Italian tax authority after Ryanair pilots
 

Pilots and cabin crew based in Italy are being subject to tax checks dated back to 2006 , it affects current as well as former crew who were based there.
Pilots tax bills and fines range from 35.000 to over 50.000€ for one single year.
I wonder in which state of mind are these guys flying......

How's that possible? Surely, if there are any tax issues, the liability should fall on the company. This is assuming pilots working in Italy are employed by Ryanair..

Any news about the Marseille-Provence court case in Aix-en-Provence yet? Should be a matter of days now.

Depends on the Tax in question I guess.

For example if I incorrectly filled in my UK Tax declaration, or didn't fill one it all all, and as a result had "tax issues" then HM Revenue and Customs will come after me, not my employer.

Aren't (most) ryanair pilots "their own company" just to be hired by ryanair?

A contractor is the director of their 'own company'. Albeit a company that may exist of one employee - them. You are responsible for your own tax arrangements just like any other company.

As far as I am aware this issue applies to employees of Ryanair - both flightdeck and cabin crew. Ryanair has paid all taxes and social insurances in Ireland and the Italians see this as incorrect.

Have the Italians come after Ryanair for unpaid employers social insurance? I'd imagine Brookfield Contractors are next. It appears that the liability is being pushed on the employees, past and present. I'm not entirely sure how and indeed if Ryanair have managed to completely duck this one. Only the beginning of a rather long story in my opinion.

100% agree.

But if you're a contractor would it not be you that's responsible for employer and employee social taxes? i.e. National Insurance in the UK.

If the authorities are going back 6 years..... :eek:

I agree there are potential safety implications with this. This must be a huge burden preying on the minds of those affected.

There are currently two separate cases. One deals with social insurance being paid in Ireland by Italy-based employees (this has nothing to do with pseudo-contractors, BTW) while the Italian authorities believe it should be paid locally. The other one (the latest in chronological order) deals with employees (again, pseudo-contractors are not affected by this) allegedly failing to report their earnings to the Italian tax authorities, who are of the opinion that aforementioned earnings should have been reported even if they are actually exempt from Italian income tax. For failing to report said earnings you have to pay a stiff fine even if there was no actual tax dodging involved. :}

As an Italian, I can say that this is the worst timing to deal with Equitalia...
I feel sympathy for all the persons involved.

Just to let you understand what I mean, a normal person cannot spend his/her life's savings withouth being questioned why he/she spends the savings.

"Only the beginning of a rather long story in my opinion" - read 'long court case', I suggest.

As usual, the big guys who turned a blind eye, and the big guys who profited from them doing so, will no doubt come to an "accomodation" (or to be exact, will effect a modification to the existing "accomodation")

Most countries are well aware of what has been going on, and have accepted it very meekly. . . wonder why :hmm:

The insistence that Contractors had to set up their 3 director psuedo company (& pay their taxes in) Ireland was no doubt beneficial to their "real" employer, in one form or another.

The only ones looking at being shafted here are the Contractors who went along with the Scam. The full time employees were compliant with the rules in place at the time, and had no say over where tax & social chgs were deducted, can't see they will be up for too much grief.

I think Captainplaystation is close to the mark here, if the intended target are employee's of Ryanair, then it will be they that are liable not the employee i suspect.

The contractor situation is rather different, most country's have some form of test to determine whether your employed or self employed, its a bit more difficult if you have set a company and are selling your (flying services) to FR, i suspect that FR are doing nothing illegal here, it may be irregular or unusual and we all know why they are doing it, but so long as these "companies"operate in accordance with the law of the land they are living in then I'm not sure what they can do to recover any money from them?

Of course if they decide to investigate the company and ask the Director to attend interviews, then that might be a bit inconvenient.

It just such a shame that such a good bunch of people who do a sterling job for an absolute toss pot of an employer have to put up with this crap

Say again? Unless you were resident illegally you had to be registered as a resident at your local town hall. Town hall records for 2006 take all of a half of a second to pull from the digital archive. This is not the Central African Republic, you know. :=

In this specific case you'd be wrong. The responsibility to file one's yearly tax statement rests exclusively with the employee and not with the employer. Any fines for failing to do so have to be paid fully by the employee too. :}

I think people may be speaking at crossed purposes here or strenuously agreeing. I am surprised by the amount of people on such contracts who don't fully understand where they sit with respect to their rights or liabilities.

I think people are getting contractor and employee mixed up.

Ryanair only has a small percentage of permanent employees on the flight deck. Around 25% I am told. So for these people, if this was the UK would have tax deducted at source each month, along with their National Insurance. For a 'normal' PAYE employee this is usually done by your employer. They would probably have nothing to worry about, with respect to this matter.

If you are a contractor, which the majority of Ryanair pilots are, you are registered as a company. Ryanair do not employ you. They contract your services in. You are the director of said company and may even be an employee of your own company. Either way, if this arrangement is the case then it is up to you to sort out your own tax/NI arrangements like any other company. Both as director and employee of your own company.

However, this is where the clouds descend and it all becomes a bit murky... The role of pilot in the UK does not lend itself well to a contractor position and could very well be considered as disguised employment under HMRC IR35.

Which is illegal...

Link
 

Once again, this has nothing to do with contractors but only with employees. If you live in one country but have your income taxed at source in another country it may well be that you also have obligations to fulfill (such as reporting all your combined earnings) towards the country of residence. These obligations are your responsibility only, your employer will not do that for you, because you are not like a "normal" employee who works, lives and pays his taxes in one and the same country. :=

EU induced mess
 

Dannyagilla and I have clashed a few times on this forum and I have to ask what he makes of the situation in Spain and pilots who are trying to pay rather than avoid taxes.

Over the last few weeks a number of pilots from the Northern part of Europe have been told that they have to register & Pay social tax in Spain were they are based. They have turned up at the Police station to register them selfs as resident but the Police won't stamp their tax forms because the Police don't consider them resident.

So now we have a situation were the pilots are trying to comply with the EU regulations regarding social tax but the National authority's are refusing to issue the paperwork to enable the tax to be paid.

Just to add to the confusion one country up north is refusing to let these people pay the social tax were they are really resident because the EU directive requires the tax to be paid in the country that the pilot is based in !

So now these guys can't pay the Social tax to any one.

You could not write this as fiction, it's just too stupid !

The real criminals are those who are employed by the EU, they sit on their fat arses and pay exactly ZERO tax to anyone, I think they might pay about 5% back into the EU coffers........why should a EU translator in Germany earn 70K and take home 65K when his partner same job same salary lose almost half of her income just because they have different employer??