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Easyjet DEP recruitment

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Easyjet DEP recruitment

Old 26th Nov 2015, 10:15
  #161 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Somewhere In The South China Sea
Posts: 960
hobnob, completely agree with your top paragraph, it is chicken and egg in a way, but we are unfortunately at the mercy of the European Union as well because the aviation industry in Europe is still pretty much on it's knees so everyone is flooding to the UK for jobs (I'm not xenophobic by the way), this means there is a never ending supply of people willing to throw money at the industry, and if it was confined to the UK only then there might be a little hope that something will give, but we all know it'll never happen.
Easyjet are laughing their socks off, and yes their profits are partly the by-product of us throwing money at them, unfortunately they'll never change unless they have to, so the only way to force a change lies firmly at our feet.

Don't get me started about CTC.
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Old 26th Nov 2015, 10:45
  #162 (permalink)  
 
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In most professions these days individuals are investing in their own future; take university costs. It's not ony pilots who pay for their training so do doctors etc. Many people told the cadets not to pay for their training but they did and now 5 years on in their late twenties many of those pilots have their command and are being paid 100k+. Same with the type rating - if you want the job think ahead and work out if you think the outlay is worth the future remuneration. If you do get on the ladder as soon as you can. This is the way things are now. How many people earn 100k in their late twenties or have in the past; I think this is a good investment? Even BA, who used to prefer raw recruits are now giving preference to those with ratings. Times change and you have to move with the times; in the future it may change again but at the moment this is what we have. To blame easyJet or even aviation is futile.
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Old 26th Nov 2015, 11:07
  #163 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Europe
Posts: 31
To be clear where not blamming easyjet for asking money for a TR, but we are blamming them for asking so much money that the price of the TR is more then doubled!
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Old 26th Nov 2015, 18:33
  #164 (permalink)  
NLP
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 32
I'm a guy who paid the ridiculous sum of money and I do blame easyJet and their partners (CTC/OAA).

Less then 2 weeks before signing the contract I received the exciting news that I had to pay £38.400,- instead of £32.000,-. Goodluck with persuading the bank to pay an extra £6.400,- within 2 weeks. They do not care at all about the financial situation of their new FO's.

Offcourse there is the option to tell them no, with the risk to sit at home for years like many other graduated ab initio pilots.. No thanks.

If a company treats its people well they are loyal. Guess how loyal me and my coursemates are..
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Old 27th Nov 2015, 16:45
  #165 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: UK
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NLP
Do you get accommodation included in the 38k when on the conversion?
I was asked in the summer by a F/O joining FR where was the best place to park his Car as he was going to sleep rough during induction.
Do you get a breakdown of what 38k pays for, i suspect a lot goes straight into someones bank account
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Old 27th Nov 2015, 22:24
  #166 (permalink)  
 
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Easyjet charging 38k i.e. nearly 55k euros for a type rating from cadets is disgusting.

And also asking non rated experienced guys to pay too. It's an absolute shambles.

Why can't they bond experienced guys? Jet2 AFAIK do and also FLYBE. Ryanair are even bonding non rated experienced guys as well on to permanent contracts.

Supply and demand I suppose.
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Old 28th Nov 2015, 03:12
  #167 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
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I'm thinking of investing in a few caravans and parking them around the back of CTC . Would be an excellent induction to the future lifestyle of today's P2F pilots
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Old 28th Nov 2015, 05:13
  #168 (permalink)  
NLP
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
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@Mr Angry from Purley

Nope. You just get an invoice and if you do not pay it before the date you are supposed to, they hire someone else.
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Old 30th Nov 2015, 16:57
  #169 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: uk
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GBP38,400

GBP38,400 for a type rating is disgusting. It is far too low. I would willingly sell my house and all its contents to get a type rating on the easy bus.
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Old 30th Nov 2015, 22:35
  #170 (permalink)  
 
