Norwegian VS Ryanair
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...and they are about to sign a deal with FTE Jerez to take on their cadets as well as the self sponsored TR scheme they recently opened up. WTF is the long term thinking here???? 
Join Date: Dec 2012
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I doubt it is an "honest mistake" by the Crew Planners, and would be more inclined to believe it is has been (repeatedly another cynical attempt to recreate a facet of the "Ryanair model", that rather ironically, Ryanair are themselves slowly moving away from.
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Yeah but what I've heard in Ryanair it's only a month rather than 6 months in Norwegian... (please correct me if I'm wrong)
On the other hand I think if one flies approx 800 hrs a year, a month off is a nice break for holidays.
Does anyone have any information on how many pilots Norwegian has and how many have been laid off for winter?
On the other hand I think if one flies approx 800 hrs a year, a month off is a nice break for holidays.
Does anyone have any information on how many pilots Norwegian has and how many have been laid off for winter?
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In Norwegian they are more polite and treat you a bit better but they are quite disorganized at the moment and training might take for ever. In Ryanair they are better organized for training and the command upgrade is certainly quicker but they treat you like a number with almost no respect.
Join Date: Apr 2002
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SierraEchoCharlie "As an FTE cadet who would you prefer to work for?"
Well, history suggests the choice is fairly straightforward & it doesn't just apply to Cadets, equally applicable to experienced FO's looking for a "structured" / "transparent" path to Command, permanent year round employment, and some Base stability.
The last 2 Winters NA(?) . . . too many permutations to enter the last letter . . . . has layed pilots off / forced some to take unpaid leave / forced some to take 50% work / told others (who had paid for the TR with them ) to come back in 6mths or pay the Bond NOW ! / changed bases for many who were quite happy in their European mainland base due to reduced production ( a Winter in the Canaries is very pleasant, but it didn't suit many who commute ) / changed during their OCC the bases/ contracts/ type of employment they thought they had just signed for from Spain/ Gatwick to Scandinavia . . . . sign here or leave the course being the 2 options on offer / changed agencies & threatened those who didn't appreciate the "new kid on the block" with termination due to their obvious wish not to continue their career in Norwegian
even though they are not actually employed by Norwegian/ Introduced a new AOC & associated system that has completely failed to roster/train/organise the flying programme with anything approaching the level enjoyed by Contractors operating under the "NAS" regime up in Norway. Allowed (nay encouraged I would wager ) their preferred pilot "employer" to issue bullying emails as regards providing documentation, satisfying Govt agencies etc during their own time, with the implied or actual threat of dismissal if anyone dissented.
Meanwhile, Ryanair, whilst not exactly on a charm campaign, have continued to provide year round employment , base stability (unless you are at one of the mercifully few bases that are a bit "seasonal") roster stability, & transparent /rapid progression to Command. Yes there are more (false ) smiles from Fornebu, but I prefer an honest scowl to a two-faced stab in the back by a "smiling assassin".
The choice (as Cilla Black used to say ) is yours, &, I am shocked to find myself suggesting that Blue / Yellow may be a better choice than Red/White, but, as the "Norwegian Way" rears it's ugly head now the constraints of the Scandinavian employment model have been well & truly cast aside, my recommendations of 4 years ago (which I followed) are turned on their head. Inflight wifi is fine, but it loses its sheen when, via this medium, you find out 4 hrs into a 5hr sector that you appear to have been summarily dismissed for publishing truthful (Oh dear can't have that
) comments on here & the company internal forum during the pilot strike (without the simple courtesy being extended of someone actually contacting you , to inform you of the fact)
Freemasonic sycophants, if thats what floats your boat, good luck with it.
Well, history suggests the choice is fairly straightforward & it doesn't just apply to Cadets, equally applicable to experienced FO's looking for a "structured" / "transparent" path to Command, permanent year round employment, and some Base stability.
The last 2 Winters NA(?) . . . too many permutations to enter the last letter . . . . has layed pilots off / forced some to take unpaid leave / forced some to take 50% work / told others (who had paid for the TR with them ) to come back in 6mths or pay the Bond NOW ! / changed bases for many who were quite happy in their European mainland base due to reduced production ( a Winter in the Canaries is very pleasant, but it didn't suit many who commute ) / changed during their OCC the bases/ contracts/ type of employment they thought they had just signed for from Spain/ Gatwick to Scandinavia . . . . sign here or leave the course being the 2 options on offer / changed agencies & threatened those who didn't appreciate the "new kid on the block" with termination due to their obvious wish not to continue their career in Norwegian
even though they are not actually employed by Norwegian/ Introduced a new AOC & associated system that has completely failed to roster/train/organise the flying programme with anything approaching the level enjoyed by Contractors operating under the "NAS" regime up in Norway. Allowed (nay encouraged I would wager ) their preferred pilot "employer" to issue bullying emails as regards providing documentation, satisfying Govt agencies etc during their own time, with the implied or actual threat of dismissal if anyone dissented.Meanwhile, Ryanair, whilst not exactly on a charm campaign, have continued to provide year round employment , base stability (unless you are at one of the mercifully few bases that are a bit "seasonal") roster stability, & transparent /rapid progression to Command. Yes there are more (false ) smiles from Fornebu, but I prefer an honest scowl to a two-faced stab in the back by a "smiling assassin".
