Have around 300 pilots left RYR lately?
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: UK
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There is a lot of noise about base transfers, with surveys being conducted to the effect, but I am far from convinced that it's a genuine effort to improve morale rather than a smoke screen. I know a lot of people unhappy with their bases who want to go somewhere with vacancies but their transfers are being refused. I hope it's not just a hollow masquerade. As for the number of 500 resignations, it would not surprise me if the number is even higher. I have also heard that the rostering manager has gone to NAS, though I have only heard that from one source.
Last edited by Aluminium shuffler; 29th Mar 2014 at 21:20.
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: UK
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sounds likely - rated and desperate, so cheap on training and cheaper than the RYR guys on pay, if the agencies play dirty. Then again, the agencies may want to keep the contracts attractive to all and the NAS union is fairly active...
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: 60 north
Age: 59
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Rumor confirmed
Just floated arround a bit lately, met some old aquaintans.
Here is what is happening:
Northeren base with 5 aircraft lost 27 pilot the last year to Norwegian and Sas and diverse.
Bergamo exodus to Norwegian or anyone to awoid jail.
Madrid base desimated due to Norwegian Mad base plus other Spanish bases.
400 cadets planed this year, emergency plan 650 cadets executed.
Main rostering mann left for Norwegian.
Linetrainers leaving,,,,,
New TREs makining partial passes left right and senter due to incompetensy,
FlyDubai wetlease due to lack of aircraft.
Looking forward to a very hot summer.
United We Stand
Here is what is happening:
Northeren base with 5 aircraft lost 27 pilot the last year to Norwegian and Sas and diverse.
Bergamo exodus to Norwegian or anyone to awoid jail.
Madrid base desimated due to Norwegian Mad base plus other Spanish bases.
400 cadets planed this year, emergency plan 650 cadets executed.
Main rostering mann left for Norwegian.
Linetrainers leaving,,,,,
New TREs makining partial passes left right and senter due to incompetensy,
FlyDubai wetlease due to lack of aircraft.
Looking forward to a very hot summer.
United We Stand
? 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: atlanta georgia
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I keep reading about the quality of training at Ryanair.What makes it so good.Sorry if it is obvious but I'm over on the other side of the pond and am not very familiar with what goes on at Ryanair only what I read here.We use AQP at my company and it seems to be much better than the old fashioned PC.
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Ireland
Age: 44
Posts: 101
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Have around 300 pilots left RYR lately?
Emergency plan of 650 cadets executed? What does that even mean?! That was the plan from over a year ago. 1300 cadets over the next three Is the plan...
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: ...............
Posts: 110
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ryanair's training department reputation comes mainly from other airlines. As Ryanair is effectively most European pilots first jet job. This year they will take 400 cadets ( not 650) and train them. These cadets have on average 160 hours in their logbook when the join Ryanair. Six months later the should be in the RHS as fully operational FO's. It's impressive what's more impressive is the training department is actually run by pilots with none of O'Learys oppressive henchmen at the helm ....yet. These pilots will on average last up to five years in RYR before waking up and realising that they have no future and moving on. The airlines who take these guys have invariably come back for more. Anyone who can put up with RYR's basing/annual leave/ taxation stays but it is increasingly a fewer number.
The problem this year is that a) the fleet is 7 hulls down after leased aircraft were returned b) Norweigan have decimated the FO's that were due to be upgraded to Captains this summer. The hulls have been replaced by wet/dry leasing. The captain shortage has been solved by allowing former employee's to return ( previously you were ' never' allowed back ) .....oh wait how many former inmates are filling the OCC courses ...ZERO. Yep two OCC courses planned but not one former employee has rushed to Ryanair's aid.
Ultimately RYR will just trim the schedule to suit the crewing resources available as the did in 2012 when the Olympics were on. But now RYR are trying to play catch up with other airlines but with a tarnished brand image . One wonders after two profit warnings how much longer the shareholders will tolerate "deckchairs on the Titanic "
Finally as of the 1st of March the rumour was approx 200 resignations in the system ...that covers a 5 month period so the 500 maybe a slight exaggeration
The problem this year is that a) the fleet is 7 hulls down after leased aircraft were returned b) Norweigan have decimated the FO's that were due to be upgraded to Captains this summer. The hulls have been replaced by wet/dry leasing. The captain shortage has been solved by allowing former employee's to return ( previously you were ' never' allowed back ) .....oh wait how many former inmates are filling the OCC courses ...ZERO. Yep two OCC courses planned but not one former employee has rushed to Ryanair's aid.
