Have around 300 pilots left RYR lately?
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With no career structure there will always be a high attrition rate at Ryanair. That rate will go up and down with the demands of the market but when it gets high the contagious effect can make it crippling.
There isn't any Pilot shortage but when Pilots leave faster than they can be replaced the effects are much worse than prolonged strike action.
There isn't any Pilot shortage but when Pilots leave faster than they can be replaced the effects are much worse than prolonged strike action.
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Trying to ignore the safety/experience debate, I reiterate my last question:
- does anyone think there will be a change of policy in RYR, so that experienced non-TR'd F/Os will be taken on?
If I get to age 40 and I'm still flying TP's, I'm going to jack in flying.
- does anyone think there will be a change of policy in RYR, so that experienced non-TR'd F/Os will be taken on?
If I get to age 40 and I'm still flying TP's, I'm going to jack in flying.
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Turboprop? forget it no chance.
The smallest jet of which they have hired DEC from in the past was a BA146 and that was years ago.
The fact that they now mention 20000 kg as the bottom limit means a lot
What they fail to understand is that it is much cheaper to keep the good crew you have than to find new ones( and typerated B737 NG guys are not on the market with so many companies hiring)
If they would start giving people the base they want instead of sending you were you dont want that would keep a a lot of captains in the company.
Not being with your family is a big thing.
As always my humblest of opinions the above
The smallest jet of which they have hired DEC from in the past was a BA146 and that was years ago.
The fact that they now mention 20000 kg as the bottom limit means a lot
What they fail to understand is that it is much cheaper to keep the good crew you have than to find new ones( and typerated B737 NG guys are not on the market with so many companies hiring)
If they would start giving people the base they want instead of sending you were you dont want that would keep a a lot of captains in the company.
Not being with your family is a big thing.
As always my humblest of opinions the above
Last edited by space pig; 6th Jun 2014 at 20:27.
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Yes, just seen that ad.
And as you said: looks like it- Turboprop: no chance.
If I could go back to my 23 year old self, I'd tell him to save his £48,000 that he spent on a modular course and go and buy a house. Do it up, sell it on. Repeat.
I'd own- and fly- my own Global Express by now.
And as you said: looks like it- Turboprop: no chance.
If I could go back to my 23 year old self, I'd tell him to save his £48,000 that he spent on a modular course and go and buy a house. Do it up, sell it on. Repeat.
I'd own- and fly- my own Global Express by now.
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We have been doing 100 a month throughout the winter and last summer and you do not need to be a mathematician to figure out that a huge part of the captains will be running out of Yearly limits soon and the whole machine comes to a grinding halt.
Does RYR still have this dubious mathematical shenanigan that allows them to zero hours at 1 April? That was an inexplicable IAA allowance that meant one could do well over 900hrs in a 12 month period. Under EASA is that still possible? Absurd if so.
Does RYR still have this dubious mathematical shenanigan that allows them to zero hours at 1 April? That was an inexplicable IAA allowance that meant one could do well over 900hrs in a 12 month period. Under EASA is that still possible? Absurd if so.
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That zeroing of annual flight hours is now EUOps and replaced the JAROps 900 in 365, so applies across all of Europe, as I understand it.
First Officers are also doing 100 hours per 28 days now, as of the last couple of months, so it won't just be Captains they'll run out of in the winter.
First Officers are also doing 100 hours per 28 days now, as of the last couple of months, so it won't just be Captains they'll run out of in the winter.
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A.S. I'm out of it now, but are you saying it is now legal to fly >900hrs in 365? Ouch! Short haul that is.
Last edited by RAT 5; 25th May 2014 at 13:01.
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According to the IAA inspector I had a chat with, yes Rat, as long as the total drops below 900 on the one nominated day of the year, the rest of the time you can have significantly over 900. I'm regularly seeing 920-930/365, and boy am I feeling it!
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Is this a case of RYR not only having changed the flying experience for the pax; not only having changed the general T's & C's for the air crew, but now effected a change, for the worse, in the FTL's of the whole of EU? If true, truly amazing. Or is this just an IAA interpretation of EASA regs? They too seem very malleable when needed.
The tail may truly be wagging the dog. The decline in overall T's & C's, including a severe worsening in average working days over the past 20 years, is scary to behold. Where will it end? Ever more productivity and destroyed family life for less reward. It has often been countered with the argument that the big bucks allowed a disruptive life with no solid social foundation and regular sleep patterns. Not any more. The big bucks have disappeared and the shackles have become tighter. To predict the future is always difficult, but it doesn't look too rosy for the vast majority of wannabes. Good luck to them, and save up for the alimony instead of the pension.
