Ryanair Cancelling flights!
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My bold
.
Philip Von Schoeppenthau, General Secretary of the European Cockpit Association on Morning Ireland today.
It shows that the pre-carrier’s employment practices used by this company are not sustainable and must stop. But it also shows that this is not just about annual leave, it’s about poor management of a scheduling risk that was known about one year ago and it was entirely predictable.
And last but not least, I think it shows that something must be seriously wrong with the Irish Aviation Authority and the way it actually oversees its airlines
And last but not least, I think it shows that something must be seriously wrong with the Irish Aviation Authority and the way it actually oversees its airlines
Philip Von Schoeppenthau, General Secretary of the European Cockpit Association on Morning Ireland today.
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From the frying pan into the fire? From one operator who is desperately short of pilots and who cares nothing about anyone to another. And if you are "lucky" make sure you always pay attention, don't miss any radio calls and maintain your situational awareness, especially when pilot monitoring.
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In the eyes of the public,it passes the sniff test.I know it shouldn't but it does.
Why is that? Because the flight crew have lousy if any PR to respond. Why is that if IALPA is awake?
Not a nice airline but a great business. €50 million euro in costs - they would prefer not to have it due to there own poor corporate planning of manpower v aircraft but its peanuts.
Indeed. A few years ago RYR added €2/ticket for EU261 payments after the volcanic ash debacle. Work it out. >€150m pa; how much have they paid out in this years. Pure profit. The pax have already paid for their own compensation.
Why is that? Because the flight crew have lousy if any PR to respond. Why is that if IALPA is awake?
Not a nice airline but a great business. €50 million euro in costs - they would prefer not to have it due to there own poor corporate planning of manpower v aircraft but its peanuts.
Indeed. A few years ago RYR added €2/ticket for EU261 payments after the volcanic ash debacle. Work it out. >€150m pa; how much have they paid out in this years. Pure profit. The pax have already paid for their own compensation.
Last edited by RAT 5; 29th Sep 2017 at 10:32.
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There is a general shortage of Captains at the moment, all over the industry, there is not enough experienced guys to make sure the operations run smoothly.
Add the fact never ending expansions puts even more pressure on the airlines, and there are players in market that are offering better service and quality than Ryanair at the moment, but for passengers and crews.
Sure there the ones happy to pay £1 for a ticket, and £150 for the extras, but I believe the tide or this misrepresentation is about to turn, people are not as DUMB as many airlines have treated them.
Sure you will have the masses of low income families travelling who can only afford Ryanair's flights, however if there is no crews, because of bad treatment, than it shows it's a business model that is not sustainable.
If any here have been a passenger with example Norwegian short haul, and you compare it with Ryanair, you would be amazed, flying as a passenger with Norwegian is probably closer to national carrier levels. Sure they have had their own problems this year, offering pilots £2400 to work on their off / leave days, because they DON'T HAVE ENOUGH pilots.
Listening to MOL, and his lies, I am shocked that there is not a revolt in the company, the total LACK OF RESPECT for the people working for him, and how he constantly plays his PR game, where he insults the whole profession, I am sorry it is disgusting that there is not enough coercion within the company that they don't just refuse to work for such a disrespectful leader as MOL, both towards passengers and crew.
With todays technology, this should not be a problem to organise, or at least work to rule.
What people need to understand, they are DESPERATE for pilots, Norwegian are desperate for pilots, most UK airlines are currently recruiting massive numbers, the companies will not start firing the ones they have at this moment, this is the momentum Ryanair pilots have been waiting for, but they unfortunately seem spineless to seize the moment and make it count.
The PR machine of the pilots and unions are weak, although this is the moment where you would probably even get massive public support, as the anger is growing.
This summer Norwegian offered Captains £2400 a day, to come and work on they off days.
Ryanair could face massive class-action lawsuits.
Ryanair have been trying to be very creative in the way they have handled this, probably actually making money on this.
Add the fact never ending expansions puts even more pressure on the airlines, and there are players in market that are offering better service and quality than Ryanair at the moment, but for passengers and crews.
Sure there the ones happy to pay £1 for a ticket, and £150 for the extras, but I believe the tide or this misrepresentation is about to turn, people are not as DUMB as many airlines have treated them.
Sure you will have the masses of low income families travelling who can only afford Ryanair's flights, however if there is no crews, because of bad treatment, than it shows it's a business model that is not sustainable.