Ultimately RYR will just trim the schedule to suit the crewing resources available as the did in 2012 when the Olympics were on. But now RYR are trying to play catch up with other airlines but with a tarnished brand image . One wonders after two profit warnings how much longer the shareholders will tolerate "deckchairs on the Titanic "
Finally as of the 1st of March the rumour was approx 200 resignations in the system ...that covers a 5 month period so the 500 maybe a slight exaggeration
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: 60 north
Age: 59
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Donidarko
Sir, You are closer to Dublin then I, and You have some good points.
But , there were 200 in the system leaving as of 1march that represents 5 months? Brookfilders have 3 months notice Ryr the same Storm is just a few and shurley 3 months.
So out with your calculator,,,
This is the known, the unknowns are the on that is presently sick ( on a Norwegian, Sas etc Occ) waiting for his march paycheck.
Now, if all the hiering European airlines had any brains, they would all start a few extra occ cources, get a few Line trainers from Ryr and , voila!
The need is at least 650 cadets, to replace the senior f/o leaving, and upgrading.
That is a Head of Trainings dream, the thing with dreams are there are two kinds : Wet and Nightmares,,!?
But he can cope, he has as You said a few good men, and a close to perfect program for the circumstances. And you can always go of motion and terminate a student .
The lintrainer Boss , now he has a close to impossible task.
Good Sop, linetraining documents and strict progress criteria for cadets and Captain upgrade linetraining.
BUT, good old linetrainers retiering, many getting burnt out, new ones making basic errors, nitpicking on non-critical items etc.
But ,lets hope You are right , only 400 cadets and a handfull of occ direct Capts.
Then we will all fly to max this summer.
Anyway think of Yourself fellow Aviators hire a RYR pilot, You will have a frind for life and industy conditions may stop deteriorating.?
But , there were 200 in the system leaving as of 1march that represents 5 months? Brookfilders have 3 months notice Ryr the same Storm is just a few and shurley 3 months.
So out with your calculator,,,
This is the known, the unknowns are the on that is presently sick ( on a Norwegian, Sas etc Occ) waiting for his march paycheck.
Now, if all the hiering European airlines had any brains, they would all start a few extra occ cources, get a few Line trainers from Ryr and , voila!
The need is at least 650 cadets, to replace the senior f/o leaving, and upgrading.
That is a Head of Trainings dream, the thing with dreams are there are two kinds : Wet and Nightmares,,!?
But he can cope, he has as You said a few good men, and a close to perfect program for the circumstances. And you can always go of motion and terminate a student .
The lintrainer Boss , now he has a close to impossible task.
Good Sop, linetraining documents and strict progress criteria for cadets and Captain upgrade linetraining.
BUT, good old linetrainers retiering, many getting burnt out, new ones making basic errors, nitpicking on non-critical items etc.
But ,lets hope You are right , only 400 cadets and a handfull of occ direct Capts.
Then we will all fly to max this summer.
Anyway think of Yourself fellow Aviators hire a RYR pilot, You will have a frind for life and industy conditions may stop deteriorating.?
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Gatwick
Posts: 452
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Norwegian are also losing pilots
NAS have seen more resignations than they would ideally like, the reasons are very varied and not the same as Ryanair, but churn is churn whatever the reason!!
SAS have taken a quite a few, obviously getting back to live in Scandinavia is a priority for many, but also issues such as temp contract, agency employment, lack of pension all have an impact, NAS unlike FR doesn't have the training capacity to support the level of resignations and expansion at the same time.
SAS have taken a quite a few, obviously getting back to live in Scandinavia is a priority for many, but also issues such as temp contract, agency employment, lack of pension all have an impact, NAS unlike FR doesn't have the training capacity to support the level of resignations and expansion at the same time.
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: last time I looked I was still here.
Posts: 4,507
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
NAS unlike FR doesn't have the training capacity to support the level of resignations and expansion at the same time.
I wonder. If you do some maths and calculate the number of sim hours required for TQ courses, upgrades, OPC/LPC's, RST's etc. does RYR have enough sim space for their program? That is now. What about the increase necessary as the fleet expands? It is a proven ratio. Then there is the ratio of SFI/TRI/LTC/TRE's per a/c. That is also a proven historical ratio. Have they and will they have enough? You can't be in the sim and the cockpit at the same time. The need for safety F/O's during LT is another parameter in the mix. I suspect sim time might be a limiting one.
Regarding the number leaving: an annual loss of 10% is quite common. This is made up of medical, retirement, quitting. I suspect in large stable airlines retirement is the largest part. It is predictable and manageable. It's not a surprise. I suspect the leavers are the majority at RYR and this is a surprise and unpredictable. The flexibility of the contractor scheme allows you to be over crewed at no cost. However, the resultant loss of expected earnings increases the rush to leave for those F/O's who have large debts and lower income. You can't have it both ways. It is a vicious circle towards a downward spiral that will bite you in the backside.
