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Reciprocal agreement with the EU on the transfer of UK CAA Flight Crew Licences.

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Reciprocal agreement with the EU on the transfer of UK CAA Flight Crew Licences.

Old 19th Apr 2021, 18:11
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UK EASA licensed TREs could sign the license from any EASA state before the end of last year. However, one had to bring the national forms for them to fill out and comply with the relevant rules around them, but that is certainly not rocket science. So yes, one could SOLI out before the transition period was over, but of course, that took a minimum amount of work.

And no, life is not fair, it never was and never will be, most people learn that very early on. Kindergarden is a normal place where that starts to sink in. In this case it was of course aided by the fact that anything to do with the ECJ, even if it was very far removed, was completely impossible to accept for Lord Snowflake, while the EU is a very much rule based organization (which does not mean that they can't change the rules very fast if needed) and therefore follows its own rules. The UK wanted to be a third country, Ok, lets start from the status of a third country without any relation to the EU and negotiate upwards from that. Aviation and especially licensing was not very important to either side.

As to the requirement by Discover: not unusual anywhere in the EU, but in this case probably even excusable, after all German is by far the language with the most native speakers in the EU both before and after brexit. Close to a 100 million people in Europe do speak some form of german natively, in quite a few countries, and some do learn it in school, as most of Europe teaches at least two foreign languages in school (one of them usually being english).
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Old 19th Apr 2021, 20:04
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You're absolutely right, but not for the period between 1/1/21 and getting your UK licence issued, which you couldn't apply for until 1/4/21, and which no timescale can be provided by CAA. So even if you were lucky enough to be due your LPC in December, or could convince your employer to do an early LPC in December, you would have no idea if you would have a UK licence by your next LPC. The process for applying for issue of the UK licence was not finalised by 1/1/21, just that it would be available at some point.

Added to that, realistically you would have needed to apply for SOLI by September time 2020 to know you would receive your non-UK EASA licence by 31/3/21, which is the cut-off off for being able to use it in the UK under validation until you got your UK licence issued - which you can't apply for until 1/4/21 and have no idea how long it will take to arrive. So now you've got to get your LPC done in September 2020, and hope you have your UK licence by August 2021, but with no knowledge of how that process will look or how long it will take. That's also assuming you don't need a new type rating added to your licence for example in the meantime.

In conclusion you can decide for yourself how much "work" was involved, but you sure needed to enjoy gambling if you had a UK job you wanted to make sure you could continue flying in for the next year or so - so no I don't believe it was an option for many of your fellow professionals.

The rest is all politics and out of our hands.

Last edited by rogue leader; 19th Apr 2021 at 20:32.
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Old 19th Apr 2021, 21:28
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Smooth Airperator

Instead of whinging about how unfair the world is, you could have spent your time researching the ITALIAN province of South tyrol. For instance, I just learned that 62.3% of the population of South Tyrol speaks German as a first language. Who would have known, Italians that speak German.
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Old 20th Apr 2021, 01:48
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https://jakubmarian.com/average-numb...eu-population/


Raised bilingual Dutch/Spanish, had 6 years high school English, French & German.
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Old 20th Apr 2021, 19:58
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There are other nationalities working at Air France, Lufthansa, Swiss and KLM. They speak French, German or Dutch.
They all meat the requirement of speaking the (or one of the) national language(s). There's nothing unfair about that.
A language requirement and a requirement for the right to work in that country is not discriminating.
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Old 20th Apr 2021, 22:30
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Smooth Airperator

Here I am.
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Old 20th Apr 2021, 22:32
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Go skiing in the Dolomites - everyone speaks Italian and German. (And probably English).

ps. If I ran a German company Iíd want German speakers. Likewise France, Italy, Spain etc
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Old 21st Apr 2021, 18:42
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Smooth Airperator

You have no idea what you're talking about.
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Old 22nd Apr 2021, 05:21
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Smooth Airperator

https://www.mallorcazeitung.es/

largest newspaper in the Balearic Islands......
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Old 22nd Apr 2021, 10:08
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After the demise of Air Europe in 1991, Condor took a whole bunch but they all had to do the full German ATPL. End of season, I think only a couple remained, German speakers only.
I went to Holland. Only did Air Law for full validation. Very hard to find a Dutch speaker anywhere in Holland. Funny old world eh ?
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Old 22nd Apr 2021, 10:17
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Anyone know what the process will be for those working for an EU operator with EASA licence and and also holding the new U.K. Part-FCL licence when getting the LPC revalidated ? EASA TRE revalidates for EASA, but can the new expiry date be transferred to the new U.K. Part-FCL or will the pilot need to undertake two separate LPCs?
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Old 22nd Apr 2021, 10:36
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I’m currently TRE on IAA licence and I can sign EASA and UK licences (at least until end 2022), so if someone had both licences and it was all in date and appropriate and my airline allowed it (and it will) then I would sign both. Because it would entail extra paperwork (two notifications, post check reports etc) I would expect extra beer.

Once I get my UK licence back I will put my uk number on the uk signing and my IAA number on the EASA signing.
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Old 22nd Apr 2021, 10:43
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Thanks deltahotel, much appreciated.
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Old 26th Apr 2021, 23:32
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Is there anything going on behind the scenes in the EU and UK on this lack of grandfather rights for exchange of EASA licenses that are issued before Brexit?
As itís so insane that my non UK, but EASA doctor did my medical the last decade under EASA rules and now I have to do a whole new initial EASA medical as my flying license and with that my medical were in the past changed to a UK EASA license.
Itís an unnecessary destruction of qualifications and just obstructing pilots for what purpose? The Europarlement and European Committee should correct this.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 09:46
  #175 (permalink)  
 
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No, you can blame the UK Government. Only them.

You were warned, you didn't act. Deal with it.

It's this simple, the UK did everything.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 10:24
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Considering the EU commission just threatened the UK with remedial tariffs and quotas as the UK continues to be in breach of the TCA i do not think any further negotiation is really taking place on anything. It is kinda sad that things have deteriorated to such a state, but i am afraid it was, in the end, unavoidable. Things probably will get worse before they can change for the better.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 14:09
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Horsepowerrr

The UK unilaterally decided to leave EASA. They had the choice to stay in. They have the choice to re-join. Not really up to Europarliament or Committee, is it...
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 15:15
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Itís not exactly horsepowers fault is it? Thereís no need to throw fuel on the fire. It still amazes me how some here are criticising fellow pilots for the mess they find themselves unwillingly caught up in.
Itís absolutely pathetic.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 16:29
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They are in this mess due to the UK Government, not the EU or EASA.
Your continuous attempt at blaming the EU and EASA is pathetic.
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Old 27th Apr 2021, 17:36
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Contact Approach

Nobody is blaming individual pilots for this. But individual pilots are blaming the EU and EASA for the current state. Nothing wrong with adding another viewpoint then?
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