Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Terms and Endearment
Reload this Page >

Norwegian Lack of Pilots

Terms and Endearment The forum the bean counters hoped would never happen. Your news on pay, rostering, allowances, extras and negotiations where you work - scheduled, charter or contract.

Norwegian Lack of Pilots

Old 15th Aug 2017, 07:20
  #181 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Anyone else can't start the online assessment or had this happend before? I emailed the support and they say its a technical problem with them.
ChevyAirlines is offline  
Old 15th Aug 2017, 11:12
  #182 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Paris
Age: 46
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Even if they are open tests may freeze and lock before you finish. I had to request help twice in order to complete them.

I did mine for the 787 fleet 8 days ago and now waiting patiently to see what happens.

Does anyone know how long it takes to receive a PFO?
a-ricky-town is offline  
Old 15th Aug 2017, 12:13
  #183 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Ok. Well for me it doesnt even open the test. Its shows loading for a second and then nothing. Tried every browser, mac and windows and flash is up to date. Emailed them and they said its a technical problem and have to wait untill its fixed. It has been two days now. So must be a serious issue

I was just wondering if anyone else trying to do the test now is having the same problem.
ChevyAirlines is offline  
Old 15th Aug 2017, 12:27
  #184 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Home
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I'm having the same issue
GA F15 is offline  
Old 15th Aug 2017, 16:02
  #185 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Ok thanks for letting me know!
ChevyAirlines is offline  
Old 21st Aug 2017, 11:00
  #186 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Italy
Posts: 137
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Anyhow...
The new strategy of the "intelligence of the Company" wants to change the contract conditions unilaterally...

Be sure about contract conditions before leave your actual employer...
Vulka is online now  
Old 21st Aug 2017, 11:06
  #187 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: .
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Hello all, I am wondering about base allocation in Norwegian, specifically the scandinavian capitol bases. Let's assume you get hired as DEC and get a base in Spain for example. Will you ever get a CPH, OSL or ARN base, or are they only for the chosen ones in core or how does it work? Or does core even exist anymore? I'm confused!
DUPLEX is offline  
Old 21st Aug 2017, 14:47
  #188 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: .
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Regarding the Scandinavian bases, you will not get one of them when you come in as a DEC EVER!!!! There are countless first officers that have not gone for their command in order not to be moved from their home base and they will be first in line, strictly according to the MSL!

If for any reason in the future, they need additional captains in the Scandinavian bases and cannot crew those positions with the people already there and ready to be upgraded, they MAY, and only if the NPU agrees, take on additional captains from the Euro bases, again strictly according to MSL, which at the moment would mean there might be a few hundred people ahead of you, wanting one of those spots, so again, do your time and eventually you MAY get there!

If you now wanted to come in and bid for any of those bases as a captain, you can of course do so, but you're unlikely to ever go there as a captain, if you agree to fly as an F/O, you might stand a chance.
november.sierra is offline  
Old 2nd Sep 2017, 20:34
  #189 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sydney
Posts: 272
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
A Scandinavian base is also coveted due to it being the relative nirvana of labor rights and labor principles. The erosion of these virtues seems proportional to the distance from the region.

A letter to management from the AFA MEC President of Norwegian’s US based 787 cabin crews, was provided in a report by Dagbladet newspaper yesterday, 9/1:

https://www.dagbladet.no/nyheter/til...rensa/68649490

http://cabinassociation.org/wp-conte...en08172017.pdf

The letter raises a number of management shortcomings and issues. The same OSM and Norwegian management decide and implement the terms and conditions for the pilots, which may be a factor in the shortage:

“As you may already know, rostering has always been a problem at our company and will continue to be a problem until an adequate bidding program is implemented”.

“The poor decisions of Norwegian management have forced many cabin crew members to seek second jobs, rely on family for support, and quit our company altogether”.

“I’m not sure what you are being told by OSM or those you count on to give you the correct information, but I can assure you that saying we are paid “competitive wages and benefits” is a false statement—especially at this juncture”.

The treatment described in the letter contradicts the “Norwegian family” ethos marketed to applicants. Apparently, the Atlantic not only separates families but also comparable terms and conditions. Perhaps the adoption of the powerful AFA union upset the dysfunctional relatives in Fornebu.

(cue the messenger assassins……)
Direct Bondi is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 17:02
  #190 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: FL430
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/articl...ng-out-of-cash