I wonder. If you do some maths and calculate the number of sim hours required for TQ courses, upgrades, OPC/LPC's, RST's etc. does RYR have enough sim space for their program? That is now. What about the increase necessary as the fleet expands? It is a proven ratio. Then there is the ratio of SFI/TRI/LTC/TRE's per a/c. That is also a proven historical ratio. Have they and will they have enough? You can't be in the sim and the cockpit at the same time. The need for safety F/O's during LT is another parameter in the mix. I suspect sim time might be a limiting one.
Regarding the number leaving: an annual loss of 10% is quite common. This is made up of medical, retirement, quitting. I suspect in large stable airlines retirement is the largest part. It is predictable and manageable. It's not a surprise. I suspect the leavers are the majority at RYR and this is a surprise and unpredictable. The flexibility of the contractor scheme allows you to be over crewed at no cost. However, the resultant loss of expected earnings increases the rush to leave for those F/O's who have large debts and lower income. You can't have it both ways. It is a vicious circle towards a downward spiral that will bite you in the backside.
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: dublin
Age: 64
Posts: 394
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Irish Aviation Authority IAA
For the record IAA are not state funded at all, they make good annual profits from all the Airlines, and yes we are cash strapped for sure, but come on fiscal advice from California ? Jaysus Mary and Joeseph you are kidding ?IAA are competent and the results are evident in a very sound aviation environment here.
Last edited by Hangar6; 2nd Apr 2014 at 21:11.
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: 60 north
Age: 59
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Summer schedule is ON.
Fellow Aviators.
April has started, fools day has passed.
Somone claimed the Irish Aviaton Authority are self sponsored and Competent.
This is news, indeed.
Candler:
Do not try to understand EU standards from a logical standpoint. If You do understand it most likely FAA will suspend Your medical! But do take note , the canser spreads quick. Ps I am an old faa instructor what does AQP vs PC entail?
Somone in the know mentioned that all is well , 1300 new the next 3 years so a few more then 400 this year is ok!
Son its all about timing. Evenly distributed ,OK.
Here is my new bet.: A total of 850 pilot shall leave Ryr this calander year !
Anyone.
Today another jumpseating Scandinavian fo told me he is gone for SAS, lovely!
Lastley.
Wondering about Norwegians capasity for training.
They may be in for a nasty surprice , if they do not start treating pilots good.
As I can see it they have no clue, just cherry picking RYR.
April has started, fools day has passed.
Somone claimed the Irish Aviaton Authority are self sponsored and Competent.
This is news, indeed.
Candler:
Do not try to understand EU standards from a logical standpoint. If You do understand it most likely FAA will suspend Your medical! But do take note , the canser spreads quick. Ps I am an old faa instructor what does AQP vs PC entail?
Somone in the know mentioned that all is well , 1300 new the next 3 years so a few more then 400 this year is ok!
Son its all about timing. Evenly distributed ,OK.
Here is my new bet.: A total of 850 pilot shall leave Ryr this calander year !
Anyone.
Today another jumpseating Scandinavian fo told me he is gone for SAS, lovely!
Lastley.
Wondering about Norwegians capasity for training.
They may be in for a nasty surprice , if they do not start treating pilots good.
As I can see it they have no clue, just cherry picking RYR.
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: atlanta georgia
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Blusdup
AQP or Advanced qualification program with my company is a four day event.The first two days are ground school and days three and four are in the sim.day three is MV or manouvers validation basically stalls steep turns v1 cuts single engine app etc.It is training and is basically what the old PC was.day four is the checking portion of the whole event it is scenario based training.you are given a flight for example from Memphis to la guardia with a set number of events that will happen ie re route last minute sid or runway change then something happens in flight before a crossing restriction etc.much more relaxed.It is very strictly scripted so they cannot mess with you.on the whole it is a much more enjoyable experience
AQP or Advanced qualification program with my company is a four day event.The first two days are ground school and days three and four are in the sim.day three is MV or manouvers validation basically stalls steep turns v1 cuts single engine app etc.It is training and is basically what the old PC was.day four is the checking portion of the whole event it is scenario based training.you are given a flight for example from Memphis to la guardia with a set number of events that will happen ie re route last minute sid or runway change then something happens in flight before a crossing restriction etc.much more relaxed.It is very strictly scripted so they cannot mess with you.on the whole it is a much more enjoyable experience
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: FL450
Posts: 314
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This thread is going absolutely off topic, and to be honest I find the free use of the phrase "cash strapped Irish Government" insulting. This is totally off topic!!!! This is an aviation based site, lets keep it that way Polax 52!!