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Folks, I have worked at easyJet for many years and am now a fairly senior pilot in the system. Before you all start ranting at me, I am not a manager and have no part in the recruitment process. In order to understand what is going on here, you have to have an appreciation of the environment easyJet operates in. We are in a vicious battle with Vueling, Ryanair, Norwegian, Monarch and increasingly with the legacy carriers who are all upping their game. Ryanair in particular are buying aircraft at a staggering rate and are increasingly placing them in direct competition against us. All these companies have very low cost bases and virtually none have the encumbrance of Trade Unions to deal with. In stark contrast we, mercifully, are very unionised, but are constantly looking for ways to save money to keep us in number one or two positions at most of our airports. Crew costs are a huge factor for us and if easyJet had its way, we would be just like Ryanair. It is possibly no coincidence that a good number of the pilots we have just recruited have come from there but are now very glad to be at easyJet. Much to the annoyance of our big corporate shareholders, we are not having a special dividend this year, and our share price has dropped markedly since our results came out, largely due to fears about our ability to compete against Ryanair. Therefore, there is enormous pressure to battle over every penny and nowhere is that more evident than initial training costs. Put simply, we need to keep the costs down to compete. What is being offered is not p2f, and it is incredibly foolish to say it is. The type rating cost is frankly not reflective of the true cost, but in reality much more associated with keeping the cost of your salary down. So, love it or hate it, that is the way it is. Right now there are few better or safer places to work other than a national carrier. Presumably if you could get a job at one of those you would not be here on PPRuNe having this discussion, so it sounds like this is as good as it going to get. Therefore my encouragement to you is to decide now if you really want to be part of this.

Given there are literally thousands of low-housed pilots without jobs, if you are a cadet and have a place with easyJet lined up, you are unbelievably fortunate and need to just thank God for the opportunity you have been given. If you are an experienced pilot, and already hate easyJet because of the type rating costs, then you are simply going to work for the wrong company. Do both us and yourselves a huge favour and go somewhere else where you will be more appreciated. If, however, you can see your way to just accepting the harsh economics of our world, then come and join us with a great attitude and a willingness to learn. It is a great place to be overall, with new aircraft, interesting routes, good training, and excellent safety culture and some great colleagues to work with. It is not perfect, but if you choose to have a positive attitude you can have a great time.
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Old 30th Nov 2015, 22:41
  #171 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
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In a vicious battle with Monarch? I have to confess that one made me chuckle.

I'd hazard a guess the real reason the share price has dropped dramatically since the results came out is the little matter of Jihadis mowing down 130 people in a major western city (Europe and the World's most visited city no less) coupled with same Jihadis blowing a Russian A321 out of the sky departing one of the company's profitable destinations.

That kind of stuff has the ability to put a dampener on all airline stocks, as it has. Easyjet is not in isolation in having its share price drop, just look at IAG.

Airline competes with another airline shocker!! I suppose the fact that easyJet posted a £650 Million+ profit competing against Ryanair (and yet increased its profits from last year in the face of the increased competition, converse to your argument) means it can plead poverty.

BA this year comfortably outperformed easyJet's profit despite carrying less passengers and burning more fuel. This is an airline that fully funds not only new type ratings but fully funds conversions onto new fleets. Food for thought.

Just so you know I'm not anti easyJet. Training: Top notch, Colleagues: ditto, Variety: Can't be beaten on short haul, Job security: Unparalleled. But the recruitment processes I would not put in the same category and other people have used the words throughout this thread. I will decline to do so although you can maybe guess my opinion.

Last edited by Plastic787; 30th Nov 2015 at 23:41.
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Old 30th Nov 2015, 23:05
  #172 (permalink)  
 
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If you're not a manager, you're sure as hell angling to become one.
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Old 1st Dec 2015, 00:25
  #173 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: UK
Posts: 18
Senior pilots get 15% pay uplift loyality bonus after their 10th year, up to 15% in training positions, pensions, free shares + BAYE/SAYE, fixed pattern.
Some of the new pilots would just dream of


Seems that they just don´t care about the new T&C for new entrants or just
are happy to "live in the expense of the others. If you don´t like it, there is the door. Or be show gratitude and thank God (?) for this fortunate positions.
Sorry, you must be kidding or are being a bit over-sarcastic here.



Very nice attitude indeed mate
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Old 1st Dec 2015, 07:18
  #174 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Eu
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Every 'cadet' that walks through the door has access to the same career progression and contracts that their legacy colleagues had. It just takes a little longer to achieve. That was a key part of the original strategy employed by the union. No matter what way you dress it up £42k isn't a bad start to flying with 200hrs experience. It increases every year despite the rumours because it was designed that way. No change in rank results in less salary even if you end up part-time in the process for a while. The number of days off in the roster is also the very same as the fixed pattern.
Many will go to BA .. Of course .. That's a no brainer if you plan to fly for the next 30+ years. Good luck to them. Easyjet it what it is. Like it or leave is the mantra.

Last edited by Thad Jarvis; 1st Dec 2015 at 07:30.
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Old 1st Dec 2015, 07:48
  #175 (permalink)  
 
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Thad so what about the theoretical guy with 3500 hours who joined on a Parc contract (because that was all that was made available to him in the UK) who is then made permanent and, for all his experience, is now called a "Second Officer"! That's just an insult IMHO and is completely indefensible.

