BA Direct Entry Pilot.
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The discussion on pay has been had time and time again and if you’re taking command in the first 3 4 or even 5 years agreed it’s not good enough, especially compared with the likes of EZY/RYR, who management seem so keen to compare us in other ways to.
However...taking early command is a conscious decision, made with all of the facts. With flight and duty pay included it is about 100k. That will continue upwards on a (yes long) 34 point pay scale, combined with a considerable pension pot projected from that early command I’d say you might be doing something wrong if you can’t plan to retire by 60.
However...taking early command is a conscious decision, made with all of the facts. With flight and duty pay included it is about 100k. That will continue upwards on a (yes long) 34 point pay scale, combined with a considerable pension pot projected from that early command I’d say you might be doing something wrong if you can’t plan to retire by 60.
Sugar coat what you want but it’s not only people who took ‘early’ commands that are paid less. Have a look at a 14 year BA 320 captain and he’ll be on less than what EZY paid me on the day I started ...
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I’m not sugar coating anything. I feel I’ve been fairly balanced. If the finances don’t add up, as you’ve done, simple, don’t join. For many it’s about a lot more than £, which in many respects BA does still offer. I joined when I was in my mid twenties and that’ll of course have a bearing on how you view things.
Going to bow out there as we’ve both agreed it’s just re hashing old ground. Wish you the best at EZY.
AIMINGHIGH, we know each other personally so happy to chat about things any time. If anyone else is interested in facts of BA SH, warts and all, from a LGW perspective, PM me.
Going to bow out there as we’ve both agreed it’s just re hashing old ground. Wish you the best at EZY.
AIMINGHIGH, we know each other personally so happy to chat about things any time. If anyone else is interested in facts of BA SH, warts and all, from a LGW perspective, PM me.
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To sum up many of the posts above:
BA is a very very long term bet.
If you are under about 35 years old then BA still has a lot to offer.
If you are over about 35 then think long and hard about your motivation to join BA and whether you really will be content to be a long haul FO for the rest of your career. 18-20 years is historically a reasonable estimate of the time to a long haul command, but anyone joining now is in behind a huge recruitment drive. A junior long haul command in your late 50s / early 60s is a daunting prospect, especially given the seniority gradient which has got considerably worse under JSS. If you want a short haul command then you are likely to have a more rewarding career at Easy or elsewhere.
BA is a very very long term bet.
If you are under about 35 years old then BA still has a lot to offer.
If you are over about 35 then think long and hard about your motivation to join BA and whether you really will be content to be a long haul FO for the rest of your career. 18-20 years is historically a reasonable estimate of the time to a long haul command, but anyone joining now is in behind a huge recruitment drive. A junior long haul command in your late 50s / early 60s is a daunting prospect, especially given the seniority gradient which has got considerably worse under JSS. If you want a short haul command then you are likely to have a more rewarding career at Easy or elsewhere.
Last edited by Pickled; 24th Feb 2019 at 19:57.
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Many thanks.
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I’ve been reading this thread with interest as it serves to sum up the situation in the UK presently in the airlines which generate the biggest career earnings. It seems to me these are limited to BA, VS, and the low-cost A320/737 operations which have quick commands or DEC.
I think a factor not discussed here is pension contributions.
The bigger your pension pot the sooner you can retire, or more desirably for most, accept the smaller income of going part-time.
The value of pension contributions markedly decreases with one’s age. Firstly, because contributions made later in life will be invested for less time before retirement, but also because the closer to retirement, the less risky investments one can afford to make.
For illustration (not reliable figures, not pension advice, do your own research)- consider £1000 invested at age 35 vs at age 50, with retirement planned at 60.
£1,000 over 25 years mainly in equities then into bonds/cash towards the end, let’s say returns 4% above inflation on average. So you hit 60 and that £1,000 is worth £2,666.
Your £1,000 at 50 is going to be straight into bonds/cash, so let’s say that returns 2% above inflation. It’s worth £1,219 when you reach 60.