If any here have been a passenger with example Norwegian short haul, and you compare it with Ryanair, you would be amazed, flying as a passenger with Norwegian is probably closer to national carrier levels. Sure they have had their own problems this year, offering pilots £2400 to work on their off / leave days, because they DON'T HAVE ENOUGH pilots.
Listening to MOL, and his lies, I am shocked that there is not a revolt in the company, the total LACK OF RESPECT for the people working for him, and how he constantly plays his PR game, where he insults the whole profession, I am sorry it is disgusting that there is not enough coercion within the company that they don't just refuse to work for such a disrespectful leader as MOL, both towards passengers and crew.
With todays technology, this should not be a problem to organise, or at least work to rule.
What people need to understand, they are DESPERATE for pilots, Norwegian are desperate for pilots, most UK airlines are currently recruiting massive numbers, the companies will not start firing the ones they have at this moment, this is the momentum Ryanair pilots have been waiting for, but they unfortunately seem spineless to seize the moment and make it count.
The PR machine of the pilots and unions are weak, although this is the moment where you would probably even get massive public support, as the anger is growing.
This summer Norwegian offered Captains £2400 a day, to come and work on they off days.
Ryanair could face massive class-action lawsuits.
Ryanair have been trying to be very creative in the way they have handled this, probably actually making money on this.
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A view from SLF ...
I fly, as a passenger, 6-10 times a year.
If Ryanair have a flight that is:
- Between the airports I need
- At a time I want
- Cheap (has to be cheap to put up with the customer service)
then I would, in the past, have used them.
NEVER again - I can't risk them cancelling my flight without THEM paying for the replacement.
I will usually have time off work, accomodation, car hire, etc. booked - so changing dates isn't an option.
By the time they decide to tell me any cheap flights, on other carriers, will be long gone.
If I was a shareholder I would be spitting feathers at the moment.
Shares hit a high of €19.78 6 weeks ago - they are currently down at €16.02 (a 20% fall). The last time they were that low was the beginning of May.
I fly, as a passenger, 6-10 times a year.
If Ryanair have a flight that is:
- Between the airports I need
- At a time I want
- Cheap (has to be cheap to put up with the customer service)
then I would, in the past, have used them.
NEVER again - I can't risk them cancelling my flight without THEM paying for the replacement.
I will usually have time off work, accomodation, car hire, etc. booked - so changing dates isn't an option.
By the time they decide to tell me any cheap flights, on other carriers, will be long gone.
If I was a shareholder I would be spitting feathers at the moment.
Shares hit a high of €19.78 6 weeks ago - they are currently down at €16.02 (a 20% fall). The last time they were that low was the beginning of May.
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“One of the issues that I think we have to address is that maybe we have got the pilot pay a bit on the low side,” O’Leary said. “Maybe we have pushed it a little bit far in terms of pilot pay and pilot productivity.”
Face it O'Leary, your model of IR is dead.They never imagined implementing their twisted logic for workplace control against declining supply. Said elewhere, but adversarial IR is done.
One posits that the poster boy of aviation IR is torn down and his clan of followers from Air Asia's Fernandes to Qantas' Joyce are also shown to be the hollow mean in their part of the world.
Pilots are not the only part of an airline, it takes a huge number of people, but without them there is nothing with which to derive the revenue for all the expensive administrative staff to consume
Face it O'Leary, your model of IR is dead.They never imagined implementing their twisted logic for workplace control against declining supply. Said elewhere, but adversarial IR is done.
One posits that the poster boy of aviation IR is torn down and his clan of followers from Air Asia's Fernandes to Qantas' Joyce are also shown to be the hollow mean in their part of the world.
Pilots are not the only part of an airline, it takes a huge number of people, but without them there is nothing with which to derive the revenue for all the expensive administrative staff to consume
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As a long time airline pilot living far away from Europe I am most pleased to witness the fallout due to o'leary's greed. He is one of the main players responsible for the degeneration of our careers. The low cost carrier model has influenced pilot's salaries and terms and conditions throughout the globe.
I have never and will never encourage my children to become pilots.
The glory days are long gone and will never return. Bring on the pilot shortage
I have never and will never encourage my children to become pilots.