Apparently O'Leary says it's not lack of pilots but lack of cash. And Norwegian will run out of it in 4-5 months.
Dualbleed is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 18:01
  #191 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Never home
Age: 36
Posts: 70
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I'm not saying that there isn't any truth behind in what MOL claims here, but what else would you expect from him in a situation where they're losing a lot of pilots to other airlines. I believe that this was targeted to the pilots who are thinking of jumping ship to Norwegian, Monarch, easy etc. But I'm pretty sure Ryanair will not be the only one surviving, and who knows, maybe they even won't be as profitable in the future if the lack of experienced pilots really hits them as hard as suggested in the other thread them.
FRogge is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 19:06
  #192 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: north of barlu
Posts: 6,207
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The whole industry is short of experienced pilots and it will be those offering the best remuneration/ lifestyle package that will get the flight crew they need but this is not the only limiting factor in the industry , the lack of skilled maintenance staff is worse than pilots.
A and C is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 19:56
  #193 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: last time I looked I was still here.
Posts: 4,507
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
And I wonder if MOL is shedding a tear for NAS, or is he suddenly hoping that his own 'talked about' shortage of crews will suddenly disappear.: as will the cabin crew & engineer dry supply.
RAT 5 is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 20:03
  #194 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: On The Road
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
MOL is an advocate for Ryan, but he also has a known issue with running off at the mouth and dramatizing things.
Every airline has their own unique circumstances, but they all have this in common; unless they take care of their crews, they will all lose personnel to other airlines that offer better packages. Airlines especially need crews to grow! And there is a major shortage of experienced pilots, which I suspect is why MOL was spreading rumors about his competition. Ryan has been hemorrhaging experienced pilots to other carriers that offer more.
JetpoweredMigrantWkr is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 20:34
  #195 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: UK
Posts: 204
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Norwegian & Monarch will have had an expensive year with fleet renewal and in Norwegians case near 30% growth plans including setting up an Argentinan AOC,HQ refurbishment, introducing the MAX, ETOPS training for 737 crews and a large number of new routes and dream-liners to fly them and their crews.

It is no secret that pilots are leaving Ryanair to Norwegian & Jet2, Monarch will shortly start recruiting more 737 rated f/o's and rumour of DEC will only add to FR shortage.

So I guess by suggesting that these airlines may not last suits his agenda.

Of course given FR cash pile it is within their recourse to address the underlying reason for their own pilot attrition.
EIFFS is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 22:08
  #196 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: last time I looked I was still here.
Posts: 4,507
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Airlines especially need crews to grow! And there is a major shortage of experienced pilots, Ryan has been hemorrhaging experienced pilots to other carriers that offer more.

Perhaps true, but there is also a perceived idea that RYR had an alleged predatory philosophy & business model that caused the demise of competition thereby creating a supply of desperate workers who would work for any T's & C's they could get. Hence RYR could expand into vacuums, of their own creating, very cheaply. Very capitalistic and dog eat dog, survival of the finest and live by the laws of the jungle. Thus they had no need to raise incomes, indeed they have been effectively reduced.
Perhaps that is starting to change. We shall see.
RAT 5 is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 23:28
  #197 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 902
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
As they say, 'turnover is vanity, profit is sanity'. MoL has made a lot of profit for RYR, which can't be said of some of the competition. I'd take notice of this if I were moving on from RYR to pastures new.
macdo is offline  
Old 3rd Sep 2017, 23:48
  #198 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: FL430
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I would definitely work for RYR or NOR if they treated you with respect, and salary like Southwest Airlines and the likes. Final Salay pension pension would be a bonus, as was the norm in days gone by. Maybe 25+ % employer contribution in money purchase pension schemes instead would get qualified pilots flocking to your companies.
As of now I'm a happy camper with almost all above.
Dualbleed is offline  
Old 8th Sep 2017, 16:39
  #199 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: The rock
Posts: 291
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
This link explains everything:

Norwegian on Ryanair attack: O'Leary is bitter about losing his pilots to us - Business Insider Nordic
matt283 is offline  
Old 10th Sep 2017, 12:49
  #200 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sydney
Posts: 272
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The post above references an article first appearing in Svenska Dagbladet:

https://www.svd.se/norwegian-pilotva...hefens-angrepp

Responding to O’Leary’s comments a Norwegian paid mouthpiece told the newspaper; “So far this year we have employed close to 140 Ryanair pilots. With us, they get permanent employment in a Norwegian company and receive market wages”.

OSM Aviation Ireland Limited is listed with Companies Registration Office as a private company with no reference to a Norwegian airline whatsoever:
https://www.cro.ie/en-ie/

It is implausible to suggest Norwegian’s atypical labor scheme is “permanent employment”. A pilot contract applicable to Norwegian is on file with the DOT. Clause 10.b permits the client Norwegian airline to terminate the rental agreement(s) with the agency for pilot(s) services without notice, reason or recourse. A 30-days notice period is with the employer agency, not the airline. Read the contract!

DN newspaper quotes another Norwegian paid mouthpiece; “What we have to say in this case is that this is a classic O’Leary tulle (joke) game that has no root in reality”: https://www.dn.no/nyheter/2017/09/04...k-tulleutspill

E24 news reported; “The fall of the Norwegian share Monday is due to statements by Ryanair chief Michael O’Leary that Bjorn Kjos & Co is in financial trouble”:
http://e24.no/naeringsliv/luftfart/a...ksjen/24133128

There are no reports of Norwegian seeking redress against O’Leary for his “joke” comments, but there is a previous report Norwegian threatened to sue a homeless, penniless, single mother – “I was told that the top boss at Norwegian threatened to sue me for bad publicity. The conversation was very threatening. It was like an interrogation for committing a crime”:
https://www.dagbladet.no/nyheter/fol...angel/60848976

Other than Scandinavia, Norwegian’s pilots have no collective labor agreement with the airline, only with their service provider agency. Ryanair pilots should consider Norwegian’s hypocrisy and bullying propensity before abandoning the rock solid 5 on 4 off roster and directness of O’Leary.
Direct Bondi is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.