The figures are speculative and generalised but the point is money saved earlier in life is far more valuable.
With these savings, the pilot who earns more earlier can afford to retire or go part-time sooner.
A question to consider is would you prefer to spend the end of your career at a lo-co dropped down to 50% having banked the cash already, or be on a 900/750hr BA/VS long haul roster for your whole time, with both having the same retirement outcome.
I think a factor not discussed here is pension contributions.
The bigger your pension pot the sooner you can retire, or more desirably for most, accept the smaller income of going part-time.
The value of pension contributions markedly decreases with one’s age. Firstly, because contributions made later in life will be invested for less time before retirement, but also because the closer to retirement, the less risky investments one can afford to make.
For illustration (not reliable figures, not pension advice, do your own research)- consider £1000 invested at age 35 vs at age 50, with retirement planned at 60.
£1,000 over 25 years mainly in equities then into bonds/cash towards the end, let’s say returns 4% above inflation on average. So you hit 60 and that £1,000 is worth £2,666.
Your £1,000 at 50 is going to be straight into bonds/cash, so let’s say that returns 2% above inflation. It’s worth £1,219 when you reach 60.
The figures are speculative and generalised but the point is money saved earlier in life is far more valuable.
With these savings, the pilot who earns more earlier can afford to retire or go part-time sooner.
A question to consider is would you prefer to spend the end of your career at a lo-co dropped down to 50% having banked the cash already, or be on a 900/750hr BA/VS long haul roster for your whole time, with both having the same retirement outcome.
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I’ve been reading this thread with interest as it serves to sum up the situation in the UK presently in the airlines which generate the biggest career earnings. It seems to me these are limited to BA, VS, and the low-cost A320/737 operations which have quick commands or DEC.
I think a factor not discussed here is pension contributions.
The bigger your pension pot the sooner you can retire, or more desirably for most, accept the smaller income of going part-time.
The value of pension contributions markedly decreases with one’s age. Firstly, because contributions made later in life will be invested for less time before retirement, but also because the closer to retirement, the less risky investments one can afford to make.
For illustration (not reliable figures, not pension advice, do your own research)- consider £1000 invested at age 35 vs at age 50, with retirement planned at 60.
£1,000 over 25 years mainly in equities then into bonds/cash towards the end, let’s say returns 4% above inflation on average. So you hit 60 and that £1,000 is worth £2,666.
Your £1,000 at 50 is going to be straight into bonds/cash, so let’s say that returns 2% above inflation. It’s worth £1,219 when you reach 60.
The figures are speculative and generalised but the point is money saved earlier in life is far more valuable.
With these savings, the pilot who earns more earlier can afford to retire or go part-time sooner.
A question to consider is would you prefer to spend the end of your career at a lo-co dropped down to 50% having banked the cash already, or be on a 900/750hr BA/VS long haul roster for your whole time, with both having the same retirement outcome.
I think a factor not discussed here is pension contributions.
The bigger your pension pot the sooner you can retire, or more desirably for most, accept the smaller income of going part-time.
The value of pension contributions markedly decreases with one’s age. Firstly, because contributions made later in life will be invested for less time before retirement, but also because the closer to retirement, the less risky investments one can afford to make.
For illustration (not reliable figures, not pension advice, do your own research)- consider £1000 invested at age 35 vs at age 50, with retirement planned at 60.
£1,000 over 25 years mainly in equities then into bonds/cash towards the end, let’s say returns 4% above inflation on average. So you hit 60 and that £1,000 is worth £2,666.
Your £1,000 at 50 is going to be straight into bonds/cash, so let’s say that returns 2% above inflation. It’s worth £1,219 when you reach 60.
The figures are speculative and generalised but the point is money saved earlier in life is far more valuable.
With these savings, the pilot who earns more earlier can afford to retire or go part-time sooner.
A question to consider is would you prefer to spend the end of your career at a lo-co dropped down to 50% having banked the cash already, or be on a 900/750hr BA/VS long haul roster for your whole time, with both having the same retirement outcome.
