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Hi all,
Just for info the BA PRIAM bidding process has just opened and will stay open for the next month. This is the system that allows current BA pilots to put in a request for a fleet transfer. It is seniority based, and takes into account forecast vacancies, retirements, part time requests, fleet growth or decline and any freezes relevant to the individual.
Bidding now is for the training year starting Jan '17 and it is worth noting that this will be the first time that those pilot who started in 2012, when recruitment started to ramp up, will be able to bid without the initial 5 year freeze. Once the bidding closes BA then allocates courses on a seniority basis and then looks at what seats it has left and recruits appropriately.
What this means in terms of numbers and LH/SH I have no idea and I suspect neither will BA until the end of the summer/ early autumn.
Regards
Just for info the BA PRIAM bidding process has just opened and will stay open for the next month. This is the system that allows current BA pilots to put in a request for a fleet transfer. It is seniority based, and takes into account forecast vacancies, retirements, part time requests, fleet growth or decline and any freezes relevant to the individual.
Bidding now is for the training year starting Jan '17 and it is worth noting that this will be the first time that those pilot who started in 2012, when recruitment started to ramp up, will be able to bid without the initial 5 year freeze. Once the bidding closes BA then allocates courses on a seniority basis and then looks at what seats it has left and recruits appropriately.
What this means in terms of numbers and LH/SH I have no idea and I suspect neither will BA until the end of the summer/ early autumn.
Regards
Last edited by binsleepen; 4th Jul 2016 at 08:12. Reason: speeling eror
Join Date: Nov 2007
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I would not be overly pessimistic about the effect of BREXIT.
Revenue has been under pressure for a while now and the industry trend is downward at the moment.
Companies like BA will fair much better than the larger ones out there in the long run as long as Mr Cruz does not go mad.
Whilst some fixed and variable costs will go up with the weakened pound we are neutrally hedged on a number of fronts.
The 747 plan will remain unchanged. We own them, and they are full so making good money, so I do not foresee a huge change in the retirement plan for them.
Biggest threat to employees / pilots is the company itself using the present uncertainty to leverage more efficiency and cost reductions.
As a manager I told guys years ago "Go part time asap and do something that either makes you happy, or rich (not necessarily monetary) in your spare time but do not rely on BA in the future to deliver on all your needs".
My advice remains un changed.
Off on holiday.....
Hope your well Wiggy.
Revenue has been under pressure for a while now and the industry trend is downward at the moment.
Companies like BA will fair much better than the larger ones out there in the long run as long as Mr Cruz does not go mad.
Whilst some fixed and variable costs will go up with the weakened pound we are neutrally hedged on a number of fronts.
The 747 plan will remain unchanged. We own them, and they are full so making good money, so I do not foresee a huge change in the retirement plan for them.
Biggest threat to employees / pilots is the company itself using the present uncertainty to leverage more efficiency and cost reductions.
As a manager I told guys years ago "Go part time asap and do something that either makes you happy, or rich (not necessarily monetary) in your spare time but do not rely on BA in the future to deliver on all your needs".
My advice remains un changed.
Off on holiday.....
Hope your well Wiggy.
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It looks like the A320 campaign has just opened...it also looks like the window is quite short too, end date of 27th July!
https://jobs.ba.com/jobs/vacancy/584/description
https://jobs.ba.com/jobs/vacancy/584/description
Last edited by JazzyKex; 14th Jul 2016 at 09:41. Reason: Hyperlink didn't work!
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[QUOTE=JazzyKex;9439321]It looks like the A320 campaign has just opened...it also looks like the window is quite short too, end date of 27th July!
https://jobs.ba.com/jobs/vacancy/584/description
https://jobs.ba.com/jobs/vacancy/584/description
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Hi, may I ask you when did you book the slot for the sim assessment?
I'm trying to book a sim slot since the beginning of june but on the webpage says "slots not available".
Best Regards,
Angelo26
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I always looked at BA but I'm not sure what the actual positives are beyond the ones of variety, large company, image. Those are low down on my personal list. Genuine question, reading though the threads it seems a common theme:-
1/900 hours pa airline. Only one in UK that does this LH
2/ changing terms, not for better with variable flight pay, bidline going
3/ New boss with cost cutting on horizon
4/ decent pay but not the best
5/ only base south east
I was reading the VS thread and it seems they get paid more and fly a lot less. People who fly for Thomas Cook, Mon, Thomson seem happy with the lifestyle. So what apart from the image and reckoned security attracts people to BA lifestyle wise? It has to be lifestyle as priority surely? Even with bidline you still fly max hours. Just seems reading its potentially worse than likes of Vs or charter operators. Has anyone joined BA recently and regretted it?
Please don't take this as a dig, I'm interested. I considered applying but I am not sure it's for me and for the reasons above so interested to hear what those on t' inside thought of these things.