The tail may truly be wagging the dog. The decline in overall T's & C's, including a severe worsening in average working days over the past 20 years, is scary to behold. Where will it end? Ever more productivity and destroyed family life for less reward. It has often been countered with the argument that the big bucks allowed a disruptive life with no solid social foundation and regular sleep patterns. Not any more. The big bucks have disappeared and the shackles have become tighter. To predict the future is always difficult, but it doesn't look too rosy for the vast majority of wannabes. Good luck to them, and save up for the alimony instead of the pension.
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Yep, my son likes aircraft and loved his flying lesson, but knows full well not to even consider this as a career! It does make me smile reading some of the issues on the legacy airline threads, but it's all relative. I suspect there are plenty of folk in Asian or even in EU regional companies that would gladly take my Ts and Cs as a big step up from what they contend with. That doesn't make it right - it just means the whole industry is eating itself from the inside.
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According to the latest ad in flightglobal,: DIRECT ENTRY CAPTAINS AND FIRST OFFICERS with Ryanair Ltd | 1401394597
it looks like Ryanair is starting to take control themselves regarding the recruiting as Mcginley/Brookfield are no longer mentioned but solely Ryanair LTD.
Could it be that the 300 pilots that left are on the low side of the estimates and immidiate action is required as the contracters are not doing a good enough job to recruit ?
Or is this to offer a Ryanair contract with better T and C"s(tax and social sec payed) as a new strategy to attract new pilots.
just my humble opinion for what it's worth
it looks like Ryanair is starting to take control themselves regarding the recruiting as Mcginley/Brookfield are no longer mentioned but solely Ryanair LTD.
Could it be that the 300 pilots that left are on the low side of the estimates and immidiate action is required as the contracters are not doing a good enough job to recruit ?
Or is this to offer a Ryanair contract with better T and C"s(tax and social sec payed) as a new strategy to attract new pilots.
just my humble opinion for what it's worth
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I'm always baffled by Ryanair pilots agreeing to work days off 'because they need the money', when most of them are maxed out on hours anyway. Or maybe doing unpaid standbys is more fun than days off, I'm not sure.
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The reason that Ryanair are recruiting directly is simply that the current use of McGinley and Brookfield is unsustainable it is the exploitation of a loophole that goes against the requirements of the law in most countries, those countries are now wise to the ryanair games.
Secondly they realize that they need Pilots to stay and that working for McGinley is not in anybody's mind a long term career.
I don't think they have seen anything yet, the exodus will be in the coming 2 years. Simply because of a recruitment surge in China and the m.e.
Secondly they realize that they need Pilots to stay and that working for McGinley is not in anybody's mind a long term career.
I don't think they have seen anything yet, the exodus will be in the coming 2 years. Simply because of a recruitment surge in China and the m.e.
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I think we can close this thread now, as the answer is clearly YES!
According to the recruitment banners at the top of this webpage.
It's is both ironic and indeed very sad, that the few (but important) things that made Pilots (including me) move on, were completely within Ryanair managements' ability (?) to fix, at little or no cost. Unfortunately, their unbelievably stupid, arrogant and dictatorial way of running things, has led to this current situation, which sees them now losing money by cancelling flights and wet leasing crews to fly their summer routes, as well as being forced to recruit DEC/DEFO (positive for some) instead of making money from taking more Cadets.
I truly hope that lessons are learnt, and there is some positive outcome for Ryanair Pilots and the industry T&C's as a whole. I wouldn't hold my breath though!
All in my own very humble opinion of course.
According to the recruitment banners at the top of this webpage.
It's is both ironic and indeed very sad, that the few (but important) things that made Pilots (including me) move on, were completely within Ryanair managements' ability (?) to fix, at little or no cost. Unfortunately, their unbelievably stupid, arrogant and dictatorial way of running things, has led to this current situation, which sees them now losing money by cancelling flights and wet leasing crews to fly their summer routes, as well as being forced to recruit DEC/DEFO (positive for some) instead of making money from taking more Cadets.
I truly hope that lessons are learnt, and there is some positive outcome for Ryanair Pilots and the industry T&C's as a whole. I wouldn't hold my breath though!
All in my own very humble opinion of course.
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Think about it, Jellyfish - an employed captain will get a day off payment of £250net plus the flight pay. They'll do the same hours over the month, and thus the final flight pay will be the same, but they get the day off payments too. For contractors, that doesn't apply, and so the captains tend to refuse. Contract FOs historically would accept because if they didn't come in, they'd lose out on pay and they were only flying c600 hours a year and needed to generate as much extra as possible. That's very different at the moment.
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There's also the possibility of successfully bargain days off when you need them, by working one day off when they need You. That can only be a good sign for pilots. I personally don't do off days, not only am I always busy but I try to see it as an act for a greater good. But despite best effort a big part of the workforce act in their own self interest only, and in many cases I cannot really blame them.