Fair enough for the cadets who have little to bring to the table at their level of experience but this guy has experience of flying turboprops into very challenging conditions on multi sector days at an airline that doesn't create such a sanitised, challenge-free environment for its FO's. Not only that but he also has a couple of thousand hours of jet experience yet is rewarded for his five years in the industry with the title of Second Officer and remuneration in line with a 250 hour cadet. That's wrong and you know it.

The trouble is the whole contract and recruitment process from A to Z for First Officers at easyJet is now designed for cadets with no commercial experience. The contracts and whole process of progression are woefully inappropriate for anyone joining with any significant level of experience. (But let's face it, those numbers are in the minority so what do the company care?)

The same First Officer we are speaking of can virtually double their take home pay overnight if they go to BA, so that's exactly what they are doing (as you have rightly said). Are easyJet fully conversant with the numbers about to walk out the door?

Last edited by Plastic787; 1st Dec 2015 at 08:21.
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Old 1st Dec 2015, 07:57
  #176 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: England
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It just takes a little longer to achieve.
Too right, and in the face of so many other opportunities who wants to be slaving around waiting that long? Delaying the opportunity for your cadets to become real pilots with real terms and conditions is simply another way to get them to accept being paid a lower salary over a longer period of time. The EZY machine knows full well that if anyone leaves (I would say 33-50% do) then the sausage factory known as CTC will be there to help out. My airline (a UK charter) has hired close to 20 ex EZY Flexicrew over the last 12 months and will no doubt hire many more next year. All on a full time contract, with a salary grossing them in the region of £70k in year one. And we've seen more troubled times than EZY. Corporate greed and exploitation of the dreams and ambitions of youngsters, that's what EasyJet is all about.
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Old 1st Dec 2015, 08:27
  #177 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Plastic,

During the recent full year results presentation a city analyst asked the CEO directly if easy would have enough pilots for next year. She replied that the airline would and the head of flight ops ( in the audience ) agreed as well.

Interesting Summer if they have got it wrong......
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Old 1st Dec 2015, 09:50
  #178 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: France
Posts: 169
My airline (a UK charter) has hired close to 20 ex EZY Flexicrew over the last 12 months and will no doubt hire many more next year. All on a full time contract, with a salary grossing them in the region of £70k in year one. And we've seen more troubled times than EZY. Corporate greed and exploitation of the dreams and ambitions of youngsters, that's what EasyJet is all about
Anywhere near the bottom of the seniority list (bottom 80 or so) in that particular UK charter is a very uncomfortable place to be. In the last 'troubled times', the number of forced base moves, demotions, fleet changes etc. was staggering. People who'd been captains for the best part of a decade didn't have the seniority to avoid demotion in base.

Worth remembering too that significant numbers of the cadets hired back in 2008/9 were given six month contracts, laid off for the winter, then brought back the next summer on a new short term contract, then laid off for the winter again, then finally hired on a permanent contract on pay point one, having accrued no continuous service benefits. Then they were almost immediately told that they may well be at risk of redundancy at the end of the summer (which they were).

No airline holds a monopoly on 'corporate greed and exploitation'.
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Old 1st Dec 2015, 10:24
  #179 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Landing Gear Bay
Posts: 812
[Senior pilots get 15% pay uplift loyality bonus after their 10th year, up to 15% in training positions, pensions, free shares + BAYE/SAYE, fixed pattern.
Some of the new pilots would just dream of


Seems that they just don´t care about the new T&C for new entrants or just
are happy to "live in the expense of the others. If you don´t like it, there is the door. Or be show gratitude and thank God (?) for this fortunate positions.
Sorry, you must be kidding or are being a bit over-sarcastic here.



Very nice attitude indeed mate

ezy320, I think you may have missed a few years of fighting for NE contracts. It was a major issue that the current workforce made sacrifices to reach a clear compromise to have a proper career path for new joiners. All those things you list at the top aren't dreams, they're achievable for any new joiner in their future career with easyJet if they work hard.


I see you're LGW based, feel free to drop me a PM, I'll happily meet up for a coffee and we can have a chat.
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Old 1st Dec 2015, 15:13
  #180 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Sand free now
Posts: 193
Good post Plastic787. Exactly why this thread should be Easyjet Cadet recruitment. Experienced pilots are not inclined to take a second officer position when within touching distance of a LHS. But then, these are not the guys/girls Ej want.
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