The choice (as Cilla Black used to say ) is yours, &, I am shocked to find myself suggesting that Blue / Yellow may be a better choice than Red/White, but, as the "Norwegian Way" rears it's ugly head now the constraints of the Scandinavian employment model have been well & truly cast aside, my recommendations of 4 years ago (which I followed) are turned on their head. Inflight wifi is fine, but it loses its sheen when, via this medium, you find out 4 hrs into a 5hr sector that you appear to have been summarily dismissed for publishing truthful (Oh dear can't have that
) comments on here & the company internal forum during the pilot strike (without the simple courtesy being extended of someone actually contacting you , to inform you of the fact) Freemasonic sycophants, if thats what floats your boat, good luck with it.
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My 10 cents having dealed with Norwegian Recruitment(agency) and doing the Ryanair Interview(DEC, passed).
Captainplaystation is quiet "spot on" with his post. I personally had as well so mayn promises and false smiles when I joined some outfits just to discover that my contract is not worth the paper it is written on(this includes ALL ME carriers, as most of you are anyway aware of. Still remember my QR contract...).
Surprisingly, and very refreshing, the Ryanair guys did nothing like that on my interview, they told me which contract options are available, differences, bases, salary , benefits(lol). I knew most of it but it is nice that nobody tries to sell you the airline. Even the HR guys asked if we understood everything because he does NOT want to have anyone pissed off upon joining because they thought and expected something different.
I like that. That's why I joined and that's why as well I cancelled my application with Norwegian(even before I passed the RYR interview because for them I would not leave my old employer).
If someone is up for the risk not having a job over the winter season just for the chance to fly a bloody 787, well, then they are maybe worth a shot. I have different "needs" (permanent contract, relativ safe base - of course if you choose one of the smallest ones then don't complain if they close it down, being home every night, relativ good pay for a Captain).
Captainplaystation is quiet "spot on" with his post. I personally had as well so mayn promises and false smiles when I joined some outfits just to discover that my contract is not worth the paper it is written on(this includes ALL ME carriers, as most of you are anyway aware of. Still remember my QR contract...).
Surprisingly, and very refreshing, the Ryanair guys did nothing like that on my interview, they told me which contract options are available, differences, bases, salary , benefits(lol). I knew most of it but it is nice that nobody tries to sell you the airline. Even the HR guys asked if we understood everything because he does NOT want to have anyone pissed off upon joining because they thought and expected something different.
I like that. That's why I joined and that's why as well I cancelled my application with Norwegian(even before I passed the RYR interview because for them I would not leave my old employer).
If someone is up for the risk not having a job over the winter season just for the chance to fly a bloody 787, well, then they are maybe worth a shot. I have different "needs" (permanent contract, relativ safe base - of course if you choose one of the smallest ones then don't complain if they close it down, being home every night, relativ good pay for a Captain).
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Stay away from Nas/Nai this is a complete disaster everything have changed in two years . Much better to try Ryr at least they don't lie you . Much more stable and serious company .
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Meanwhile, Ryanair, whilst not exactly on a charm campaign, have continued to provide year round employment ,
On a serious note, you can approach that dilemma in many ways. Budget on X amount of hours per year and plan your life accordingly. However, the range of hours flown in different bases per year could vary significantly.
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Regarding Norwegian is there safer bases to be at regarding forced leave in winter months. I know a few new cadets and the bases that are being talked about for them include : BCN, AGP , TFS
Are these bases "safer" or a disaster for the winter months?
Appreciate any information from insiders
Are these bases "safer" or a disaster for the winter months?
Appreciate any information from insiders
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Basically, no (in my opinion). It has always been the last joiners that have been 'fired' for the winter, first time around it was 3 months. This year they had the wonderful opportunity to have 6 months, so you may be in any base due to 'production' needs and still be turfed out when they deem you to be surplus to requirements.
Will that happen this year? Who knows but as they promised that after the first time it was a special case I know what I think will happen.
Unfortunately for us, the author of post #28 has been saying it like it is for a long time.....
Will that happen this year? Who knows but as they promised that after the first time it was a special case I know what I think will happen.
Unfortunately for us, the author of post #28 has been saying it like it is for a long time.....
Last edited by disco87; 25th Apr 2016 at 09:16.
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If you are in TFS or LPA Winter is no problem, but less production in Summer, so maybe you have to change base. If you are in BCN , AGP , ALC & you are most junior, expect to spend Winter in the Canaries. LGW/HEL (MAD/FCO ? ) stable year-round production, but, as stated above, if you are most recent entry, don't worry about base change, worry about having some unwanted unpaid leave (or if you are lucky 50% pay cut 
)
)
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Plus no payment when on deadhead flights , no payment during traning (only ground school), no payment increase ( you'll be earing the same after 5,6... years ), no CLA, no union recognition, hotels quality getting worse, Irish crew control a complete disaster ...