1/900 hours pa airline. Only one in UK that does this LH
2/ changing terms, not for better with variable flight pay, bidline going
3/ New boss with cost cutting on horizon
4/ decent pay but not the best
5/ only base south east
I was reading the VS thread and it seems they get paid more and fly a lot less. People who fly for Thomas Cook, Mon, Thomson seem happy with the lifestyle. So what apart from the image and reckoned security attracts people to BA lifestyle wise? It has to be lifestyle as priority surely? Even with bidline you still fly max hours. Just seems reading its potentially worse than likes of Vs or charter operators. Has anyone joined BA recently and regretted it?
Please don't take this as a dig, I'm interested. I considered applying but I am not sure it's for me and for the reasons above so interested to hear what those on t' inside thought of these things.
Hi Jack, all good questions to ask. If more guys thought like you, the T&C's would probably rise. Sadly, if I was a young thrusting pilot with a few thousand hours and a decent type rating, I would be looking East. The way aviation is regarded and taxed in the Uk and EU, it is a dying industry. For a semi decent lifestyle and decent money , stay out of the U.K. By decent money , I'm talking 100K+ take home.
Many of us in BA do ok because we joined 20+ years ago, and are towards the top of the seniority lists for bidding. Many live abroad, paying reduced levels of taxation.
If I had other options, I don't think I'd join BA again, knowing I'd be stuck in the SE.
Many of us in BA do ok because we joined 20+ years ago, and are towards the top of the seniority lists for bidding. Many live abroad, paying reduced levels of taxation.
If I had other options, I don't think I'd join BA again, knowing I'd be stuck in the SE.
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Hi Jack
some really good questions and having been at BA now 18 months i'd say a lot of your assumptions are right!
I'm LH and never worked so hard in my career and the tiredness is a killer if you aren't the type that can just sleep anywhere!
EASA has certainly made getting good chunks of time off a lot harder add to which if you leave a gap of more than 3 days you risk being forced assigned anyway! Lots of Trip 2 days off trip 2 days off trip 2 days off and after a while you just don't feel recovered.
Bidline going who knows how the new system will be until it comes in but the sceptical side of me thinks it will be much like a Blind Line with very little control especially if junior but time will tell.
The new boss definitely has cost cutting on the agenda how much of that will come our way no one knows but one of the biggest things as a newbie in BA that surprised me is how low morale is on the line, i guess for many the reality of being in BA and not being immune to the downward changes going on is starting to sink in for many. That said the people you fly with are mostly great and no different from any of the other airlines I've worked at.
I'd say the command gradient is shallow at BA you are given a lot of responsibility on your sector as an FO which i think is good for progression.
If you want a big corporate and the security that goes with it then i guess BA gives that a big tick but i came from a bucket and spade company where the airport was 35 mins away and i was home every night and felt like my flying skills were much sharper than they are now! Never felt as tired as i do now and was Parked back outside my house within 55 mins of shutting engines down, now I'm lucky if i am at my car within that time.
All i'd say is BA certainly is not the holy grail it once was but you know that already, but many don't and i think once the honeymoon period is over some will be in for disappointment. The current work load is not sustainable full time in my opinion unless you want serious health issues or death early into your retirement which i guess is why many are going earlier than planned at the top! I flew with a skipper who was 75% a few months back, he said he's working harder 75% than he was full time 6 years ago! I have a mate at VS and he doesn't work anywhere near as hard. I guess do what works for you. Hope that helps.
some really good questions and having been at BA now 18 months i'd say a lot of your assumptions are right!
I'm LH and never worked so hard in my career and the tiredness is a killer if you aren't the type that can just sleep anywhere!
EASA has certainly made getting good chunks of time off a lot harder add to which if you leave a gap of more than 3 days you risk being forced assigned anyway! Lots of Trip 2 days off trip 2 days off trip 2 days off and after a while you just don't feel recovered.
Bidline going who knows how the new system will be until it comes in but the sceptical side of me thinks it will be much like a Blind Line with very little control especially if junior but time will tell.
The new boss definitely has cost cutting on the agenda how much of that will come our way no one knows but one of the biggest things as a newbie in BA that surprised me is how low morale is on the line, i guess for many the reality of being in BA and not being immune to the downward changes going on is starting to sink in for many. That said the people you fly with are mostly great and no different from any of the other airlines I've worked at.
I'd say the command gradient is shallow at BA you are given a lot of responsibility on your sector as an FO which i think is good for progression.
If you want a big corporate and the security that goes with it then i guess BA gives that a big tick but i came from a bucket and spade company where the airport was 35 mins away and i was home every night and felt like my flying skills were much sharper than they are now! Never felt as tired as i do now and was Parked back outside my house within 55 mins of shutting engines down, now I'm lucky if i am at my car within that time.
All i'd say is BA certainly is not the holy grail it once was but you know that already, but many don't and i think once the honeymoon period is over some will be in for disappointment. The current work load is not sustainable full time in my opinion unless you want serious health issues or death early into your retirement which i guess is why many are going earlier than planned at the top! I flew with a skipper who was 75% a few months back, he said he's working harder 75% than he was full time 6 years ago! I have a mate at VS and he doesn't work anywhere near as hard. I guess do what works for you. Hope that helps.
