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-   -   Turkish Airlines THY working conditions - worse than announced? (https://www.pprune.org/terms-endearment/561139-turkish-airlines-thy-working-conditions-worse-than-announced.html)

SurvivedJZR 8th May 2015 16:39

Turkish Airlines THY working conditions - worse than announced?
 
Hi guys,

interested in applying for THY, I collected several information during the last months. Mainly I got 2 ex-colleagues flying there, of which one has resigned recently.

Could anybody actually flying in THY confirm or deny these partially strange items:

1. Pilot must be in IST 12 hours before flight. That means, an expat has to be there a day before and that day for travelling is still considered as OFF day. Also it means, expat cannot go home in 48hours rest period (plus possible short-term OFF).

2. In case you get sick, nevertheless where you are, you have to fly to IST, to consult doctor at the airport and show up. Otherwise, THY takes this as NO-SHOW and it has disciplinary consequences?

3. Also when you are sick, you get full reduction in salary, and with luck, you are able to get a maximum of 25% back after months, but only with Turkish National Health Insurance, appliying in Turkish Language at their desk and with Turkish-only speaking staff.

4. Since the new year the roster has changed and it is now for long-haul that way applied, that the pilot is 21days in IST, then 7 days at home. With the new rules, there is no chance of going home, even if your flight is only 1h from IST (ATH as example).

5. Managers are asking for new ideas, how to get more pilots to THY, but at the same times, all benefits are cut, changes are only to the giving side of the pilots and not vice versa.

6. Turkish Lira has lost of its value up to 40% and there is no compensation from THY.

7. Many expats are leaving after a year or a little more, because there is hardly movement in getting better working conditions, or as before, conditions are getting worse.

8. Turkish Union is not a help, they are not defending any expat problem.

9. You must be 24h available on mobile, otherwise disciplinary consequences are following.

10. flights are taken away by rostering, without any reason and on short term notice. Therefore, pilot is 12h before duty in IST and then he can experience, that his flight is canceled and he is bound to stay in IST.

There are more items, but I think these 10 are the most important to get a picture of the real situation, and not that, communicated by agencies etc.

Appreciate any reasonable comments ...

Kapitanleutnant 8th May 2015 17:44

At a recent Turkish Airlines road show the pilot recruiter was asked about when u have to be in IST for your trip. Answer was no requirement... Only 1 hour 30 minutes for each flight.
Regarding sick, what I re all is you get paid wither 75 or 80 percent for long term sick if you follow procedures.
I get the distinct impression the wide body lifestyle is more relaxed than the narrow body.

I was told that the CEO recently stated there would be a pay rise for pilots coming soon because they are not receiving the applications and qualifications needed. It was also mentioned that this might be for expat pilots, which doesn't make a lot of sense... Should be all pilots

Just some of what I recall

finfly1 8th May 2015 17:59

Hmm ... a clear contradiction between what the man says who is trying hard to get new pilots to sign up, and what people said who worked there and left.

Whoda thunkit?

de facto 9th May 2015 04:41

It would seem that because some pilots :mad: up , blamed it on their fatigue,THY has decided that all its pilots cant manage their rest.
It seems that their are overloaded with such unsafe events and are trying to stop the bleeding...
If they had a hard look at their terms and conditions then maybe would they realise that money can bring experienced crews which in turn would reduce such events and such memo wouldnt be necessary and keep therefore their crew happy and avoid them leaving.
I guess less pilots will accept to be called by their dispatch 12 hours before a flight then:E
It smells more and more like rotten eggs there....too bad it seemed that it had the potential to be a good gig...

twentyyearstoolate 9th May 2015 06:22

I'm sure this will fix all of their problems :ugh:

Why do these people think they have the right to treat us like little children. As long as I sign saying I'm fit for work and well rested, it is MY responsibility therefore MY decision. I don't need THY to tell me how and when to rest. What next, will they post security in the Hotels to make sure we're in our room 12 hours before?

If these guys are so concerned about our health and well being, they really need to fix the sick leave procedure. At the moment it is a violation of human rights what you have to do in order to get "some" of your deducted salary back. Hence why crew regularly fly when they are sick, as it is far less stressful than staying at home.

This latest Memo is definitely one of the most ridiculous Memos in my career.

As far as I'm concerned they can sick this one up their ###. If they want to discipline or sack me because of this, then go ahead!!

polax52 9th May 2015 06:44

Rules:


1. Try not to get disciplined or sacked, Just resign, it's better for your career.
2. Never work for an Airline where there is a strong local union which is anti expat Pilots, it can only end in misery and not for the local union.

Nightstop 9th May 2015 07:39

1. Pilot must be in IST 12 hours before flight. That means, an expat has to be there a day before and that day for travelling is still considered as OFF day.

