UK to EASA
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UK to EASA
So I’ve been waiting for some paperwork from the UK CAA which has taken about a month longer than expected. It’s looking like I’ll miss the 4th of September deadline from the IAA to get and EASA licence conversion.
Are there any other authorities that are known to be quick with conversions?
Thanks!
Are there any other authorities that are known to be quick with conversions?
Thanks!
Presumably your employer restricted you to a UK licence? That sucks. Everywhere I’ve worked (with G ref) has been happy with any EASA licence (perhaps wouldn’t all have paid for the transfer but they wouldn’t have objected ).
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Does anyone know how the likes of Ryanair and Easyjet will deal with Brexit after the transition? As far as I know FR uses Irish reg aircraft in U.K. Those planes will have to become g-registered and only be flown by pilots with U.K. licenses. I guess the same would apply to any other operator that has a U.K. base??!!
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Ryanair already has at least one G reg aircraft and last year, they had a UK AOC granted for this eventuality. With regards crewing, the UK CAA have already said they will accept EASA licences for up to 2 years after the transition period. Also, there is nothing stopping EASA license holders from getting a UK licence and holding it alongside their EASA license (again the CAA have said a simple process will be put in place next year). If done correctly, I can't see any short term manning problems for the likes of Ryanair.
Unfortunately, it doesn't look like it will work the other way round and UK CAA licences won't be recognised at all by EASA next year.
Unfortunately, it doesn't look like it will work the other way round and UK CAA licences won't be recognised at all by EASA next year.
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Also, there is nothing stopping EASA license holders from getting a UK licence and holding it alongside their EASA license
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the UK CAA have already said they will accept EASA licences for up to 2 years after the transition period. Also, there is nothing stopping EASA license holders from getting a UK licence and holding it alongside their EASA license (again the CAA have said a simple process will be put in place next year).
The current working assumptions for the UK CAA's Brexit stance are clearly stated here:
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I now can't find the text about the 2 year grace period, so I'll happily retract that.
There are some Q and As here on the CAA website. Close to the bottom is an answer about EU state issued commercial licenses being used on G reg aircraft...apparently just an online form is required to allow you validate and fly G reg. Admittedly "conditions apply", and I'm not sure exactly what those will be
Point taken about working rights though, that's another matter
There are some Q and As here on the CAA website. Close to the bottom is an answer about EU state issued commercial licenses being used on G reg aircraft...apparently just an online form is required to allow you validate and fly G reg. Admittedly "conditions apply", and I'm not sure exactly what those will be
Point taken about working rights though, that's another matter
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airpasty
The 04/09 (today) deadline is for those pilots who require EASA continuity on 01/01/21. You can still apply to IAA after 04/09 and before 31/12 and the application will be processed but the exchange of licences may happen in early 2021.
Austrocontrol have a different approach where the application must be completed by 31/12/20, after which they can then no longer convert a third country UK licence. Last I spoke to them they advised me to look elsewhere as their current demand sees them busy upto 31/12.
Lots of states are honouring applications as long as they are made in 2020. There is no real way of speeding up the process by carefully choosing a quieter state as one of the major bottle necks is the UK CAA.
The 04/09 (today) deadline is for those pilots who require EASA continuity on 01/01/21. You can still apply to IAA after 04/09 and before 31/12 and the application will be processed but the exchange of licences may happen in early 2021.
Austrocontrol have a different approach where the application must be completed by 31/12/20, after which they can then no longer convert a third country UK licence. Last I spoke to them they advised me to look elsewhere as their current demand sees them busy upto 31/12.
Lots of states are honouring applications as long as they are made in 2020. There is no real way of speeding up the process by carefully choosing a quieter state as one of the major bottle necks is the UK CAA.
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LorisBatacchi
Some operators with a UK base are requiring British passport holders to apply to convert their UK EASA licences to an EU EASA licence and will have them apply for a UK validation in January 2021 (and shortly thereafter, a UK licence which will sit alongside the EASA licence. ) This will allow British passport holders to fly both G- registered and EASA-registered aircraft based in the UK. I can think of one operator with a UK base that is doing exactly this.
The legal right to live and work in the UK or EU (as appropriate) remains a valid concern - the UK currently seems to be more flexible with regards to this question than the EU. We will see !
Some operators with a UK base are requiring British passport holders to apply to convert their UK EASA licences to an EU EASA licence and will have them apply for a UK validation in January 2021 (and shortly thereafter, a UK licence which will sit alongside the EASA licence. ) This will allow British passport holders to fly both G- registered and EASA-registered aircraft based in the UK. I can think of one operator with a UK base that is doing exactly this.
The legal right to live and work in the UK or EU (as appropriate) remains a valid concern - the UK currently seems to be more flexible with regards to this question than the EU. We will see !
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Emkay
From an email conversation I had with licencing personnel at IAA
Q: Are the IAA still anticipating that UK applications received through the post on or around 04/09 to still be processed and issued with an Irish EASA licence in late 2020 / early 2021?
A: That is correct. Whilst the IAA will continue to process change of SOLI applications for UK licences received after 4th September 2020, the 12+ week turnaround of such applications means that it is unlikely that the exchange of licences will occur before the end of the year. This will obviously be an issue for pilots who need the surety of an EASA licence to continue flying in early 2021. For those pilots not using an EASA licence at present, the timings will be less of an issue.
From an email conversation I had with licencing personnel at IAA
Q: Are the IAA still anticipating that UK applications received through the post on or around 04/09 to still be processed and issued with an Irish EASA licence in late 2020 / early 2021?