The glory days are long gone and will never return. Bring on the pilot shortage
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Southwest goes from strength to strength by valuing its passengers and employees.O'Leary's lamentable excuse for an airline and many like it drag the industry down.Very few airlines left worth a damn.
Last post for me...this site isnt what it used to be either.
Last post for me...this site isnt what it used to be either.
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Is it difficult for investors to see that Ryanair needs a massive cultural shift in order to ensure long term sustainability? It's impossible to think how the management's existing employment relations model has any future. The multitude of court cases & litigation alongside the disastrous levels of employee/contractor turnover surely doesn't hold much longevity any more? No matter how much PR you spin to the public about being able to magic thousands of crew from the non existent pilot tree, or decisive ECJ rulings not effecting the way you do business; major investors surely must know the facts?
The way flight cancellations have been dealt with has been a fiasco according to both passengers & the CAA. But what exactly are the IAA doing? It all seems a bit strange.
I find it hard to believe how Ryanair will re-invent themselves again after this one. Not exactly fitting with the slogan 'Always getting better.'
The way flight cancellations have been dealt with has been a fiasco according to both passengers & the CAA. But what exactly are the IAA doing? It all seems a bit strange.
I find it hard to believe how Ryanair will re-invent themselves again after this one. Not exactly fitting with the slogan 'Always getting better.'
FR are bleeding cash now - another poster did some rough figures and proposed its around 2M a day in lost Revenues and refunds. Then there's the damage to the brand, and the repercussions of future bookings falling through consumer fears of cancellations.
Yet MOL offers his pilots 10K€ DEFERRED for a YEAR to give up Annual Leave NOW?
If that isn't evidence of pig headed insanity I don't know what is. The house is on fire and he's pissing on the firemen!
On the other hand - nobody wants to see FR fail. The last thing pilots need right now is 4,000 jobless guys on the market. I wish them all the best - I think there's finally light at the end of the tunnel for them.
Yet MOL offers his pilots 10K€ DEFERRED for a YEAR to give up Annual Leave NOW?
If that isn't evidence of pig headed insanity I don't know what is. The house is on fire and he's pissing on the firemen!
On the other hand - nobody wants to see FR fail. The last thing pilots need right now is 4,000 jobless guys on the market. I wish them all the best - I think there's finally light at the end of the tunnel for them.
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I do want to see Ryanair fail. Yes there will be massive unemployment for a short period but other airlines and new ones will step in to cover the gap left by Ryanair.
Their planes and customers will not just simply disappear. It's like the head of a drug cartel, you kill the boss and 3 others step in to take his place.
Their planes and customers will not just simply disappear. It's like the head of a drug cartel, you kill the boss and 3 others step in to take his place.
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RYR will not fail. It is far too cash rich. But it does need to learn some harsh lessons and take a leaf out of South Wests book. That will though require a change of leadership.
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So Ryanair got the info wrong on compensation bit economical with the truth we would probably agree.
So the next question is the 18hr week (1000 flying hours divided by 52 weeks) and "there's no fatigue"
Start making amends Mr OL
So the next question is the 18hr week (1000 flying hours divided by 52 weeks) and "there's no fatigue"
Start making amends Mr OL
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This might be a disaster for Ryanair but it is also bad for the whole of the industry who seem not to give a toss about the customer. Sooner or later they will say enough is enough of being dragged off the cattle transports, their travel arrangements thrown into disarray by flight delays and cancellations, being frisked, stripped searched, stacked and packed into gulag queues, sleeping on terminal floors and suffering all manner of ignonimity for the pathetic pleasures of a litre or two of cheap lager, sangria or some other foul concoction under the mosquito infested skies above some distant shore.
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I wouldn't lose any sleep if FR failed but it's not going to happen. In an ideal world we could do without RYR, Small Planet, Smart Lynx, Primera, l'avion all of whom use some pretty dodgy HR practices but the CAA just press the ignore button until they are shamed into it.
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Even Mo Farah has a bit of fat and I bet he 'carbs himself up' before a race. Anything that runs lean, mean and flat out will eventually crash for the sake a carrying a bit of fat. It might best be called "resilience". It means you still have a buffer should the unexpected occur. The multi-millionaire MOL has been caught short by the monster he has created. RYR will survive but will they and other organisations learn from his basic mistake. If you rip the heart out of you business and replace it with cash, you have no value. Man needs more than cash to live. RYR will have less cash left after this debacle, but will they have learnt their lesson?