Jumpseating (Non-Rev) Privileges in Europe

[Denti]

In the US you are technically a crew member on duty (meaning no booze etc.) when riding the JS,

Tells something like that to EASA and they insist that it is active duty and therefore counts into duty and flight duty times and has to be accounted for in you maximum remaining daily and cumulative duty time limits. And at that point airlines would shoot it down.

[Check Airman]

I wouldn't consider it duty. Airlines here don't consider it duty. You're commuting on your own time and dime. Rightfully or wrongfully, the airline isn't concerned with how you get to or from work.

[EAM]

In Italy you can jumpseat as well, but the companies need to have an agreement with each other.

My company does count it as flight duty time and it is our responsibility to ensure that it doesn't screw the rest of your duty, and even it is your on time, as long as you are jumpseating with your own airline, they are aware of you commuting they have to take it into account.

A system like in the US or in Spain to jumpseat would be great, but this would not work in Germany, as german people are very jealous and don't like it if someone gets something for free that others don't get. So we have something which is called "Geldwerter Vorteil" I don't think it is possible to translate this into another language, it means for the ID tickets, that if you pay 50€ for the ID ticket and the normal fair is 500€, you have to pay tax on the difference of 450€, because it is considers to be part of your salary. Don't ask, its just the way it is, we are famous for our taxes. ;-)
Now you would say, well a jumpseat cost 0€ that makes 0€ on tax..........nope, 0€ on tax, means NoGo.

[MD80rookie]

I am with SAS, and we happily accept industry colleagues on jumpseat provided they have a ticket.

[bradandwhitney]

Now you would say, well a jumpseat cost 0€ that makes 0€ on tax..........nope, 0€ on tax, means NoGo.

The only way it could work would be as it is working in the US and Canada. CASS is more of a "federal" thing, Airlines may participate if they fulfill the requirements. In Europe it would have to be EU law (which is supranational, Germany wouldn't have a choice concerning taxes - you cannot tax something that isn't for sale, right?) worked out via an EASA proposal up to the EU commission and then parliament. (..."xyz personnel may, if registered and verified against the BFSASCD biometrical flight station access security system central database, and if the commander approves, occupy additional seats on the flight station, thereby acting as additional observing crewmember whereby any such action shall not towards flight duty time limit etc.. etc..)

The way this usually works is that lobbyists have a nice draft of the law they lobby for and sweet talk it to EU politicians over dinner (repeatedly).

Once again, it would primarily be a safety/security initiative - have a central database (updated "live") of people who are approved to access a flight deck. Without a real agenda though (lots of pilot working together to lobby) it will never happen...

[manflexsrsrwy]

still done where I work, southern europe national airline

[EAM]

I am with SAS, and we happily accept industry colleagues on jumpseat provided they have a ticket.

Well thats the point, you give a jumpseat to a colleague in case there is no other seat available and he has a ticket,
but the thing about jumpseating is, that you don't need a ticket and that only works in the southern countries of Europe.
In my last company I paid around 100€ for a return flight to get home, quite something for a stby ticket.

I don't think that it would ever be possible in Europe, as many people are already jealous that we get "cheap tickets" while making these hough salaries.
They would go mad if we could go home for free.

[bradandwhitney]

They would go mad if we could go home for free.

Who cares?

[EAM]

Well the office people care and they are the one who decide.
"If I can't have it, they can't have" sad but true.

[Denti]

Well the office people care and they are the one who decide.

Indeed, they do. We lost the ability to take any crew member on the jumps after the CEO of a major shareholder (and unmentionable airline) saw someone in civvies enter the flightdeck on a plane of one of our subsidiary companies and made a huge fuss about it.

[bradandwhitney]

Guess it's time to move across the pond then...

[tomuchwork]

@bradandwhitney

Nahhhh, we are not THAT desperate over here in Europe.

Stby is anyway a gamble, always was. Nowadays, with full planes it is even worse. I barely used stby, always a pain in the ass the stress if you make it or not.

If you are on duty it's the companies responsibility to bring me there, so I give a **** about how they do it.

In my free time I prefer to use anything else then an airline, again, such a pain in the *** nowadays to fly, with luggage or even the family. Pack everything in my van, drive when and how I want. Bring whatever I want(funny to say as an airline pilot, but sadly true).

Flightdeck jumpseat - was fun in my young days, so easy, no real regulations about it as it should really be. The Captain decided about "his" seat(s)" at the flightdeck, no one else(except an inspector of the authority thought it would be the right time to do an "ad hoc" checkflight which really never happened).

Today - as everything in aviation - made complicated by bureaucrats. Even do not bother to ask anymore for a jump. Just everything about aviation went down the drain. Bitter - yes. True - yes.