A: That is correct. Whilst the IAA will continue to process change of SOLI applications for UK licences received after 4th September 2020, the 12+ week turnaround of such applications means that it is unlikely that the exchange of licences will occur before the end of the year. This will obviously be an issue for pilots who need the surety of an EASA licence to continue flying in early 2021. For those pilots not using an EASA licence at present, the timings will be less of an issue.
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The statement that the UK will accept EASA certificates for up to 2 years now appears here under the second and third questions. In answer to Q #2 we have "EASA has stated previously that it would accept third country applications from UK Approved Training Organisations. Organisations would need to decide whether, on the basis that the UK’s membership of the EASA system ceases at the end of the transition period and if there is no mutual recognition of safety certificates between the UK and European systems, they would wish to retain both a national and an EASA approval. The CAA intends to continue to recognise current (and valid) EASA certificates for an initial period of up to two years, but no decision has been made about ongoing validity after this period." and to Q #3 "Yes. your training will be recognised for up to two years after UK participation in EASA ceases if you are training with at an ATO or DTO located outside the UK which had their Approval Certificate issued prior to the end of the transition period and which continued to be valid during the training period.". They also now say, as Alrosa says above, that an "EU issued Part-FCL" licence holder will need a UK CAA validation to fly a G reg aircraft.
The actual rule seems to come from a statutory instrument SI 2019/645, Schedule 3, para 2: "2.—(1) Subject to paragraph 3, any other licence, certificate or approval issued by the European Aviation Safety Agency or by the national competent authority of an EEA state which continues to be in force or effective on or after exit day by virtue of Part 3 of Schedule 8 to the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018, is— (a) to continue to be in force or effective on and after exit day for the remainder of its validity period up to a maximum of 2 years (subject to any earlier suspension or cancellation by the CAA); and (b) to be treated as if it were issued by the CAA. (2) This paragraph applies only to documents issued under Regulation (EU) No 2018/1139 and EU implementing Regulations made under it."
The actual rule seems to come from a statutory instrument SI 2019/645, Schedule 3, para 2: "2.—(1) Subject to paragraph 3, any other licence, certificate or approval issued by the European Aviation Safety Agency or by the national competent authority of an EEA state which continues to be in force or effective on or after exit day by virtue of Part 3 of Schedule 8 to the European Union (Withdrawal) Act 2018, is— (a) to continue to be in force or effective on and after exit day for the remainder of its validity period up to a maximum of 2 years (subject to any earlier suspension or cancellation by the CAA); and (b) to be treated as if it were issued by the CAA. (2) This paragraph applies only to documents issued under Regulation (EU) No 2018/1139 and EU implementing Regulations made under it."
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Slightly off topic but wondering if anyone could help.
the IAA have recently told me that they can’t complete my SOLI transfer since I don’t have any current rating. Apparently you need at least one current rating to have the licence issued and compete the transfer process.
Does anyone know any SOLI that accepts transfers without current ratings?
the IAA have recently told me that they can’t complete my SOLI transfer since I don’t have any current rating. Apparently you need at least one current rating to have the licence issued and compete the transfer process.
Does anyone know any SOLI that accepts transfers without current ratings?
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Pardon my dim question, but AFTER Jan 1st 2021, can we not apply to any other EASA Member State for an EASA ATPL and also run your UK ATPL in parallel?
Surely having 2 licenses (UK ATPL and EASA ATPL) is the best option.
Just wondering why people keep talking about transferring when this might be another option.
pea size brain back below parapet.
Surely having 2 licenses (UK ATPL and EASA ATPL) is the best option.
Just wondering why people keep talking about transferring when this might be another option.
pea size brain back below parapet.
fast cruiser
My understanding is under EASA you can’t hold two of the same licence. So whilst UK are in the club you can’t have an CAA and EASA licence. Instead you transfer to the EASA licence.
however once brexit has happened you will be able to apply and gain a second UK licence.
it’s all a bit of a faf, and you need to be careful ratings don’t get lost etc.
My understanding is under EASA you can’t hold two of the same licence. So whilst UK are in the club you can’t have an CAA and EASA licence. Instead you transfer to the EASA licence.
however once brexit has happened you will be able to apply and gain a second UK licence.
it’s all a bit of a faf, and you need to be careful ratings don’t get lost etc.
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No one seems to be able to provide any clarity on it, more a "wait and see" which may very well turn out to be too late for some. It's my understanding though, that come 1 JAN you would no longer be an EASA license holder so from that point not able to transfer to another state (unless some dispensation is granted from EASAs side). It's a pity you can't get the ball rolling with the CAA for processing the UK ATPL, ready to be issued in early JAN because I can see that taking some time and creating a bit of a grey area. Are there any airlines that stipulate that come 1JAN, you must have a UK only ATPL, despite the CAA saying they'll recognise EASA for a couple of years?
No one seems to be able to provide any clarity on it, more a "wait and see" which may very well turn out to be too late for some. It's my understanding though, that come 1 JAN you would no longer be an EASA license holder so from that point not able to transfer to another state (unless some dispensation is granted from EASAs side). It's a pity you can't get the ball rolling with the CAA for processing the UK ATPL, ready to be issued in early JAN because I can see that taking some time and creating a bit of a grey area. Are there any airlines that stipulate that come 1JAN, you must have a UK only ATPL, despite the CAA saying they'll recognise EASA for a couple of years?
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It seems that, if you hold a licence now ith the UK as SOLI, then if you take no action this will become a UK only licence at the end of this year. As some say above there is nothing that says that after this year EASA will treat this as anything other than a third party ICAO licence and, if you wanted an EASA licence after that date you would have to retake all the ATPLs and take an ATPL skill test just like an FAA licence holder would. On the other hand, if you transfer your SOLI now to another EASA State your EASA licence will be maintained and the UK CAA say they will then issue you a UK ATPL on an equivalent basis.