That is not unusual, after the Colgan Air Flight 3407 accident airlines are taking a very close look at crew's commuting patterns. My company imposes the same restriction and rightly so, some were commuting into Base at midnight for a 0600 report..

twentyyearstoolate 9th May 2015 07:51

It is the Pilots responsibility to ensure he is well rested for the flight. Same as it's his responsibility to be free from Alcohol and drugs. Maybe with the Colgan flight it may have helped to pay their pilots more than what they require to qualify from food stamps and basing them in one of the most expensive cities in the US.

I guess you would also agree to the company mandating the last 12 hours of rest must be spent in the layover Hotel?!

Nightstop 9th May 2015 08:10

I commute in and out of my Base by air. I always ensure I have 12 hours rest there before reporting for duty. On the way out I try to give myself a similar length of time off before starting the journey back home, I don't want to fall asleep at the wheel of my car either. See:

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...ticle-1.372796

polax52 9th May 2015 08:16

The problem is, of course, too many people abuse a relaxed commuting policy. Rest is a very important factor in safety and unfortunately some kind of rule is required even if it continues to be enforced in a relaxed fashion. I think if you're at your base 8 hours before duty and get yourself 6 hours sleep then you are sufficiently rested.


There's nothing worse though than being a Captain stood in briefing waiting for an F/O who's commute in has been delayed.

Stone_cold 9th May 2015 08:23

Night stop . Simply put , you are an A$$. The regulations are so that the company cannot schedule you to work continuously . What you do with and how you manage your rest is up to the individual . The company must schedule you at least the minimum , that's their responsibility , full stop . Are you guaranteed that you are "rested " after putting yourself in your room for 12 hours ? It does not ! It is commendable that you give up your time . My needs and what rest I need are my business , as long as I turn up for my duty fit !

Stone_cold 9th May 2015 08:35

Sounds like you belong in the Middle ages (east) where they remind the cabin crew to remember to take clean underwear on layovers . And further to what some have said , if you happen to work for a carrier with a minimum rest layover , which sometimes can be less than 10 hours between reaching the hotel and checking out , do you dutifully tuck in ? Guess it is not fatiguing or hard on the body to take the time to eat something ??

Hypocritical management BS! They can squeeze you on your OFF time , read it , YOUR OFF TIME !! Yet they work you to the limits of max duty and min rest !!

Nightstop 9th May 2015 08:49

Best stay in the Sandpit Stone-cold...If you checked in as one of my crew I'd offload you.

no sponsor 9th May 2015 09:03

Come on guys, you really can't expect anything other from some third world outfit?

twentyyearstoolate 9th May 2015 09:13

Yup, I also don't give a rats a## about how long you are at base Nightstop.

How I rest is my business. Not yours, and NOT the company's. I make sure I am well rested before any duty, including after a commute. How do i do that? Again, none of anyone's business. When I sign the papers, I am confirming I am well rested and able to do my duty.

Why is it that I am most tired when I am signing for a flight after the short layovers with time zone changes? (and i don't party if thats what you're thinking) My sign on after a commute is and never has been an issue for me. Maybe I should ask the company to spend more time assesing crew fatigue when AT work!

As no sponsor said, this is a third world outfit, and I agree we cannot expect anything else other than the usual "we own you at all times" mentality.

To the Management : "Mind your own business with how and when I rest before a flight please!"

de facto 9th May 2015 09:49


There's nothing worse though than being a Captain stood in briefing waiting for an F/O who's commute in has been delayed.
Very true and crews that are late for duty for any reason,especially because of commuting..should be sanctioned.

I am afraid the reason behind may be for a different reason than a fatigue issue since stonecold is writing duty rest can be 10 hours..
Could it be that the airline wants pilots on a stby basis so their flight can be changed more easily may it be required by operations?

Is management bending under crew scheduling?

Over worked,under paid,continuous one way concessions and :mad: off pilots doesnt help the situation....

CaptainProp 9th May 2015 10:02


There's nothing worse though than being a Captain stood in briefing waiting for an F/O who's commute in has been delayed.
....but if the FO is stood waiting for an expat Captain that's delayed, then that would be ok??

de facto 9th May 2015 10:08

Be nice.....of course the opposite would be exactly the same.
He certainly mentioned it based on his view as a captain.

Boeingrestricted 9th May 2015 10:54

They can check this 12 hours rule hassle free by just clicking on your staff number and pair this with your ID 90 used ticket. If you are a commuter this means basically that you HAVE to come back 24 hours before the flight and go to your apartment or hotel room. So in turn this explicitly means a shortening of your stay back home. Combine this with a typical 2115 UTC reporting for duty trip on your OFF day and 'voila' you have to come 30 before your next trip. (unless you are planning to get really tired by coming 12 hours before the flight and stay at the crew lounge LOL)

The 24hr telephone contactable requirement is not really fiction even if its on your OFF day just be weary about that. If and for the time you are needed they will keep quite, this can turn ugly very quickly.

twentyyearstoolate 9th May 2015 11:06

The Turkish have a talent for attracting Expat Pilots :}

Globally Yours:ok:


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