Interesting questions from Jack, and I wouldn't quibble with the responses.
In my experience that sounds very credible.
Judging by the numbers trying to get onto one of the part time contracts you are not alone in that belief. The ability to sustain the full time workload is becoming a major concern for many, in both seats.
I flew with a skipper who was 75% a few months back, he said he's working harder 75% than he was full time 6 years ago!
The current work load is not sustainable full time in my opinion
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Interesting the 900 hour point. Some great stuff from BA people above.
Far from me to say I know about BA's approach being a cantankerous fart, but they've always struck me as being a very safe, cautious lot riddled with an approach not to push up to fixed safety limits. Presume like most they don't like pushing to limits on anything regularly - it's bad practice. Odd then that they regularly and decisively push crew to the legal limit on hours.
Far from me to say I know about BA's approach being a cantankerous fart, but they've always struck me as being a very safe, cautious lot riddled with an approach not to push up to fixed safety limits. Presume like most they don't like pushing to limits on anything regularly - it's bad practice. Odd then that they regularly and decisively push crew to the legal limit on hours.
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Before we get too hung up on the 900 hrs thing. On the 4 long haul fleets there are only 82 pilots over 800 hrs in the 11 months to 31st Aug (ie within a fighting chance of hitting 900 before 30th Sept). Some of them probably have leave etc that will keep them well below.
That's out of 2800 odd pilots.
There's only around 300 who'll even be over 750hrs in the same 11 months.
It was much worse a few years ago. 1/3 of the 747 fleet were 'on the list' at one point
That's out of 2800 odd pilots.
There's only around 300 who'll even be over 750hrs in the same 11 months.
It was much worse a few years ago. 1/3 of the 747 fleet were 'on the list' at one point
It's not just the 900 hours though is it HM?
There's the whole associated issue of Force assign and it's effect on people's the ability to generate predictable and/or usable block of days off that is causing grief for some in their off duty lives, hence the some of the increased demand for Part Time.
There certainly seems to be an increase of days at work on some fleets (Short haul Duty Rig)....
There's the whole associated issue of Force assign and it's effect on people's the ability to generate predictable and/or usable block of days off that is causing grief for some in their off duty lives, hence the some of the increased demand for Part Time.
There certainly seems to be an increase of days at work on some fleets (Short haul Duty Rig)....
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I'm now in the top 20% of the Airbus RHS and about to move on, but I can report that life as an SFO at BA on short haul is a lot better than other airlines I've worked at. On around 750 hours at the moment although that's less than most.
The main thing for me about BA is the roster stability. I've been force assigned once (my fault for messing up the bid) and other than that its rock solid. The only time it changes is when trips are taken off you for training and they normally apologise for that!
Oh and I don't know how many thousands of pounds of club class travel my wife and I have enjoyed at staff rates, but its a LOT.
So it still does have perks... although other posters are right to point out that there is increasing pressure on terms and conditions at BA.
The main thing for me about BA is the roster stability. I've been force assigned once (my fault for messing up the bid) and other than that its rock solid. The only time it changes is when trips are taken off you for training and they normally apologise for that!
Oh and I don't know how many thousands of pounds of club class travel my wife and I have enjoyed at staff rates, but its a LOT.
So it still does have perks... although other posters are right to point out that there is increasing pressure on terms and conditions at BA.
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I appreciate the replies, it is always best to obtain opinions from those actually working for a company.
I must say I see some positives hinted at but I'm suprised at the little amount of people who say overwhelmingly they have a better quality of life as a result. To me, joining a new company is a big thing that presents large challenges, stressors and gives my family a slight headache so it needs to reward in quality of life. That's why I go to work, so always is my priority.
For a lot of years I always had the opinion that BA would provide a good quality of life and I aspired to join. But I've done some serious digging and tired to ask some searching questions. I tried to get away from the temptation to brush over niggles and wrote down as factually as I could what the draw backs and positives were as if it were a company that was unheard of, and was quite surprised. So suprised I did it again! Hence the reason I asked. I really do appreciate the honest input.
Thanks all.
Cheers
I must say I see some positives hinted at but I'm suprised at the little amount of people who say overwhelmingly they have a better quality of life as a result. To me, joining a new company is a big thing that presents large challenges, stressors and gives my family a slight headache so it needs to reward in quality of life. That's why I go to work, so always is my priority.
For a lot of years I always had the opinion that BA would provide a good quality of life and I aspired to join. But I've done some serious digging and tired to ask some searching questions. I tried to get away from the temptation to brush over niggles and wrote down as factually as I could what the draw backs and positives were as if it were a company that was unheard of, and was quite surprised. So suprised I did it again! Hence the reason I asked. I really do appreciate the honest input.
Thanks all.
Cheers
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Under JSS, force assign becomes known as "optimisation" I believe. But since it all happens before the rosters are published you never get to know how good your roster was before it was "optimised". You can't mourn the loss of something you never knew about I suppose! At least that is my understanding of it.
