BA Direct Entry Pilot.

[wiggy]

Just to avoid misunderstanding and perhaps raised expectations amongst potential joiners I take it by that you mean most of our "long range" ops is 3 pilot. Obviously (?) there's also a heck of a lot of two pilot work around at BA, even on the Long Haul Fleets.

[Threethirty]

Thanks for clarifying that Wiggy

[wiggy]

Hope that didn't come over as "picky"...I know what you were getting at but would just hate to see you being quoted verbatim by a new joiner to Long Haul who has had sight of his/her first JSS train wreck, with " but you said...".

ATB.

[Officer Kite]

Who is the Sky God occupying #1 on the seniority list?

[ETOPS]

Somebody just like you.

[Doug E Style]

Originally Posted by Officer Kite

Who is the Sky God occupying #1 on the seniority list?

Nigel Something

[followthegreens]

Are the new joiners on the 380 only Airbus rated?

There's probably the one exception that brakes the rule, but I'd say yes pretty much all direct entries on the A380 had an Airbus rating when they joined.

[norfolkungood]

Originally Posted by Threethirty

Norfolkungood yes but it’s slightly different in Cathay as you’re flying with 4 crew, most BA flights are 3 crew.

True. Unfortunately seems all our lords and masters want to reduce manning/ rest to the minimum to increase the productivity. Our lot would jump at the chance of 3 man. They tried it but as most of our departures are around midnight the FTLs didn’t quite allow it. We now do a large proportion of our LHs with 2 Second Officers as opposed to a 2 FOs. So the FO just gets the wrong rest and still has to be in the seat for landing! Notwithstanding our experience levels have dropped through the floor.....

I fear for all of us where this is all leading.....

[aaa333]

If the pay rise offer of 11% over three years were to go ahead would that apply to new joiners’ salaries too or only existing employees?

Do guys find they have much savings left over every month with the salary being as low as it is?

Being bottom of the seniority list is it not still possible to swap flights once the roster is out and get options in there that you like?

Thanks!

[Twiglet1]

Originally Posted by norfolkungood

True. Unfortunately seems all our lords and masters want to reduce manning/ rest to the minimum to increase the productivity. Our lot would jump at the chance of 3 man. They tried it but as most of our departures are around midnight the FTLs didn’t quite allow it. We now do a large proportion of our LHs with 2 Second Officers as opposed to a 2 FOs. So the FO just gets the wrong rest and still has to be in the seat for landing! Notwithstanding our experience levels have dropped through the floor.....

I fear for all of us where this is all leading.....

Eventually the 2 Second Officers will get enough experience to be a FO.
The FO in the seat for the landing will (in theory) have a Captain in a better state of awake than himself.
What else?

[wiggy]

Originally Posted by aaa333

If the pay rise offer of 11% over three years were to go ahead would that apply to new joiners’ salaries too or only existing employees?
Do guys find they have much savings left over every month with the salary being as low as it is?

Being bottom of the seniority list is it not still possible to swap flights once the roster is out and get options in there that you like?

Thanks!

1. Payrise = change to the pay scales so everybody benefits.

2. Savings: Not a new joiner by any stretch of the imagination so can't help...and in any event guess that would depend on personal circumstances ...I'm sure somebody more helpful will be along in a minute.

3. Swopping: Certainly possible, FTLs allowing. Whether you are going to be able to get an option you like by getting rid an option you don't like will be down to "taste". Swopping mundane trips to generate days off you want (again FTLs allowing) but it might be a slightly tougher task trying to get rid of an unpopular destination/trip by expecting to be able swop it with something "tasty".

[CXKA]

Originally Posted by Twiglet1

Eventually the 2 Second Officers will get enough experience to be a FO.
The FO in the seat for the landing will (in theory) have a Captain in a better state of awake than himself.
What else?

I have done these 2 SO flights when I was an RQ FO at CX and its all very well having a nicely rested Captain but the FO is trying their hardest just to stay awake. Another cost cutting idea that infringes on the safety of the operation.

[cessnapete]

Originally Posted by CXKA

I have done these 2 SO flights when I was an RQ FO at CX and its all very well having a nicely rested Captain but the FO is trying their hardest just to stay awake. Another cost cutting idea that infringes on the safety of the operation.

BA don’t do “SOs”. On joining all copilots are fully trained and qualified as RHS for two crew ops. As Wiggy says many LH trips on 777/787/744/ and a few on A380 are operated with two crew. For a new LH FO, people are recruited with sufficient big jet hours to allow them, after the Type Rating to operate on two pilot trips immediately after Line Training as FO.

[CXKA]

Originally Posted by cessnapete

BA don’t do “SOs”. On joining all copilots are fully trained and qualified as RHS for two crew ops. As Wiggy says many LH trips on 777/787/744/ and a few on A380 are operated with two crew. For a new LH FO, people are recruited with sufficient big jet hours to allow them, after the Type Rating to operate on two pilot trips immediately after Line Training as FO.

I was speaking about CX, as for BA we have all seen the various docunet updates that mention cruise only pilots as an interim measure before being fully qualified to the line on LH fleets.

[aaa333]

Thanks for the reply Wiggy

does anyone have a copy of the current PP payscale that new joiners sign on that they can paste here?

Thanks!

[Flap33]

I seem to remember a notice earlier this year detailing training requirements of "cruise pilots" on 777 & 747 for new entrants. They did this on the A380 previously.

[cessnapete]

Originally Posted by CXKA

I was speaking about CX, as for BA we have all seen the various docunet updates that mention cruise only pilots as an interim measure before being fully qualified to the line on LH fleets.

Correct, an interim measure in times of high recruitment when there is not enough Line Training capacity. BA do not have a Policy of employing semi permanent Cruise only, partially trained SOs.

[Daddy Fantastic]

Is it true that if you join BA on the A320 based out of LGW you will come home every night with only possibly 1 or 2 lay overs a month?

As for LHR I heard you tend to do tours/trips for 3 or 4 days?

Im a 6000 hour pilot with 3000 plus jet hours so I do not know what kind of fleet they would offer me whether it be domestic or international.I have never flown wide body international but the thought of doing that kind of flying is not very appealing to me and from what I have been reading on junior new hires with JSS it just seems like a world of pain.

I ask because I am being interviewed by BA in 2 weeks time and if I get thru everything and get a job offer I would like to join on the A320 fleet but probably commute from Europe, most likely Spain where I would plan on living again.

So coming home every night would not work for me unless I paid for hotels which kind of defeats the purpose of commuting. I refuse to live in London with all that grime crime and slime as I have a wife and daughter and wont expose them to all that rubbish.

Any thoughts are most welcome.

[Enzo999]

Originally Posted by Daddy Fantastic

Is it true that if you join BA on the A320 based out of LGW you will come home every night with only possibly 1 or 2 lay overs a month?

As for LHR I heard you tend to do tours/trips for 3 or 4 days?

Im a 6000 hour pilot with 3000 plus jet hours so I do not know what kind of fleet they would offer me whether it be domestic or international.I have never flown wide body international but the thought of doing that kind of flying is not very appealing to me and from what I have been reading on junior new hires with JSS it just seems like a world of pain.

I ask because I am being interviewed by BA in 2 weeks time and if I get thru everything and get a job offer I would like to join on the A320 fleet but probably commute from Europe, most likely Spain where I would plan on living again.

So coming home every night would not work for me unless I paid for hotels which kind of defeats the purpose of commuting. I refuse to live in London with all that grime crime and slime as I have a wife and daughter and wont expose them to all that rubbish.

Any thoughts are most welcome.

There are other places to live than London! LGW get very few layovers 2 a month if your lucky. LHR many more. Lots of guys commute from LHR, but to be honest looks like a nightmare to me.

[Busdriver01]

Originally Posted by Daddy Fantastic

Is it true that if you join BA on the A320 based out of LGW you will come home every night with only possibly 1 or 2 lay overs a month?

As for LHR I heard you tend to do tours/trips for 3 or 4 days?

Im a 6000 hour pilot with 3000 plus jet hours so I do not know what kind of fleet they would offer me whether it be domestic or international.I have never flown wide body international but the thought of doing that kind of flying is not very appealing to me and from what I have been reading on junior new hires with JSS it just seems like a world of pain.

I ask because I am being interviewed by BA in 2 weeks time and if I get thru everything and get a job offer I would like to join on the A320 fleet but probably commute from Europe, most likely Spain where I would plan on living again.

So coming home every night would not work for me unless I paid for hotels which kind of defeats the purpose of commuting. I refuse to live in London with all that grime crime and slime as I have a wife and daughter and wont expose them to all that rubbish.

Any thoughts are most welcome.

honest opinion? It sounds like you’d be better off applying for a Spanish base with EZY. With those hours you’d be looking at a command within 2 years, no commuting, and the money is better. (Admittedly the spanish eJ contract could be better when compared to other countries but if you were going to be spending money commuting then it’d even out).

As for BA, from what I’ve heard you’re more likely to be offered lgw than lhr if they want you on the 320 as less people want to go there, but you can always ask if lhr is available. Bare in mind that with low seniority you’d be doing more single nightstops from lhr as from what friends have said the senior lot like to take the tours.