(7% of 108k = 7560, 15.1% of 58k = 8758)
Obviously you can top up the pension contributions yourself but perhaps slightly misleading to suggest that the pension will be bigger at some LoCos vs BA.
Cheers
EDIT: counter to my own argument to keep things equal... obviously there’s the mortgage to pay off too, which would clearly be cleared faster earning more at an earlier point in the career. Do the savings made here equate to the extra pension / higher end salary? Probably have to hire an accountant for that!
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Hello everyone,
I've just booked the first day assessment and after a read through the previous comments does anyone have any insight into the SHL verbal reasoning/Maths test or a good place to practice?
PMs are gratefully appreciated any any tips you care to share.
Thanks in advance.
I've just booked the first day assessment and after a read through the previous comments does anyone have any insight into the SHL verbal reasoning/Maths test or a good place to practice?
PMs are gratefully appreciated any any tips you care to share.
Thanks in advance.
Join Date: Jul 2016
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Are you going to be full time at pp20+ when the money finally gets good? I certainly cant imagine after 20 years I'll even be medically able to do it. Last summer was the hardest Ive ever been worked and worst I've ever felt. Cant see it getting any easier.
Join Date: Jan 2014
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Out of curiosity, can anyone give figures for how much they spend on commuting per month? Both SH and LH, just as an idea. I've done my sums and want to see just how close or far off the mark I am.
Cheers,
RossBaku
Cheers,
RossBaku
If you are just looking at the airfares then hunterboy’s figures sound reasonable...
OTOH if you start factoring in transport and perhaps parking costs at the “home” end, plus, perhaps (being mindful of BAs views on “commuting” ) adding in some hotel/B&B costs at the LHR end into the mix I can how you could start getting up towards the sort numbers eckard has come with.
OTOH if you start factoring in transport and perhaps parking costs at the “home” end, plus, perhaps (being mindful of BAs views on “commuting” ) adding in some hotel/B&B costs at the LHR end into the mix I can how you could start getting up towards the sort numbers eckard has come with.
Sorry; should have been more clear. As wiggy says I have included accommodation as well as transportation. Hotlines are generally 90EUR return but sometimes more. Rail return to CDG about 36EUR. Accommodation between 30 and 80 depending on how posh I want to be. Say 50 average. So each return commute is about 180EUR. Multiply by 3, 4 or 5 gives 540, 720 or 900EUR. I try to create back-to-back trips if I can.
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My Short Haul commute which involved flight to Gatwick and National Express Coach to Heathrow (including hotels at LHR) used to average out at circa £600pcm. Surprises me greatly that a long haul commute could be in excess of that figure or even close to it given the greater requirement for nights on the Bath Road prior to an early duty on SH plus daytrips in a block.
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For any potential joiners, remember there are thousands of BA pilots that do not post on this forum. That’s not to say they are all 100% happy but despite the fall in T’s & C’s of recent years many still find it to be one of the best jobs in the country. It’s all circumstance dependant. We’ve a lot to fight to maintain and try to get back in some cases, but people above making out that Ryanair of all places is now the better option is (for the vast majority) frankly nonsense.
I’ve only been in a few years and it’s not perfect, but generally I’m happy, I have taken an early command, live close to my home base (Sussex flying club), fly about 650-700 hours a year and spend a lot of time with my young family. I have a huge variety of options available to me should my circumstances change.
Come in with your eyes open and remember you’re joining a seniority airline towards the later end of a recruitment bulge, but don’t base your decision entirely on the unbalanced views above.
I’ve only been in a few years and it’s not perfect, but generally I’m happy, I have taken an early command, live close to my home base (Sussex flying club), fly about 650-700 hours a year and spend a lot of time with my young family. I have a huge variety of options available to me should my circumstances change.
Come in with your eyes open and remember you’re joining a seniority airline towards the later end of a recruitment bulge, but don’t base your decision entirely on the unbalanced views above.
How are the “above” posts unbalanced ? The poster has worked for both BA and Ryanair. I suspect you haven’t but I could be wrong.