanks for your reply, much appreciated. Hadn't even considered the Glasgow Central - Virgin Trains link! Very useful.

Cheers 757

Airline "GIANT". Branding is everything huh. Hats off to their PR team though.

Not sure it was in this thread or a previous one, but someone mentioned that Virgin don't do airport standbys. If so, what's the call out time they expect when on standby? (ie how close would you have to accommodate yourself during a standby duty?)

Standby month of a roughly equal mix of 4 hr and 2 hr callout. "Must be able to report at their nominated base within 120 mins".

Top stuff, thanks freddie

(wasn't a deal clincher, but good to know)

I know it's a touchy subject but....can anyone offer a guide as to take home for an Fo

Cheers

Dont bank on it! :) I think it depends who you work for :{

Can I ask:
When you say '2 night' do you mean 2 nights at the destination plus one night flying back to the UK?
I realise that this depends on the destination, but for most of USA and 'the west' would this be true? Eg:

Monday 1000z Heathrow-Vegas
Tuesday 'layover'
Wednesday 2300z Vegas-Heathrow
Thursday arrive Heathrow 0700

Friday 'Day Off'
Saturday 'Day Off'

Sunday another trip...

I'm keen to get the 'unglorified' view. If you are saying that my Vegas example is a 2 night trip, in my eyes it pretty much equates to 4 days work. I know you can argue that you've got your return day to yourself, but from experience you're pretty much usesless.
How many proper days off do you get a month? I don't mean 'days at home', but actual days when you're not knackered/recovering?
I'm just trying to gauge what the lifestyle is really like.
ALSO if someone is brave enough to publish a 1st yr FO take home pay that would be great (after pension contribution).
Thanks very much

How do they get back then. LOL

Fill her up and keep flying west! You'll get there eventually.
:ok:

Anyone heard anything yet?

Closing date 20th March!

It's also Saturday night Jinkster! You've not had much experience of HR departments have you?!?

Despite the permanent headwind. :ouch:

Out of interest, did everyone upload the cover letter too? Noticed an option for that at the last minute.

Jesus, imagine having to trim an aeroplane! :p Good luck should you get the assessment :ok:

I sent both cover letter and a CV.

Good luck all!

AAIA

I can't answer you question regarding the 1st year FO take home pay but in response to your question regarding 1 night/2night stops rotation.

All rosters commence at LHR as that is your base. The Vegas as an example operates from LGW so on the roster the duty would commence from LHR and 1hr taxi time is allowed for transport to LGW (Company transport is available in the form of a bus but the times aren't always compatible with report times).

In reality most pilots self position to LGW for the report time 90 mins before departure.

You would arrive in Vegas that day 4pm ish.. local. Have 2 nights there (approx 48hrs down route) and then fly home on the 3rd. So a trip beginning on Monday a.m will have you home on Thursday a.m.

A 1 nighter would start for example on the Monday (then approx 24 hrs down route) and you would be home on Wednesday... or more realistically start on Friday and home on Sunday but you get the drift.

For West coast trips the minimum days off will be 3 and the East coast trips the minimum days off is 2. Days off per month vary but I have only had the minimum of 10 days off perhaps twice in 7 years. Usually I average around 12 - 14 but on occasions 20 without leave. It can be a bit of a lottery.

Everyone will handle the fatigue issue differently and it can be tough particularly if you have a long commute. Generally though I am unbearable the day I get home but can be approached by mid morning the following day.

Hope that helps.

Well you obviously don't work in the UK then. You won't get a housing allowance from a UK airline. If you want to earn big money then you have 2 options:

1. Change career
2. Keep working abroad tax free

Good luck :ok: